Spooky Bikes
10-19-09, 12:30 PM
#52
Senior Member
We use seamless Candadian mined and draw Alcoa 6061 tubing that is drawn, butted, swaged and squished to our specifications, in Portland Oregon at Sapa, and in a "top secret" location on the Connecticut coast.
Our frames are light because they are compact and aggressively butted. Wall thickness is very thick in the flex zones. I have the tube specs here for a Caad9(I actually own the rights to the CAAD 2-8 tubesets, as well as all Cannondale tubes before 2007). Eric Herting, Eastons tubing designer from 1992 until they effectively left the bike bussiness in 2007 is a business acquaintance of mine. His brother Chris, of 3D racing built our very first frames back in 1994, and his former partner at yeti, Frank The Welder is basically my kooky uncle, and the person I learned just about everything I know about frame building, fixturing and design from back in 1997 when I started spending summers working in our factory that was in Danbury, Ct at the time.
We KNOW aluminum as well as any company in the world. Maybe better. People involved in the design of our frames, and most definitely those who have influenced it most and some of the fabricators have a longer history of working with aggressively butted aluminum tubing (in both 7005 and 6061) than anyone else in the world. They all prefer, hands down, 6061. 7005 on paper has benefits, but in the real world of mid to high volume manufacturing it has none. It's still my go-to material for custom frames due to easier post-weld aging.
If the Caad9 was built with the same slope as a Skeletor, it would be about the same weight. It'd be too damn stiff though. Modern
"ultrastiff" bikes are ultra ****ty, as far as I am concerned. We designed these frames to ride like Ritchey Logic tubed Tange Steel bikes from the mid 90's. Those are about the best riding tubesets ever as far as I am concerned, and I constantly scour Japan for more for my personal bikes. Weight was not even a design parameter with these bikes. Ride quality, manufacturability and durability were paramount.
Ignore that ****ty website. It's some stupid e-commerce shell that a previous bussiness partner wanted, and I should be launching a fresh website in a week or so.
Our warranty policy is thus:
If your frame breaks, and it's our fault, you will have a new frame, free, in 3 days.
If you break your frame, you'll have a new frame for $400+ shipping of your choice.
The only tubes we do significant forming on are the Seatstays (for clearance and some vertical stiffness), and the Toptube, which is domed at the headtube end for increased cross section area, ovalized at the seatube for better weld area and a little flex, and a Squish back from the headtube dome for a scooch more lateral stiffness and a "flex zone" for stress relief.
Design bicycle tubes isn't rocket science dude... Neither is building good bikes.
This is America. We've been building cool **** since cool **** was invented.
As far as an "engineering staff" it's a moot point. Unless an Engineer is over the age of 35 in this country, they know about as much about design and manufacturing as your average 14 year old on the Internet. There are some rare exceptions. 3 of them work for me. For free. Because we make the stuff they want to ride.
So get off the internet, and go ride bikes. That's what I'm doing. Right now.
Our frames are light because they are compact and aggressively butted. Wall thickness is very thick in the flex zones. I have the tube specs here for a Caad9(I actually own the rights to the CAAD 2-8 tubesets, as well as all Cannondale tubes before 2007). Eric Herting, Eastons tubing designer from 1992 until they effectively left the bike bussiness in 2007 is a business acquaintance of mine. His brother Chris, of 3D racing built our very first frames back in 1994, and his former partner at yeti, Frank The Welder is basically my kooky uncle, and the person I learned just about everything I know about frame building, fixturing and design from back in 1997 when I started spending summers working in our factory that was in Danbury, Ct at the time.
We KNOW aluminum as well as any company in the world. Maybe better. People involved in the design of our frames, and most definitely those who have influenced it most and some of the fabricators have a longer history of working with aggressively butted aluminum tubing (in both 7005 and 6061) than anyone else in the world. They all prefer, hands down, 6061. 7005 on paper has benefits, but in the real world of mid to high volume manufacturing it has none. It's still my go-to material for custom frames due to easier post-weld aging.
If the Caad9 was built with the same slope as a Skeletor, it would be about the same weight. It'd be too damn stiff though. Modern
"ultrastiff" bikes are ultra ****ty, as far as I am concerned. We designed these frames to ride like Ritchey Logic tubed Tange Steel bikes from the mid 90's. Those are about the best riding tubesets ever as far as I am concerned, and I constantly scour Japan for more for my personal bikes. Weight was not even a design parameter with these bikes. Ride quality, manufacturability and durability were paramount.
Ignore that ****ty website. It's some stupid e-commerce shell that a previous bussiness partner wanted, and I should be launching a fresh website in a week or so.
Our warranty policy is thus:
If your frame breaks, and it's our fault, you will have a new frame, free, in 3 days.
If you break your frame, you'll have a new frame for $400+ shipping of your choice.
The only tubes we do significant forming on are the Seatstays (for clearance and some vertical stiffness), and the Toptube, which is domed at the headtube end for increased cross section area, ovalized at the seatube for better weld area and a little flex, and a Squish back from the headtube dome for a scooch more lateral stiffness and a "flex zone" for stress relief.
Design bicycle tubes isn't rocket science dude... Neither is building good bikes.
This is America. We've been building cool **** since cool **** was invented.
As far as an "engineering staff" it's a moot point. Unless an Engineer is over the age of 35 in this country, they know about as much about design and manufacturing as your average 14 year old on the Internet. There are some rare exceptions. 3 of them work for me. For free. Because we make the stuff they want to ride.
So get off the internet, and go ride bikes. That's what I'm doing. Right now.
Thanks.
10-19-09, 01:06 PM
#53
VeloSIRraptor
Thread Starter
The condensed version:There are a bunch of interesting bits in there -
I'm looking forward to the new website - let us know when it is up and going?
Cannondale tubes
Easton stuff
Yeti stuff
"mined and draw(n) Alcoa 6061 tubing that is drawn, butted, swaged and squished to our specifications"
I've never ridden anything other than aluminum (well, not seriously enough to really know it) so I'm cool with the way it feels - but I'd be okay with something that rides smoother than my low end Allez frame. I'm looking forward to the new website - let us know when it is up and going?
10-19-09, 01:55 PM
#54
Wheelsuck
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10-19-09, 02:41 PM
#56
Batüwü Creakcreak
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When I had met mickey, he had talked about owning the rights to the CAAD 2-8 tubesets, and joked about making rebadged CAAD whatevers for *****s and giggles.
Yo mick, does cannondale have to pay you for making the caad 8's again?
Also, my random ass busted specialized cross frame is in pictures on your site. I thought that was funny.
I really want a spooky. I'd buy the 54 sram build you have up for sale, but the steerer's too short and I'm too broke. Damn.
PS: Folks, that post is so mickey, it's hilarious. Dude makes me laugh so hard all while teaching me a little something. Okay a lot of something and even more of nothing. Just sayin'.
Yo mick, does cannondale have to pay you for making the caad 8's again?
Also, my random ass busted specialized cross frame is in pictures on your site. I thought that was funny.
I really want a spooky. I'd buy the 54 sram build you have up for sale, but the steerer's too short and I'm too broke. Damn.
PS: Folks, that post is so mickey, it's hilarious. Dude makes me laugh so hard all while teaching me a little something. Okay a lot of something and even more of nothing. Just sayin'.
10-19-09, 03:15 PM
#58
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The dude = opinionated, dedicated, and uncompromising.
Come next year he will be able to say he sells the only made in the usa CAADs. Hm.......
Come next year he will be able to say he sells the only made in the usa CAADs. Hm.......
10-19-09, 03:51 PM
#59
VeloSIRraptor
Thread Starter
10-19-09, 04:00 PM
#60
Senior Member
This thread and other stuff I have read has basically sold me on a spooky for my next bike. If only I had the money to build up a skeletor w/ rival. Damn.
10-19-09, 04:08 PM
#61
VeloSIRraptor
Thread Starter
1. Do a few year's worth groveling with the parents/raiding student loans (I recall you are in school, right?)
2. Engage in questionable accounting practices with your budget
3. Buy it
10-19-09, 05:33 PM
#62
Senior Member
10-19-09, 06:27 PM
#63
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I did a short test ride on a spooky, but from a price to performance ratio, the team deals can't be beat. Period.
Maybe when I come into more money ala 2., I'll come back to one. Mickey's the man, and his bikes are good. I'd like to support him. Having met him and seeing him in his element, the purchase would be accompanied by a nice fuzzy feeling.
I think I'm going to be at maybe around 30k, which isn't terrible considering my school's sticker price is 50k. Thank you financial aid and scholarships. I'm hoping to go to med school though. That's going to be fun for the pockets.
Last edited by ridethecliche; 10-19-09 at 06:36 PM.
10-19-09, 08:30 PM
#64
VeloSIRraptor
Thread Starter
RTC - I agree, team deals can't be beat. My team is sponsored by Raleigh (hometown company) and may or may not be getting deals on Salsa (no straight answer so far)... while Raleigh's frames and specs are fantastic, and the prices are cheaper than a lot of other manufacturers, ... I still want a Spooky.
someday when I'm not a.) broke and b.) penniless I'm going to get a spooky - but I'm with you, it may not be immediately 'cause I'm both.
someday when I'm not a.) broke and b.) penniless I'm going to get a spooky - but I'm with you, it may not be immediately 'cause I'm both.
10-19-09, 09:23 PM
#65
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I thought about this while riding today and chuckled to myself.
Engineers are notoriously egotistical, and the ones in aerospace are the worst of the lot. Well, rocket scientist, you just got taken to school by a bike mechanic. Bummer.
Engineers are notoriously egotistical, and the ones in aerospace are the worst of the lot. Well, rocket scientist, you just got taken to school by a bike mechanic. Bummer.
10-19-09, 10:41 PM
#66
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I lolled.
Mickey's no ordinary bike mechanic. He charges $.02 for his thoughts.
Plus, he's totally rad and badass. For real.
Mickey's no ordinary bike mechanic. He charges $.02 for his thoughts.
Plus, he's totally rad and badass. For real.
10-20-09, 09:16 AM
#67
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This post pushed me over the edge...ordered my skeletor today. Mickey had been super helpful and even is indulging some extra options for me for helping to mount split fenders on the frame.
10-20-09, 11:09 AM
#68
VeloSIRraptor
Thread Starter
the peoples demand photos...
especially the fender setup- good thinking, I need to ask about that since I spend a good bit of the year wearing them.
10-20-09, 03:35 PM
#69
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That screaming used bike deal just closed up. Sorry Everybody! On the plus side my surrogate little brother will have some food money. And that's a good thing!
10-20-09, 03:45 PM
#70
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Bummer I just missed it...I will post pics of my skeletor and my sneaky fender setup once I get my frame next week (if all goes well)
10-20-09, 03:55 PM
#71
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You haven't taught him well enough.
That's my thing right now. Ramen and new frame/build or decent food and current situation.
10-20-09, 04:17 PM
#72
Senior Member
Sorry dawg, the team's sponsored by specialized and cannondale. I don't have the money to pay for one of the team deals, let alone one of mickey's frames.
I did a short test ride on a spooky, but from a price to performance ratio, the team deals can't be beat. Period.
Maybe when I come into more money ala 2., I'll come back to one. Mickey's the man, and his bikes are good. I'd like to support him. Having met him and seeing him in his element, the purchase would be accompanied by a nice fuzzy feeling.
That's freaking insane.
I think I'm going to be at maybe around 30k, which isn't terrible considering my school's sticker price is 50k. Thank you financial aid and scholarships. I'm hoping to go to med school though. That's going to be fun for the pockets.
I did a short test ride on a spooky, but from a price to performance ratio, the team deals can't be beat. Period.
Maybe when I come into more money ala 2., I'll come back to one. Mickey's the man, and his bikes are good. I'd like to support him. Having met him and seeing him in his element, the purchase would be accompanied by a nice fuzzy feeling.
That's freaking insane.
I think I'm going to be at maybe around 30k, which isn't terrible considering my school's sticker price is 50k. Thank you financial aid and scholarships. I'm hoping to go to med school though. That's going to be fun for the pockets.
10-20-09, 05:17 PM
#73
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I don't think schools like hopkins give merit based. So if you want those, you might have to look lower. Good luck regardless.
Annndddd back on topic...
Annndddd back on topic...
10-20-09, 11:09 PM
#74
Senior Member
10-20-09, 11:11 PM
#75
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