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Move up or enjoy the podium while it lasts

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Move up or enjoy the podium while it lasts

Old 06-23-10, 09:18 AM
  #1  
Smallguy
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Move up or enjoy the podium while it lasts

so my road racing season is pretty much done till next May

there area few TT's that really do not interest me and one other race that is 6 hours away and is unlikely for me since i've spent allot on racing as it is this season

I might get my arm twisted into a race day that involves a TT, a road race and then a hill climb race all in one day

so far I've raced 3 races and placed 2nd in all of them.... one I certianly should have won... and 2 I made rookie mistakes in and thought I'd be able to pull in a gap I let go early but failed to pull in. I feel I lost all 3 races due to inexperience not that I was pushed to my breaking point and just didn't have the legs to win.


all the races so far have been virtual time trials for the most part where I'm out there alone.. in the last race I decided that I'd stay with my teammate and try to secure 2 podium positions rather than just get one of us on the podium or risk us both loosing a chance ot podium... we succeeded taking 2nd and 3rd repectively

since in my area it is all ability based I can move up as I see fit, I dont need points to go up.... I just need permision to drop down again

My average speed last race was 30km/h and the Cat C's were 33 km/h for reference .. they did do an extra lap though

so am I better served to move up a Cat and actually have a larger pack to work with and learn from or Should I stay and enjoy the podium

I'm a Cat D racer here which is essentially Cat 5
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Old 06-23-10, 09:21 AM
  #2  
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Upgrade.
 
Old 06-23-10, 09:21 AM
  #3  
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Old 06-23-10, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Smallguy View Post
so my road racing season is pretty much done till next May

there area few TT's that really do not interest me and one other race that is 6 hours away and is unlikely for me since i've spent allot on racing as it is this season

I might get my arm twisted into a race day that involves a TT, a road race and then a hill climb race all in one day

so far I've raced 3 races and placed 2nd in all of them.... one I certianly should have won... and 2 I made rookie mistakes in and thought I'd be able to pull in a gap I let go early but failed to pull in. I feel I lost all 3 races due to inexperience not that I was pushed to my breaking point and just didn't have the legs to win.


all the races so far have been virtual time trials for the most part where I'm out there alone.. in the last race I decided that I'd stay with my teammate and try to secure 2 podium positions rather than just get one of us on the podium or risk us both loosing a chance ot podium... we succeeded taking 2nd and 3rd repectively

since in my area it is all ability based I can move up as I see fit, I dont need points to go up.... I just need permision to drop down again

My average speed last race was 30km/h and the Cat C's were 33 km/h for reference .. they did do an extra lap though

so am I better served to move up a Cat and actually have a larger pack to work with and learn from or Should I stay and enjoy the podium

I'm a Cat D racer here which is essentially Cat 5
First off, there won't be any working. At least none that I've ever seen. It'll be the same **** show with fewer crashes (maybe). Since you haven't really won a race yet, you're not considered a sand-bagger (yet).

Go for the win, then advance.
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Old 06-23-10, 09:25 AM
  #5  
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Originally Posted by Smallguy View Post

I'm a Cat D racer here which is essentially Cat 5
upgrade. asap.
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Old 06-23-10, 09:34 AM
  #6  
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i'm a 4 and looking at the likelihood that i'm gonna cat up at the end of the season via Best All-around Rider points (i think i have a lock on 3rd), cuz i'm a pretty consistent top 10 in RRs and TTs and HCs and top 20 in crits, despite my best finish so far being 6th on a Road Race and a TT. but i lack the high end kick to W the RRs and Crits, and the equipment to win a TT outright. I'm feeling pretty good about my chances for a podium at a couple of stage races this year, so long as i can stay in the pack on the crit, but who knows.

i'd really like to get a podium before i upgrade though, cuz i suspect after that it'll be a while. otoh, in the 3s i feel like i'll have an opportunity to play a workhorse role on a team, something i'm good at, rather than just racing alone like i mostly do now.
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Old 06-23-10, 10:53 AM
  #7  
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progress. you define it.
the answer is obvious.
hopefully your teammates can upgrade with you.
nice riding.
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Old 06-23-10, 11:14 AM
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thanks

I was pretty sure upgrading was the way to I'll work on my teammate an get thme ot upgrade.... I have allot of friends in the next Cat on other teams as well

we have almost another year to gain that extra 3km/h we will need to finish with the pack which I'm sure is doable on the same course

so I guess it's all over but the long rides and intervals for now
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Old 06-23-10, 12:58 PM
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cyclocross. just around the corner. i'm going to do that for the first time. i'm pumped.
on the prep for next year note....unless you have wives, kids and crazy obligations....I don't think there's any reason to not set goals and believe you could quickly jump through the "C" Category right to the "B's". Many factors but you've got TONS of knowledge right here on BF and ALL off season to work it.

GO!...or, rest a few weeks, drink a beer and THEN go.
(i'm going to do the same)
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Old 06-23-10, 05:29 PM
  #10  
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I'll be the anti: Sounds like you haven't had much chance to learn to race with a pack. That's part of the reason for cat 5's here, so I assume it's part of being a D there. If you feel you're good enough, because of training rides or whatever, then go ahead and upgrade.

But if all your races have been strung out, solo affairs, and you always train alone, you still need pack experience.
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Old 06-23-10, 07:30 PM
  #11  
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3 races ain't much. On strength you're there, on skill, maybe, maybe not.

Here's the thing: I found myself saying the same thing about some races that I came close to winning in my first season - including one that I lost by half a wheel. I eventually decided that "should have won" doesn't make much sense in the lowest cat; the guy who won that race didn't have any more experience than I did, but he got the W, and I didn't. The point being, that landing on or near the podium in Cat 5/D/whatever is about strength and skill. But W vs. podium is, in most situations, basically a crapshoot, since no one knows what they're doing. Obvious exceptions being things like soloing away from the pack or something. The guy who won it had just as much "should have" as you, and in his case, he made it happen. There are lessons to be learned, of course, but I don't see how one rider in these situations is a more appropriate winner than any other.

In short, don't spend a year agonizing over a missed chance in your first three races, absorb the lessons and put in for your upgrade. 2nd in each of your first three races is awesome - no sense in beating yourself up about it.
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Old 06-23-10, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Creakyknees View Post
I'll be the anti: Sounds like you haven't had much chance to learn to race with a pack. That's part of the reason for cat 5's here, so I assume it's part of being a D there. If you feel you're good enough, because of training rides or whatever, then go ahead and upgrade.

But if all your races have been strung out, solo affairs, and you always train alone, you still need pack experience.

I'm going to spend the next while finding Cat C group rides and learning more about pack handling.. since the races are fairly solo affairs I don't feel I'll learn pack skills racing so I'm' going to find group rides for that hopefully
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Old 06-23-10, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by grolby View Post
3 races ain't much. On strength you're there, on skill, maybe, maybe not.

r
In short, don't spend a year agonizing over a missed chance in your first three races, absorb the lessons and put in for your upgrade. 2nd in each of your first three races is awesome - no sense in beating yourself up about it.
I'm not agonizing it certainly was a learning experience though... see what the off season brings. I'm still racing mtb and might do some cross in the fall
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Old 06-23-10, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by grolby View Post
3 races ain't much. On strength you're there, on skill, maybe, maybe not.

Here's the thing: I found myself saying the same thing about some races that I came close to winning in my first season - including one that I lost by half a wheel. I eventually decided that "should have won" doesn't make much sense in the lowest cat; the guy who won that race didn't have any more experience than I did, but he got the W, and I didn't. The point being, that landing on or near the podium in Cat 5/D/whatever is about strength and skill. But W vs. podium is, in most situations, basically a crapshoot, since no one knows what they're doing. Obvious exceptions being things like soloing away from the pack or something. The guy who won it had just as much "should have" as you, and in his case, he made it happen. There are lessons to be learned, of course, but I don't see how one rider in these situations is a more appropriate winner than any other.

In short, don't spend a year agonizing over a missed chance in your first three races, absorb the lessons and put in for your upgrade. 2nd in each of your first three races is awesome - no sense in beating yourself up about it.
try to do this a few times in the D's to channel your inner Jens. race around for the first 25 minutes & then solo away. you really get to know your limits when you have a pack breathing down your neck. then again, this is a fun proposition as the pack is usually so unorganized that you'll easily get an instant 15 second gap. in truth, that's all you need when the pack will bicker itself to second place when no one is willing to lead the chase.

and +1 to nickdavid's point, just because you cat up, doesn't mean the racing gets any smarter, and often times, with a good jump, you can still gap the competition and stay away to finish high. doing a few solo flyers OTF early on in your racing career will give you confidence to do the same thing instinctively later on
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Old 06-24-10, 12:24 AM
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Originally Posted by badhat View Post
i'm a 4 and looking at the likelihood that i'm gonna cat up
You're talking ACA Cat 4 right?

ACA Cat 4 is not the same as USAC Cat 4.
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Old 06-24-10, 01:13 PM
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I think folks are in too big of a hurry to upgrade. We have a rash of crashes in our cat 3 fields because really strong riders, many of whom started racing a year or two ago and still aren't very good bike handlers, have upgraded faster than they should have. Learn to win in your field first. Find some bigger fields to race in. If you're lapping the field, then take the logic to the next group. But I bet if you find some bigger races you'll find yourself at least riding with a smaller group at the end of the race, if not in a big bunch finish.
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Old 06-24-10, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by recon455 View Post
You're talking ACA Cat 4 right?

ACA Cat 4 is not the same as USAC Cat 4.
other than not having a cat5 training wheels cat its not THAT different. what are you getting at?
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Old 06-24-10, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by badhat View Post
other than not having a cat5 training wheels cat its not THAT different. what are you getting at?
You actually have to do some work to get to Cat 4 in USAC. It's not the same.
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Old 06-24-10, 02:11 PM
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When I upgraded to a 3 this year I was leading the Cat 4 State points buy a fair margin. Could have stayed in the 4's and most likely got the jersey/trophy at the end of the season...but being the bestest cat 4 is about like being the smartest kid in your kindergarten class.
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Old 06-24-10, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by recon455 View Post
You actually have to do some work to get to Cat 4 in USAC. It's not the same.
Huh? You call showing up to ten races work?
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Old 06-24-10, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by recon455 View Post
You actually have to do some work to get to Cat 4 in USAC. It's not the same.
nope
 
Old 06-24-10, 02:16 PM
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yeah but that doesnt make it any easier to get OUT of 4, it just means that the 4 field is the equivalent of the 4-5 field on USAC.
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