Race team organization??
02-03-11, 08:18 AM
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Race team organization??
I'm new to racing, but I'm noticing an interesting trend and I'm curious if this is the set-up of most teams or just an oddity around here.
My wife, who has been working with a coach out of California for the past year or so, has been turfed off of two teams. Both of these teams were local outfits that were being run by guys that also offered coaching services. With the second team she made it abundantly clear that she had her own coach and did not want coaching services. Everything seemed fine until this past weekend when she was abruptly released.
It turns out that she did a feature piece, on a women's cycling blog, focusing on what motivates her. In this piece she talks specifically about her coach and this is what we believe did her in, since the guy running the team talked about her going around promoting her coach as the reason for being released. We understand that he's running the team, so he can do as he sees fit.
Upon reading the Daily News at Canadian Cyclist website there is an entry about a race team in Ottawa that is being run by someone who is also the so called team coach...
Is this the way things are? Teams being run as a front to promote coaching services?
I hope not because I personally feel that this can really limit a person's ability to develop and also limit a team's ability to draw in the best local talent.
For now she's going to skip the politics and race for the local cycling club. This club is focused on junior rider development and not Masters racers so she should have a bit more freedom.
My wife, who has been working with a coach out of California for the past year or so, has been turfed off of two teams. Both of these teams were local outfits that were being run by guys that also offered coaching services. With the second team she made it abundantly clear that she had her own coach and did not want coaching services. Everything seemed fine until this past weekend when she was abruptly released.
It turns out that she did a feature piece, on a women's cycling blog, focusing on what motivates her. In this piece she talks specifically about her coach and this is what we believe did her in, since the guy running the team talked about her going around promoting her coach as the reason for being released. We understand that he's running the team, so he can do as he sees fit.
Upon reading the Daily News at Canadian Cyclist website there is an entry about a race team in Ottawa that is being run by someone who is also the so called team coach...
Is this the way things are? Teams being run as a front to promote coaching services?
I hope not because I personally feel that this can really limit a person's ability to develop and also limit a team's ability to draw in the best local talent.
For now she's going to skip the politics and race for the local cycling club. This club is focused on junior rider development and not Masters racers so she should have a bit more freedom.
Last edited by rbart4506; 02-03-11 at 08:30 AM. Reason: spelling
02-03-11, 08:45 AM
#2
Making a kilometer blurry
We have at least one coach on our team, and teammates who are coached by others. No hard feelings there.
Hopefully she can find a team that acts like they're older than 12 so they can stfu and race.
Hopefully she can find a team that acts like they're older than 12 so they can stfu and race.
02-03-11, 08:49 AM
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That is pretty crazy imo. It's not like you guys are getting paid to race for them! Though I guess that'd be like racing for a shop-based team and then blogging about how much you like the competition's shop...
I'm curious who it was! Mazur, Kurzawisnki and Coach Chris are the only coach-oriented teams I can think of in the area.
I'm curious who it was! Mazur, Kurzawisnki and Coach Chris are the only coach-oriented teams I can think of in the area.
02-03-11, 09:10 AM
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Like most things in life, I think it comes down to money. If the Coach that's running the team is putting money into the team, and your wife is getting money out of the team, such as race expenses, then I think it's reasonable that he requires you to not promote other coaches, and/or use his coaching services.
It's the golden rule: he who has the gold makes the rules.
That said, the expectations should be spelled out clearly up front so everyone knows what the deal is.
It's the golden rule: he who has the gold makes the rules.
That said, the expectations should be spelled out clearly up front so everyone knows what the deal is.
__________________
You could fall off a cliff and die.
You could get lost and die.
You could hit a tree and die.
OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.
You could fall off a cliff and die.
You could get lost and die.
You could hit a tree and die.
OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.
02-03-11, 09:35 AM
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Is there any comparison to a rider racing for Cervelo Test Team and saying, "Boy I love my Cannondale?"
Sponsors spend money for a reason.
Sponsors spend money for a reason.
Last edited by InReverse; 02-03-11 at 09:43 AM.
02-03-11, 09:46 AM
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^^^ Trust me we understand that...
That isn't the purpose of this thread...
That isn't the purpose of this thread...
02-03-11, 09:50 AM
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OP said: Is this the way things are? Teams being run as a front to promote coaching services?
I compared it to selling bikes in a bike race. How is that not relevant? I think you're frustrated that bike racing teams are using bike races to sell bike racing products/services. It's also very similar to what 2 other people mentioned here, btw.
I compared it to selling bikes in a bike race. How is that not relevant? I think you're frustrated that bike racing teams are using bike races to sell bike racing products/services. It's also very similar to what 2 other people mentioned here, btw.
Last edited by InReverse; 02-03-11 at 10:00 AM.
02-03-11, 09:54 AM
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Was she forced to buy his coaching service? Was the coach promoting his services saying, "The whole team uses my coaching"?
If not the first part then just accept the coaching and use her own coach to.
That last part should have been the tip-off, if true. Otherwise, he should have made it clear going into the team. Lesson learned. GL
If not the first part then just accept the coaching and use her own coach to.
That last part should have been the tip-off, if true. Otherwise, he should have made it clear going into the team. Lesson learned. GL
02-03-11, 09:57 AM
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I'm not one for politics.... I just wanna show up race.. do my best go home.... help out my teammates and have fun
cloud care less about stroking someones ego
we have a team coach but I'm not sure he provides training plans for one of the clubs I ride with but do not race for
cloud care less about stroking someones ego
we have a team coach but I'm not sure he provides training plans for one of the clubs I ride with but do not race for
02-03-11, 10:18 AM
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If she was going to be coached by him then yes she would have to pay for services and no not everyone is coached by him, but I believe it may be moving in that direction...Which again is fine, it's his perogative....
And yes it is a big live and learn situation...
Which is a big reason why I said go ride for the local cycling club...It's more low key...
And yes it is a big live and learn situation...
Which is a big reason why I said go ride for the local cycling club...It's more low key...
02-03-11, 10:26 AM
#12
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It's an interesting sponsor vs needs thing.
"I like Sidi shoes."
"We're sponsored by blah-blah shoes."
"But they don't fit me, I immediately have ankle pain due to the different last."
Now what?
So... if the former team doesn't openly advertise its connection with the coach, i.e. the coach's name is associated with the team officially, then your wife made a mistake in naming her actual coach in the blog. If the team name is "Coach Bob's Cycling Team" then you should mention either Coach Bob or no name at all. A blog article about Coach Jim could, instead of naming the coach, focus on how a generic "coach" can motivate the writer.
If the former team doesn't openly advertise its connection with the coach, then your wife was okay in naming her actual coach. If the team name is "Whatever Bikes Cycling Team And We Don't Have An Official Coach" then she should be fine in naming Coach Jim.
Go from there.
cdr
"I like Sidi shoes."
"We're sponsored by blah-blah shoes."
"But they don't fit me, I immediately have ankle pain due to the different last."
Now what?
So... if the former team doesn't openly advertise its connection with the coach, i.e. the coach's name is associated with the team officially, then your wife made a mistake in naming her actual coach in the blog. If the team name is "Coach Bob's Cycling Team" then you should mention either Coach Bob or no name at all. A blog article about Coach Jim could, instead of naming the coach, focus on how a generic "coach" can motivate the writer.
If the former team doesn't openly advertise its connection with the coach, then your wife was okay in naming her actual coach. If the team name is "Whatever Bikes Cycling Team And We Don't Have An Official Coach" then she should be fine in naming Coach Jim.
Go from there.
cdr
02-03-11, 10:45 AM
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That's not the driving force behind most teams
Apparently you didn't or your wife wouldn't have been promoting a non team coach in a public forum.
If she's joined two teams and been kicked off both, there are mistakes to be learned from, at minimum about your reasons/methods of picking teams.
02-03-11, 11:18 AM
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02-03-11, 11:23 AM
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Yea, RacerEx she realizes she goofed up and probably shouldn't have named them....
And yes she is re-thinking how and why a team is chosen...
Thanks guys....You actually have given us some things to think about...
It's actually a good thing that this happened now because I think it would have happened eventually anyway. Things were not clearly spelled out from the get-go and that left the door open for issues like this to arise.
And yes she is re-thinking how and why a team is chosen...
Thanks guys....You actually have given us some things to think about...
It's actually a good thing that this happened now because I think it would have happened eventually anyway. Things were not clearly spelled out from the get-go and that left the door open for issues like this to arise.
Last edited by rbart4506; 02-03-11 at 11:27 AM.
02-03-11, 02:29 PM
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Some are better than others. The good ones are underrated.
02-04-11, 11:56 AM
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Yea, we have come to find out that there were some other behind the scenes stuff going on that isn't worth bringing up....
It's slowly becoming water under the bridge and a source of motivation for her....A national masters title would look good
It's slowly becoming water under the bridge and a source of motivation for her....A national masters title would look good
02-04-11, 12:40 PM
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To answer the OP's question, I've seen that pattern more with regional / elite women's teams and juniors than with the men. The fast guys tend to be a more traditional sponsored team approach, usually with a coach as one of several sponsors.
But echoing others' comments, just learn and move on. Finding a good team can be a challenge, just keep looking. Perhaps it's better to find a smaller club where you mesh will with the personalities and goals, and help grow it?
But echoing others' comments, just learn and move on. Finding a good team can be a challenge, just keep looking. Perhaps it's better to find a smaller club where you mesh will with the personalities and goals, and help grow it?
02-04-11, 01:22 PM
#21
Making a kilometer blurry
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