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Base miles for cat2/3 racer with plenty of time to train.

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Base miles for cat2/3 racer with plenty of time to train.

Old 03-11-13, 05:49 PM
  #51  
caloso
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I cannot imagine 30 hours a week.
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Old 03-11-13, 06:23 PM
  #52  
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I'm reading Thomas Prehn's book on tactics. Interesting that the big difference he cites between crit's and RR's is just that a 15" lead in a RR is "about to be caught", while in a crit, it can be insurmountable. Otherwise, tactical similarities abound. The fact that there are so many more crit's makes them the best way to accelerate your way up the learning curve. Track does it even more. But you keep ignoring this point, which is one of the reasons people are dissing you. You just aren't listening. You want everyone to just say "Yes, you are right. Go for it." We hear you that you don't like crits. Do you hear us that you should do them anyway? Do you understand why?
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Old 03-11-13, 06:38 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by caloso View Post
I cannot imagine 30 hours a week.
Same here. I did about 15 hours a week max to get to cat 2. After that I should have trained smarter, not more.
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Old 03-11-13, 06:45 PM
  #54  
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I did 20-22 but it was a long time ago and not very well structured. I could have lopped off a lot of that if I knew better at the time.

JAX, you need to focus on reality. I think it would make sense for you to do a training camp sometime soon where you could ride for a week or two and get base miles. After that, you have to move into build or you are going to get dropped. Build, by necessity, means less time and more intensity. It also means more rest. 30 hour weeks don't play into that strategy. You are not a pro. Don't try and train like one.
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Old 03-11-13, 06:54 PM
  #55  
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i say let him do it. better yet, don't go race until you build up a 120 CTL. it really is that important. i should log off now and go ride some more so that i can hit 100 ctl some day.
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Old 03-11-13, 07:02 PM
  #56  
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I had a CTL of 100 once. I was really slow, I'm still slow.
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Old 03-11-13, 07:05 PM
  #57  
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Old 03-11-13, 07:07 PM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by JAX_11 View Post
Crit racing in Florida is the biggest joke when it comes to cycling. South Florida guys that should be pros racing as cat 4s cause try come from another country. 30-40 people trying to kill each other in every turn just to move up one spot. Not worth it. Guess I grew up in the wrong country cause to me when I think of cycling I think 100mile races climbing attacks on climbs. Not riding around in circles for a hour where the sprinter almost always wins in florida. If I only do 5 or 6 weekends next year it will be races like gila, cascades, anything that is long and hills.
What series are you racing in south Florida? We do tend to race a bit aggressive, but that's what makes it fun.
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Old 03-11-13, 07:08 PM
  #59  
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That's the reality of racing in FL.

You want to take the rest of the season through Oct- where the most long road races are- off while the rest of your cat 3 peers who you've been competitive with to this point keep racing? Then next season you all upgrade and you're racing with mostly the same group of guys again only they're stronger and have a 1/2 season more experience than you.

ROTW, the loaf, webster, pal and ocala were the closest things to "long" road races we have or had. Anytime I've done all of these leading into October, I've been stronger than taking the time off and training instead.

If you need a coach that will drive you like a drill sgt and fill your hours with training until you beg for a rest week, I can recommend someone. Kensuf knows who he is (not gutt).
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Old 03-11-13, 07:09 PM
  #60  
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Late last year I took a break from coaching and just rode my commuter bike as my race bike was broken. I had a CTL of 90 when I sent him my files. Once he saw that he shut me down for three weeks. #notamused
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Old 03-11-13, 07:10 PM
  #61  
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I have to go to bed. I have a feeling this thread is the first thing I'm going to look at in the morning.
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Old 03-11-13, 07:12 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
I have to go to bed. I have a feeling this thread is the first thing to be locked in the morning.
fixed
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Old 03-11-13, 07:19 PM
  #63  
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Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
Late last year I took a break from coaching and just rode my commuter bike as my race bike was broken. I had a CTL of 90 when I sent him my files. Once he saw that he shut me down for three weeks. #notamused
well, he didn't force a shut down on me: my body did that on its own. Went from mid 70 to low 50 in a month, and frankly i needed it.
Originally Posted by mike868y View Post
I had a CTL of 100 once. I was really slow, I'm still slow.
it's an inside joke going back two years

PS. i may very well be racing with you in the cat 3/4 crit this weekend

Last edited by echappist; 03-11-13 at 07:22 PM.
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Old 03-11-13, 07:47 PM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by saratoga View Post
ROTW, the loaf, webster, pal and ocala were the closest things to "long" road races we have or had. Anytime I've done all of these leading into October, I've been stronger than taking the time off and training instead.
Those are great points about some upcoming Florida races over the next 2-3 months...some of the "hilliest" there are here. Good training to be had in those races.

And in the M35+ A group so far this year, the same guys winning the crits are the same guys winning the TTs and the "hilly" road races. They are just very, very strong. I'm getting my a*# kicked by them every week in every discipline. The notion of discipline-specialization at any level other than pro seems useless.
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Old 03-11-13, 07:52 PM
  #65  
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Have you ever trained your sprint? Unlike FTP and endurance, it is a very quick adaptation. If you had an improved jump would it change your thoughts about the types of crit strategies that might interest you?
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Old 03-11-13, 08:02 PM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by caloso View Post
I cannot imagine 30 hours a week.
I think op lives with his parents. Can you imagine it now?
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Old 03-11-13, 08:05 PM
  #67  
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no, i think my body would shut down. 30 hours a week is ridiculous. I would rather be 300 lbs and fat than ride over 30 hours
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Old 03-11-13, 08:12 PM
  #68  
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Don't live with parents. Just decided to give up what I want to do and trust whatever plan the coach gives me to do daily. I will be racing but it won't be for a couple months once he gets some base miles in my legs. Ocala will be the first race. I agreed to do the mileage and give up the idea of going overboard on base mileage. Be doing a LT Test/ power test in a couple weeks and work from there. You can lock this thing up or keep poking fun at me. It's kind of amusing.
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Old 03-11-13, 08:18 PM
  #69  
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30-40 hours/week and a cat3? That sounds like a bunch of junk miles to me, and you think quantity is more valuable than quality. You should be able to get plenty of base in, in 20 hours or less.

You also mention that you want to do the Gila...just where do you suppose in Florida do you expect to train for the climbs at altitude? If you want to race hills, then you need to go climb hills (and practice descending with crosswinds), before you take somebody out.

This whole thread just seems ridiculous.
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Old 03-11-13, 08:52 PM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by Forza View Post
30-40 hours/week and a cat3? That sounds like a bunch of junk miles to me, and you think quantity is more valuable than quality. You should be able to get plenty of base in, in 20 hours or less.

You also mention that you want to do the Gila...just where do you suppose in Florida do you expect to train for the climbs at altitude? If you want to race hills, then you need to go climb hills (and practice descending with crosswinds), before you take somebody out.

This whole thread just seems ridiculous.
Sorry that I'm not as skilled or as great as you. You sound ridiculas by just coming on here and that's all you have to say. Train in north Georgia 6 Gap a few hours away. More than enough. Thanks for your irrelevant imput
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Old 03-11-13, 09:08 PM
  #71  
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Originally Posted by JAX_11 View Post
Sorry that I'm not as skilled or as great as you. You sound ridiculas by just coming on here and that's all you have to say. Train in north Georgia 6 Gap a few hours away. More than enough. Thanks for your irrelevant imput


you do realize that the peaks of Northern GA tops out at 3500, whereas Silver City, NM is 5500ft as a baseline, yes? The highest climb in the Gila tops out at 7500 ft. But hey, maybe you acclimate fast, who knows. By all means, go for it. Sometimes i like schadenfreude, especially when said schadenfreude involves an ingrate who trashes the pearls of wisdom and good intention of everyone else.
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Old 03-11-13, 09:10 PM
  #72  
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I can't imagine 20+ hours a week as an amateur as a sustained schedule.

Even if idle rich (i.e. no work commitments) there's a damn sight lot more out there to do than ride your bicycle to race other amateurs 20+++ hours a week for months on end.

I'd bet on the side of burnout/sickness/injury before October's racing.

But I wish you luck, JAX. I'll be playing with my kids and doing other hobbies.
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Old 03-11-13, 10:17 PM
  #73  
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Originally Posted by JAX_11 View Post
Sorry that I'm not as skilled or as great as you. You sound ridiculas by just coming on here and that's all you have to say. Train in north Georgia 6 Gap a few hours away. More than enough. Thanks for your irrelevant imput
If you're as defensive and fragile in your actual life as you are here, it's hard to see how hiring a coach will be anything but a waste of money for you.

Coach: you're too weak in _________, you need to do _________ to fix that.
JAX_11: sorry I'm not as skilled or as great as you, I'll just do [utterly inappropriate/inadequate thing that isn't hard]. More than enough. Thanks for your irrelevant input.
Ex-coach: see ya, good luck at Gila.
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Old 03-11-13, 10:25 PM
  #74  
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i would love to finish 6th in a cat 3 race....sigh...
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Old 03-11-13, 10:50 PM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by JAX_11 View Post
Sorry that I'm not as skilled or as great as you. You sound ridiculas by just coming on here and that's all you have to say. Train in north Georgia 6 Gap a few hours away. More than enough. Thanks for your irrelevant imput
Sheesh, over-react much? My feedback was 100% relevant and on point. Might I remind you that you're the one searching for answers on the internet? My point in saying that the thread is ridiculous, is that you did come here seeking advice and then dismiss the advice of numerous people. Can you show me one person here that has agreed with your plan to train 30-40 hours? Show me one.

Regarding your aspiration to ride the Gila..Echappist, is spot on below (and knew what I was getting at), northern Georgia. is not the Gila. My point that you missed is; that you need to train for the specific event. Having lived in Boulder and now in the PacNW, there is a huge difference in climbing in altitudes over 5000 ft. The second point is that no amount of volume will offset climbing. To climb well, you need to...well...climb a lot and then climb some more.

Take it or leave it.
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