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Racer Tech Thread

Old 08-21-15, 08:29 AM
  #2451  
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Old 08-21-15, 08:36 AM
  #2452  
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Yes. Normally I would render it as Newman. Or Newman.
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Old 08-21-15, 08:46 AM
  #2453  
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I tried so hard to find a gif of Jerry saying "Newman". The googles, zey do nothing.
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Old 08-21-15, 08:47 AM
  #2454  
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Originally Posted by mike868y
1X on the road has got to be the most ridiculous thing the bike industry has thought of recently. and that's saying something.
Well. I don't have any interest in a 1X road bike, and overall I think it's about resurrecting the crit bike as a specialized machine, and my belief is that's incredibly misguided for most amateur racers. But. I've finally upgraded to 11-speed, and I haven't done a ton of rides just yet (just built the bike last week), but the versatility of a 53 tooth ring with an 11-28 cassette where you can use every cog is a little bit mind-boggling to me. The improvement over a 10-speed 11-25 is non-trivial. It was really pretty surprising to me. With a 50 tooth ring, the versatility would be even better. So, my take is that 1x11 road bikes are, let's say, feasible in a way that even 1x10 really isn't. The circumstances under which they are feasible are definitely limited, and deliberately buying a road bike that can do less for essentially arbitrary reasons seems foolish to me, but the concept is not unworkable.

I suppose my main objection is: what problem does this solve? 1X in cyclocross makes sense for two major reasons: it reduces the cognitive load of dealing with front shifting, which I believe is A Thing in CX, and it improves reliability by making it extremely difficult to drop a chain. On the road, neither of these things are a problem. You're shifting less often, and typically are in one ring or the other for long stretches of time. And chain drops aren't as big a risk when doing a front shift on the road if everything is adjusted properly.

It does make sense for new, inexperienced riders. I think the complexity of dealing with a front and rear shifting system is underappreciated by those of us who have been riding bikes like this forever. It really is intimidating to many newcomers. But few newcomers are going to be buying bikes as expensive as the ones that come with road one-by setups. I just don't really understand who these bikes are for.
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Old 08-21-15, 09:06 AM
  #2455  
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Originally Posted by grolby
Well. I don't have any interest in a 1X road bike, and overall I think it's about resurrecting the crit bike as a specialized machine, and my belief is that's incredibly misguided for most amateur racers. But. I've finally upgraded to 11-speed, and I haven't done a ton of rides just yet (just built the bike last week), but the versatility of a 53 tooth ring with an 11-28 cassette where you can use every cog is a little bit mind-boggling to me. The improvement over a 10-speed 11-25 is non-trivial. It was really pretty surprising to me. With a 50 tooth ring, the versatility would be even better. So, my take is that 1x11 road bikes are, let's say, feasible in a way that even 1x10 really isn't. The circumstances under which they are feasible are definitely limited, and deliberately buying a road bike that can do less for essentially arbitrary reasons seems foolish to me, but the concept is not unworkable.

I suppose my main objection is: what problem does this solve? 1X in cyclocross makes sense for two major reasons: it reduces the cognitive load of dealing with front shifting, which I believe is A Thing in CX, and it improves reliability by making it extremely difficult to drop a chain. On the road, neither of these things are a problem. You're shifting less often, and typically are in one ring or the other for long stretches of time. And chain drops aren't as big a risk when doing a front shift on the road if everything is adjusted properly.

It does make sense for new, inexperienced riders. I think the complexity of dealing with a front and rear shifting system is underappreciated by those of us who have been riding bikes like this forever. It really is intimidating to many newcomers. But few newcomers are going to be buying bikes as expensive as the ones that come with road one-by setups. I just don't really understand who these bikes are for.

i've been using a 10 speed SRAM Force since late 2009 with 53x29 and 11x28 gear cluster and been using all the cogs since that time.
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Old 08-21-15, 09:19 AM
  #2456  
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thanks for the comments about the crux wheels, everyone. I will check with my bike shop. I'm glad you guys brought this up, i had no idea wheel compatibility was a thing... this will be my first disc brake bike, and I'm not even really sure what a thru axle is. lots to learn....
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Old 08-21-15, 09:27 AM
  #2457  
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Can you get through axle for the new crux with the two derailleur hanger system? Does it matter if you can't?

It's no skin off my back, I'm not in the new bike market at all and have no disc wheels, but this is an epic marketing failure because nobody has found the link that clearly explains it yet.
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Old 08-21-15, 10:05 AM
  #2458  
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Originally Posted by TheKillerPenguin
I tried so hard to find a gif of Jerry saying "Newman". The googles, zey do nothing.
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Old 08-21-15, 10:06 AM
  #2459  
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Fudgy!
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Old 08-21-15, 10:20 AM
  #2460  
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Technically that's a "hello, Newman," said with disgust and spite. Which is different from the hissed bitter I'll get-you-for-this "Newman!"
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Old 08-21-15, 10:22 AM
  #2461  
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Originally Posted by tetonrider
ah, the old warranty-and-sell Quarq trick. smart--that is the best point to sell.

anyway, i'm unlikely to get one if i need the pioneer head unit. i'd like to experiment with one--i'm always curious, but i'd want to do it the right way.
I know you've mentioned that you can get more than just SRM's. Should I PM you for the Pioneer or go straight through them? I'll likely pick up a cheap ultegra crank and send it in for the kit to be installed.
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Old 08-21-15, 10:29 AM
  #2462  
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Originally Posted by TheKillerPenguin
I tried so hard to find a gif of Jerry saying "Newman". The googles, zey do nothing.
Originally Posted by globecanvas
Technically that's a "hello, Newman," said with disgust and spite. Which is different from the hissed bitter I'll get-you-for-this "Newman!"
technically.
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Old 08-21-15, 10:34 AM
  #2463  
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It's the difference between this and this. It is the tech thread after all.
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Old 08-21-15, 10:52 AM
  #2464  
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which chain, when applied new, is the fastest?
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Old 08-21-15, 10:57 AM
  #2465  
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I don't know if I want to buy a new road bike frame, or a cross bike..

Team should be doing a Giant deal again this year (as far as I know its through 2015)..

Propel Advanced Pro Frameset (2016) | Giant Bicycles | United States

TCX SLR 2 (2016) | Giant Bicycles | United States
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Old 08-23-15, 05:49 AM
  #2466  
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I need a new frame. Sponsor shop will do a hard to refuse deal on any Specialized or Cannondale. I admit to being quite intrigued by the Allez Sprints. Does anybody know more about those?

Specifically, you can put a clamp on FD on those right? And I also have some memory of somebody (@tetonrider I think) talking about how these were neutral support bikes that riders didn't like, or was that a different frame>

[edit] yes tetonrider said that on the previous page of this thread Was that the Sprints you were talking about or the regular Allez? The Sprints don't really look like a Tarmac.

Last edited by globecanvas; 08-23-15 at 07:30 AM.
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Old 08-23-15, 07:29 AM
  #2467  
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While this may not apply to you, I just picked up a Emonda ALR as a training bike/commuter yesterday. It's stiff and feels very nimble. Would be light if it didn't have 105 on it. But I want it heavy and non aero.

If I needed a new race frame I'd be looking hard at the Cervelo S2. All the new aero upgrades and the fork is the same aero as the s3 fork. So weight is the only difference between the s2 and 3. I'm certainly an aero weenie.
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Old 08-23-15, 07:31 AM
  #2468  
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Those look like nice bikes, but I'm basically locked into Specialized or Cannondale, unless I switch teams.
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Old 08-23-15, 07:52 AM
  #2469  
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Comparing the Tarmac to the Allez Sprint, the Sprint looks a little more aggressive in fit. Shorter, lower in front. The Sprint seatpost scares me, but I don't know if Venge riders have an issue with it.
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Old 08-23-15, 08:34 AM
  #2470  
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The Sprint that's available now has no provision for an FD. There's one in the pipeline with an FD, due in around December (I think - have to check the dealer website). I haven't seen one in real life, but I think the seat tube is a non-standard dimension. The picture is here, and when you zoom in all the way the area where the FD would attach is squarish.
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Old 08-23-15, 04:15 PM
  #2471  
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If you had $4000-5000 to put into a new bike (including a team discount), would you go for a 2016 Scott Foil (probably the 10), or a 2015 team issue?
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Old 08-23-15, 04:27 PM
  #2472  
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Originally Posted by globecanvas
I need a new frame. Sponsor shop will do a hard to refuse deal on any Specialized or Cannondale. I admit to being quite intrigued by the Allez Sprints. Does anybody know more about those?

Specifically, you can put a clamp on FD on those right? And I also have some memory of somebody (@tetonrider I think) talking about how these were neutral support bikes that riders didn't like, or was that a different frame>

[edit] yes tetonrider said that on the previous page of this thread Was that the Sprints you were talking about or the regular Allez? The Sprints don't really look like a Tarmac.
i think the ones tetonrider was talking about are the current generation "smartweld" allezs. at least that's what the sram nrs bikes around here are. the sprints use the same welding technology but it's a totally different frame.
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Old 08-24-15, 07:04 AM
  #2473  
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Originally Posted by globecanvas
Specifically, you can put a clamp on FD on those right? And I also have some memory of somebody (@tetonrider I think) talking about how these were neutral support bikes that riders didn't like, or was that a different frame>
I don't believe so, I have never seen one in person so this is just from what I can tell looking at internets pictures but there seems to be a lack of braze-on for the FD and the seattube goes from 'oval' to squarish at the bottom (So no clamp on)

Originally Posted by shovelhd
The Sprint seatpost scares me, but I don't know if Venge riders have an issue with it.
They are a pain to get to remain "locked in place", proper torquing and use of friction paste is a must. But side from that they have never treated me wrong (Aside from over nasty roads)
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Old 08-25-15, 09:17 AM
  #2474  
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Yeah, no clamp on for the 1x Allez Sprint, but there's a 2x version coming soon.

Decisions decisions. What frams?

- Tarmac just like the one I broke

- Venge (not the fancy one)

- Allez Sprint, which I am really interested in, but would have to drive like 2 hours to demo, and didn't have a great experience with my last specialized alu bike so hmph

- Supersix
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Old 08-25-15, 10:00 AM
  #2475  
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Originally Posted by canuckbelle
If you had $4000-5000 to put into a new bike (including a team discount), would you go for a 2016 Scott Foil (probably the 10), or a 2015 team issue?
I'm making same decision now. I think that I'd never know the difference between the frames because we're just talking carbon layup, correct? so, I'd compare the group rather than the frame and let that drive the decision.
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