Go Back  Bike Forums > The Racer's Forum > "The 33"-Road Bike Racing
Reload this Page >

2015 USAC rule changes

Notices
"The 33"-Road Bike Racing We set this forum up for our members to discuss their experiences in either pro or amateur racing, whether they are the big races, or even the small backyard races. Don't forget to update all the members with your own race results.

2015 USAC rule changes

Old 02-03-15, 01:52 PM
  #1  
shovelhd
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Posts: 15,669

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
2015 USAC rule changes

The 2015 rule book has been posted to usacycling.org. I have a webinar to complete which will go over every little detail from an officials point of view, which I will complete later this week. Here's a look at what changes I thought were notable at first glance:

Cat5's now have a points system for upgrades. Mentored races count as do clinics.
There were significant changes to the collegiate rules.
There is now a team time trial event at the National Championships. Men's categories are pro, 1, 35+ and 50+. Womens categories are pro and 35+.
CX adds ProCX qualifying ranking to UCI points.
Disc brakes will be allowed on road bikes for all races except UCI and UCI qualifying events, and exceptions may be allowed.
shovelhd is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 02:00 PM
  #2  
TheKillerPenguin
Nonsense
 
TheKillerPenguin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Vagabond
Posts: 13,904

Bikes: Affirmative

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 871 Post(s)
Liked 517 Times in 224 Posts
Disc Brakes could get realllllly sketchy...
TheKillerPenguin is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 02:39 PM
  #3  
Creatre
These Guys Eat Oreos
 
Creatre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Superior, CO
Posts: 3,432

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Interesting.
Creatre is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 03:01 PM
  #4  
Grumpy McTrumpy
gmt
 
Grumpy McTrumpy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Binghamton, NY
Posts: 12,509
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 45 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
we need a 2015 USAC fee changes thread too
Grumpy McTrumpy is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 03:13 PM
  #5  
furiousferret
Senior Member
 
furiousferret's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Redlands, CA
Posts: 6,307
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 841 Post(s)
Liked 467 Times in 248 Posts
Curious to see the specifics on the 5's.
furiousferret is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 03:19 PM
  #6  
mattm
**** that
 
mattm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CALI
Posts: 15,401
Mentioned: 151 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1097 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times in 30 Posts
Originally Posted by Grumpy McTrumpy View Post
we need a 2015 USAC fee changes thread too
time to sell those fancy wheels!
__________________
cat 1.

my race videos
mattm is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 03:39 PM
  #7  
gsteinb
out walking the earth
 
gsteinb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lake Placid, NY
Posts: 21,441
Mentioned: 71 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 912 Post(s)
Liked 751 Times in 342 Posts
Originally Posted by Grumpy McTrumpy View Post
we need a 2015 USAC fee changes thread too
what changes
gsteinb is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 04:13 PM
  #8  
carpediemracing 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Tariffville, CT
Posts: 15,363

Bikes: Tsunami road bikes, Dolan DF4 track

Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 371 Post(s)
Liked 164 Times in 90 Posts
I only know about the insurance surcharge.

So far the permit fees, license fee, club fee seems to be the same. I wasn't surprised when I paid them.
__________________
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
carpediemracing is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 04:56 PM
  #9  
grolby
Senior Member
 
grolby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: BOSTON BABY
Posts: 9,723
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 260 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 41 Posts
Originally Posted by TheKillerPenguin View Post
Disc Brakes could get realllllly sketchy...
Not to start this debate, but how so? I had heard that collegiate races were now allowing disc brakes in road races, presumably as a cost-saving measure for student athletes (so they could use a disc cross bike in road racing). It doesn't worry me much, but I don't think there's going to be an explosion of disc brakes in road events anymore than there were tons of disc brakes at USAC cross races before the UCI allowed them. The Cat 5 stuff could be more significant. I'm going to go check out the rulebook.
grolby is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 04:58 PM
  #10  
globecanvas
Ninny
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: The Gunks
Posts: 5,295
Mentioned: 53 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 686 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
The cat 5 stuff is not a big deal, just codifying some stuff that was vague before afaict.

Originally Posted by https://s3.amazonaws.com/USACWeb/forms/rules/2015_USAC_Rulebook_Chapter_1.pdf
5-4: Acquire 10 points by a combination of the following*:
• 2 points – complete all three sections of aBeginner Racer Program (BRP) clinic.
• 1 point – finish a massed start race
• 1 point – complete a USA Cycling-approvededucation clinic
• 1 point – participate in a mentored raceexperience where the mentor is at least a cat 3 8rider and has been approved by the LocalAssociation

* Rider clinics and camps can be used to only a maximum of 5 points,except that a rider may obtain all 10 upgrade points from the USACycling BRP
globecanvas is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 05:36 PM
  #11  
shovelhd
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Posts: 15,669

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
There was no Cat5 points system in 2014.
shovelhd is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 05:51 PM
  #12  
Grumpy McTrumpy
gmt
 
Grumpy McTrumpy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Binghamton, NY
Posts: 12,509
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 45 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
what changes
Our club got a 33% insurance fee increase annually for 2015. The per-rider insurance fees went up by 20%. Our registered promoter knows more about the fee increases for events, but if you want to see a run-down, Dieter has put it all up on FB. The NCC now requires equal prize lists for both men and women, which is very egalitarian, but also means the promoter now has to come up with ten kilobucks more just to get NCC sanction.

The list probably goes on further. USAC seems to be spoken of with disdain by every promoter that I have heard speak about them recently.
Grumpy McTrumpy is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 08:03 PM
  #13  
tetonrider
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,449
Mentioned: 64 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 693 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
There is now a team time trial event at the National Championships. Men's categories are pro, 1, 35+ and 50+. Womens categories are pro and 35+.
thanks!

is that pro and 1 or p/1? (i assume the latter.) are they doing this at elite nationals (tahoe) and masters nationals (ogden)?
tetonrider is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 08:18 PM
  #14  
globecanvas
Ninny
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: The Gunks
Posts: 5,295
Mentioned: 53 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 686 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
There was no Cat5 points system in 2014.

I just meant that it's not a qualitative change in what's required to upgrade. "Points system" made me wonder if you need results to upgrade to 4, but it's still just about experience (as it should be).
globecanvas is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 08:39 PM
  #15  
carpediemracing 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Tariffville, CT
Posts: 15,363

Bikes: Tsunami road bikes, Dolan DF4 track

Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 371 Post(s)
Liked 164 Times in 90 Posts
Originally Posted by Grumpy McTrumpy View Post
Our club got a 33% insurance fee increase annually for 2015. The per-rider insurance fees went up by 20%. Our registered promoter knows more about the fee increases for events, but if you want to see a run-down, Dieter has put it all up on FB. The NCC now requires equal prize lists for both men and women, which is very egalitarian, but also means the promoter now has to come up with ten kilobucks more just to get NCC sanction.

The list probably goes on further. USAC seems to be spoken of with disdain by every promoter that I have heard speak about them recently.
It's interesting about the equal prize list. I think that's one of those things that a person can't not-support publicly. I don't do it but my concession to the Junior/Women conundrum is to offer separate races for them.

It reminds me of the huge "demand" to move Interbike out of Vegas. Then when they announced that's what they would do the folks that go to the show - vendors and store - all screamed bloody murder. Interbike actually committed to moving the show, giving up their space in the Sands, then had to back pedal to get back into the city. It caused a lot of stress for Interbike. I still see people complaining about Interbike in Vegas but the reality is that most of the people want it there, they just aren't as vocal about it.

I have always been a sort of "change from within" person. I don't know Bob Stapleton but I think him being at the head is a good thing. I had harbored the thought of trying to work for HTC back then, and now I have this vague concept that it would be good to work for USAC. I hope that things progress in the next few years.
__________________
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
carpediemracing is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 08:50 PM
  #16  
carpediemracing 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Tariffville, CT
Posts: 15,363

Bikes: Tsunami road bikes, Dolan DF4 track

Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 371 Post(s)
Liked 164 Times in 90 Posts
I didn't know disc brakes weren't allowed before. There was at least one guy with disc brakes at Bethel.
__________________
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
carpediemracing is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 09:04 PM
  #17  
shovelhd
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Posts: 15,669

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by tetonrider View Post
thanks!

is that pro and 1 or p/1? (i assume the latter.) are they doing this at elite nationals (tahoe) and masters nationals (ogden)?
I don't know where or when. From what I understand the pros and Cat1's are separate fields. Each must be USAC registered teams.
shovelhd is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 09:05 PM
  #18  
shovelhd
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Posts: 15,669

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by globecanvas View Post
I just meant that it's not a qualitative change in what's required to upgrade. "Points system" made me wonder if you need results to upgrade to 4, but it's still just about experience (as it should be).
Oh, OK. Yes, no finish ranking or points.
shovelhd is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 09:06 PM
  #19  
shovelhd
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Posts: 15,669

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
I didn't know disc brakes weren't allowed before. There was at least one guy with disc brakes at Bethel.
USAC rules mandate brakes front and rear, no specificity on type. It was the UCI that made disc brakes "legal".
shovelhd is offline  
Old 02-03-15, 09:08 PM
  #20  
shovelhd
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Posts: 15,669

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Grumpy McTrumpy View Post
Our club got a 33% insurance fee increase annually for 2015. The per-rider insurance fees went up by 20%.
Right, but they are small numbers as I understand it. $25 more for each club, and a buck more for each rider.
shovelhd is offline  
Old 02-04-15, 12:31 AM
  #21  
carpediemracing 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Tariffville, CT
Posts: 15,363

Bikes: Tsunami road bikes, Dolan DF4 track

Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 371 Post(s)
Liked 164 Times in 90 Posts
Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
Right, but they are small numbers as I understand it. $25 more for each club, and a buck more for each rider.
$3 to $3.60 for insurance. Did the club fee go up? I was just paying things. I suppose that's what they want, for people to not notice.
__________________
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
carpediemracing is offline  
Old 02-04-15, 12:31 AM
  #22  
carpediemracing 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Tariffville, CT
Posts: 15,363

Bikes: Tsunami road bikes, Dolan DF4 track

Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 371 Post(s)
Liked 164 Times in 90 Posts
Not related to the stuff about the fees, my feeling is to work from within. I'm not going to hold rogue races, I don't like it when I show up and it's a rogue race. I've made rule change suggestions to the LA (for USAC meetings), I fought against rules I didn't think were good/productive. Etc.

For me, as a promoter, part of the appeal of USAC is the ease with which I can get an event going. In 2014 I got a call over July 4th weekend about holding a corporate fun ride in 2 weeks. Because I was familiar with USAC's process I had the ride set up within a few days - basically I had to wait on the corporation to finalize their decision and it took me an hour? to get the thing set up. I've used USAC for charity rides, a memorial ride, sometimes getting the permit for the ride within days of the event (regardless of what they say about two weeks etc).
__________________
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
carpediemracing is offline  
Old 02-04-15, 04:21 AM
  #23  
Grumpy McTrumpy
gmt
 
Grumpy McTrumpy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Binghamton, NY
Posts: 12,509
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 45 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
$25 for each club may be for the club license. I forgot if that increase was this year or last year.

The club insurance went up by $50.

So that's $75 annual increase and no value added.

Additionally, you now have to pay for a $4M liability policy for events (this may apply to events that cross county lines, I am not sure on the details) and the insurance costs per vehicle have gone up.

Yes I understand that these dollar amounts, when looked at as if they were alone, seem small, but when promoters are adding up all of the fees they have to figure out just how much it will take for a race event to break even. These grassroots events weren't exactly making bank when the fees were lower either.

Now take a look at the races that haven't come back this season. the NYSBRA site has an archive of previous years calendars along with the drafts of the 2015 calendar.
Grumpy McTrumpy is offline  
Old 02-04-15, 04:44 AM
  #24  
Grumpy McTrumpy
gmt
 
Grumpy McTrumpy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Binghamton, NY
Posts: 12,509
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 45 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
Not related to the stuff about the fees, my feeling is to work from within. I'm not going to hold rogue races, I don't like it when I show up and it's a rogue race. I've made rule change suggestions to the LA (for USAC meetings), I fought against rules I didn't think were good/productive. Etc.

For me, as a promoter, part of the appeal of USAC is the ease with which I can get an event going. In 2014 I got a call over July 4th weekend about holding a corporate fun ride in 2 weeks. Because I was familiar with USAC's process I had the ride set up within a few days - basically I had to wait on the corporation to finalize their decision and it took me an hour? to get the thing set up. I've used USAC for charity rides, a memorial ride, sometimes getting the permit for the ride within days of the event (regardless of what they say about two weeks etc).
I fully agree on working from within. I'm president of the local USAC club and one of our members (past president) is also president of NYSBRA, level A official, and he attends the USAC summits each year. We try to put together as many local opinions for him to carry to Colorado Springs each year. He feels very frustrated with the direction the USAC has gone recently and he's not alone.

When it came time for me to renew the club insurance in December, I found there was no updated application form for 2015. This was not unusual, since in prior years we've just re-used the previous year and all went fine. Not this time. Our check was returned by mail along with a request that we use the "current" application.

An application which wasn't posted until nearly the end of the year. And oh gee, look at that! a rate increase!

So while USAC were all out enjoying their Christmas junkets and abandoning their post in Colorado, our club was uninsured during the time it took for things to get snailmailed back and forth. Needless to say, it left a bad taste in my mouth. I called up my buddy and related the story to him, suggesting that he ask the USAC (next time he meets with them) to please post the new forms before the end of the year!

And, maybe not surprisingly, he told me the same thing happened to him when he sent in his event forms for the races in 2015. A check mailed back with a request for the new form (which didn't exist yet, yada yada).

Then he gave me a run-down of all the increases that got ramrodded to the promoters for 2015. I should have taken notes.

So, reg. fees will go up (see Bkill) and some races will disappear. Hornby is gone. Bennington is gone. Binghamton Circuit Race may be gone (we are still working on that one)

Do I blame USAC? I'm trying to be understanding. I guess they are doing what they feel is best from their perspective. Maybe they have to deal with strongarming by the insurance companies. I don't know. What I do know is they seem out of touch with the core of amateur racers in this particular area.
Grumpy McTrumpy is offline  
Old 02-04-15, 06:51 AM
  #25  
Creatre
These Guys Eat Oreos
 
Creatre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Superior, CO
Posts: 3,432

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by globecanvas View Post
• 1 point – participate in a mentored raceexperience where the mentor is at least a cat 3 8rider and has been approved by the LocalAssociation
Any idea what that means? Are these like unofficial non sanctioned practice races? Or like a coach takes a rider out to a industrial warehouse and does some intervals?

Seems vague like you said.
Creatre is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2022 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.