Thanks John, I made a couple of minor updates in my post above.
I don't know why you think I'm any more clear about what is fact and what is speculation now than I was in the deleted thread. I thought it was quite clear there too. Oh well, that's behind us now.
Originally Posted by John C. Ratliff
It is not "reasonable" to assume anything until all the facts are known of the situation.
I'm not an accident investigator and my purpose here is not to determine what actually happened. That would be entirely inappropriate (not to mention impossible).
My purpose, as it always is on this forum with respect to these incidents, is to
speculate about what is
likely to have happened, to
assume that IS what happened, and discuss what, if anything, the cyclist could or should have done to avoid the crash, assuming those speculations are facts. I don't know why this is so hard for you to understand.
Originally Posted by John C. Ratliff
The motorist was in actual, real violation of Oregon statute, and was cited for it. Her behavior is not normal, unless it is open season on bicyclists. They were signaling a turn, for Pete's sake! She had the responsibility to operate her vehicle in a safe manner according to the rules of the road. Actually, her responsibility was to not be driving at all, as her license was suspended. To excuse her in any way is not reasonable.
Just because her behavior was in actual, real violation of Oregon statute, and she was cited for it, does not mean that behavior was not normal. Nor does accepting that that behavior is normal mean it is open season on bicyclists. That's ridiculous.
By the way, when I say her behavior is normal, I mean "usual, typical, expected".
Whether you like it or not, all of the following is usual, typical and expected (or at least it should be by the experienced cyclist):
- Motorists that speed, even when it's raining (even police do this).
- Motorists that are invited to pass closely on narrow rural roads where cyclists are riding near or on the fog line (e.g, I've been close passed by police officers before I knew better than to ride near the road edge).
- Motorists (even police) that cross a solid yellow in order to pass cyclists.
That list of behavior is usual, typical and most certainly should be expected. Illegal though it is, it is
normal. If you don't expect it, and ride accordingly, then you should not be riding your bike on roads.