exellent! my first reply! the nice thing about it is that, reading more about the dutch bikes on this forum made me appreciate more, the frame builders that we had ( maybe still have...) in Holland. Have you got some general tips for me when using the forum? when for instance i type in "zieleman"when i search on the forum i get a whole list of different threads, how do i decide which one to use or is it better to make a new thread? I'm new to the whole thing but i know it can **** people of when you start new threads when it's not necessary and all that....