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Is there widespread hatred of cyclists?

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Is there widespread hatred of cyclists?

Old 04-24-15, 05:11 AM
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Is there widespread hatred of cyclists?

Originally Posted by dynodonn
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
……. I think the whole flap was a tempest in a teapot.
Probably not, just only shows the type of attitudes that quite a few in the general public have for cyclists…
To each his own opinion, but my complete quote was, FWIW,

Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
…Nonetheless “hatred” is way too strong a word; IMO here in Boston, more like “exasperation.” I think the whole flap was a tempest in a teapot.

Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
…[To the cyclist in the video, and] to the OP, I would say, “What’s your problem?.”…To paraphrase Humphrey Bogart in Casablanca, "Of all the dangerous situations on all the roads in all the world, he complains about this one."
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Old 04-24-15, 01:01 PM
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I don't think there there is widespread hatred of cyclists. I have been on bikes for 16 years now and I have never felt hated or disrespected on the road.

I only think that there's hatred towards certain types of cyclists. Like cyclists on road bikes who ride on the middle of a lane and making it impossible for a car to overtake. Or cyclists that cross red lights or ride in between cars in traffic jams expecting slow moving cars to stop for them. This kind of reckless selfish behaviour creates a bad vibe that is not good for anyone on the road.
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Old 04-24-15, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by mozad655
I have never felt hated or disrespected on the road.
Never?
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Old 04-24-15, 02:56 PM
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there is some hatred, and there is a lot more respect from both pedestrians and motorists. the hatred really stands out though, so i get it.

i would say the hatred of cyclists and pedestrians are from the same group of motorists who pretty much hate both of us for using the roads when they don't think we have a right to the roads. their mindset needs to change. roads are for everyone and motorists have a huge responsibility to those that ride in their car, other cars on the road and the cyclists and pedestrians - they need to recognize that and to be aware they carry a huge responsibility as drivers of 2000-lb plus vehicles.
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Old 04-24-15, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by mozad655
I don't think there there is widespread hatred of cyclists. I have been on bikes for 16 years now and I have never felt hated or disrespected on the road.

I only think that there's hatred towards certain types of cyclists. Like cyclists on road bikes who ride on the middle of a lane and making it impossible for a car to overtake. Or cyclists that cross red lights or ride in between cars in traffic jams expecting slow moving cars to stop for them. This kind of reckless selfish behaviour creates a bad vibe that is not good for anyone on the road.
While I agree about cyclists' that are 'red light runners', salmon, or even those that ride in between slow moving traffic, or traffic jams. Doesn't a cyclist have a right to expect to be passed safely. Instead of, being able to 'reach out and touch someone'. A close pass on a four/six-lane high speed road is one thing. But on busy or dangerous stretch of a low speed two-lane road resulting in becoming 'collateral damage'. By not 'taking the lane'. Is another thing altogether.

The state drivers' manual says for motorists' not to honk at cyclists'. When I would experience that a couple years ago. It would really tick me off. Now, I mentally approach from the perspective of the motorist, the time of day, Rush/Non-Rush, location. So I now just ignore it. Because, Everyone gets' honked at.
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Old 04-24-15, 05:06 PM
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A spokesman for the Massachusetts State Police stated:

"After reviewing the videotaped interaction between a bicyclist and a state trooper that occurred Tuesday on the Longfellow Bridge, it is clear that the trooper’s statements regarding bike lanes and cyclists are wrong. Contrary to the tone and content of those statements, the State Police are concerned with, and have a responsibility to protect, the safety of bicyclists. As such, we have a duty to ensure safe conditions along any open bike lanes on roads under our jurisdiction. Earlier this year the Department issued a training bulletin reminding troopers of the rights and responsibilities of cyclists. That bulletin was re-issued this morning. Furthermore, the Department will reiterate to those troopers on the bridge Tuesday our responsibilities to bicyclists, and will counsel the trooper who spoke to the cyclist about the proper way to respond to concerns raised by members of the public."

And the basis of the thread wasn't just the trooper's attitude. It also made reference to the comments below the article. Here are a few:

"Anyway, I'm pretty sure all cyclists are a-holes."
"All cyclists suck"
"Buy a car you ass hole!"
"What a whiny granola crunching dolt."
"I know more than one bike commuter in long term care drooling on themselves and pôôpin in a diaper, due to this arrogance road takeover"
"The cyclist never even helped her...picked his bike up and went on his arrogant way....hate em!"
"And to show I mean it, you are more than welcome to ride your bike in front of me when I'm driving, please....I insist."
"Ya can't win Lisa with these entitled whiny yellow clad bicyclists"
"I should have slapped him of the head and thrown his bike into the Charles."
"Everyone is sick of these Lance Armstrong wannabes complaining all the time."
"He should be ignored like the rest of the "Clowns" who ride bikes and think they know better than anyone else how things should be."

Sure there are often trolls among the commenters. Does that mean they don't actually believe what they say? Does it mean that those who made the comments above aren't hostile towards cyclists? Does it mean that they don't reflect a significant element in our political culture?

Somewhere in the world of cycling advocacy, whether we can see it or not and whether we can accurately measure it or not, there is a line that reflects the state of public opinion about cyclists. This thread merely raised the issue for discussion. At no point did the OP state that hatred of cyclists is widespread. Nevertheless, it's clear that at least some hatred of cyclists does exist and that cycling advocates have much more work to do. We won't ever win the support of the hardcore haters but, with a good education campaign, progress is possible.
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Old 04-24-15, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by welshTerrier2
A spokesman for the Massachusetts State Police stated:

"After reviewing the videotaped interaction between a bicyclist and a state trooper that occurred Tuesday on the Longfellow Bridge, it is clear that the trooper’s statements regarding bike lanes and cyclists are wrong. Contrary to the tone and content of those statements, the State Police are concerned with, and have a responsibility to protect, the safety of bicyclists. As such, we have a duty to ensure safe conditions along any open bike lanes on roads under our jurisdiction. Earlier this year the Department issued a training bulletin reminding troopers of the rights and responsibilities of cyclists. That bulletin was re-issued this morning. Furthermore, the Department will reiterate to those troopers on the bridge Tuesday our responsibilities to bicyclists, and will counsel the trooper who spoke to the cyclist about the proper way to respond to concerns raised by members of the public."

And the basis of the thread wasn't just the trooper's attitude. It also made reference to the comments below the article. Here are a few:

"Anyway, I'm pretty sure all cyclists are a-holes."
"All cyclists suck"
"Buy a car you ass hole!"
"What a whiny granola crunching dolt."
"I know more than one bike commuter in long term care drooling on themselves and pôôpin in a diaper, due to this arrogance road takeover"
"The cyclist never even helped her...picked his bike up and went on his arrogant way....hate em!"
"And to show I mean it, you are more than welcome to ride your bike in front of me when I'm driving, please....I insist."
"Ya can't win Lisa with these entitled whiny yellow clad bicyclists"
"I should have slapped him of the head and thrown his bike into the Charles."
"Everyone is sick of these Lance Armstrong wannabes complaining all the time."
"He should be ignored like the rest of the "Clowns" who ride bikes and think they know better than anyone else how things should be."

Sure there are often trolls among the commenters. Does that mean they don't actually believe what they say? Does it mean that those who made the comments above aren't hostile towards cyclists? Does it mean that they don't reflect a significant element in our political culture?

Somewhere in the world of cycling advocacy, whether we can see it or not and whether we can accurately measure it or not, there is a line that reflects the state of public opinion about cyclists. This thread merely raised the issue for discussion. At no point did the OP state that hatred of cyclists is widespread. Nevertheless, it's clear that at least some hatred of cyclists does exist and that cycling advocates have much more work to do. We won't ever win the support of the hardcore haters but, with a good education campaign, progress is possible.
Thank you for posting this. I didn't see this the last time I was on the WCVB website.
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Old 04-24-15, 07:16 PM
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I suspect anyone going slower than average is included in the "hatred" part of drivers in general... JMO
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Old 04-24-15, 10:09 PM
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The problem is cyclists are people too.

A cyclist can be a,
Selfish jerk.
Arrogant ass.
Sniveling coward.
Emotionally defective.
Clueless fool.
Haughty zealot.

Or any number of human frailties, with the additional liability of being a stand out minority, which is probably the main problem. We all have faults, but are more inclined to be tolerant of those faults we know we also have even if we don't consciously admit it.
Some people focus their angst against cyclists for the same reason some cyclists will excuse any wrong doing by cyclists, the unwillingness to admit we are all part of the problem.
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Old 04-24-15, 10:21 PM
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I think people in general love cyclists. But cops often don't shine-up to strangers that call them "buddy". And then proceed to tell them how they are doing their job wrong... and suggesting they take the strangers directions. As opposed to legal processes known through extensive training. The guy that made the video has behavioral problems.
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Old 04-24-15, 10:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Cutter
I think people in general love cyclists. But cops often don't shine-up to strangers that call them "buddy". And then proceed to tell them how they are doing their job wrong... and suggesting they take the strangers directions. As opposed to legal processes known through extensive training. The guy that made the video has behavioral problems.
Contrary to what you have said, the law enforcement agency has reportedly decided to send the officer in question back to training on how to better deal with the public, as well as offered the cyclist to file a formal complaint. I almost mistook your comment as some from the video's comment field.
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Old 04-24-15, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Cutter
I think people in general love cyclists. But cops often don't shine-up to strangers that call them "buddy". And then proceed to tell them how they are doing their job wrong... and suggesting they take the strangers directions. As opposed to legal processes known through extensive training. The guy that made the video has behavioral problems.
I don't agree, that the cyclist who made the video has behavioral problems. But, I do agree with you about, his referring to the MSP trooper as 'buddy'. That was too personal. Since the trooper is part of the government of the State of Massachusetts. Also, I did feel he could have worded the directions better.
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Old 04-24-15, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by dynodonn
Contrary to what you have said, the law enforcement agency has reportedly decided to send the officer in question back to training on how to better deal with the public, as well as offered the cyclist to file a formal complaint.
Well thankfully.... I still live in an area where we require our police to only operate within the law..... and not bend to popular prejudices. I understand that "re-training" is now popular in the Northeast... in the quest for police-public justice. I hope that works out well for everyone concerned.

It sort of makes me wonder..... if the "new training" will eventually require the police to detain and question people who perpetrate such interventions.
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Old 04-24-15, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris516
I don't agree, that the cyclist who made the video has behavioral problems. .......
So.... if I show up at your job Monday... and start telling you how to do your job.... you won't see me as having anything wrong with MY behavior? Don't worry... my behavior isn't like that. Some people like to "play cop". Some of the people that like to play cop.... want to play Police Chief Inspector. And that is what the cyclist was doing.

The police in my area seem to handle traffic just fine without that cyclists..... directions. I bet the police in Boston could too!

Last edited by Dave Cutter; 04-24-15 at 11:03 PM.
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Old 04-25-15, 03:23 AM
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In general I don't think there is a hatred of cyclists and I've had very few negative interactions with drivers or other members of the general public. There will always be a select few people who just have to be arses but they are more of a nuisance than a problem 99% of the time. Very rarely I've had someone make an intentional close pass while laying on the horn or yelling out the window. Only once have I had something thrown at me after taking the right of way and making two guys in a pickup wait for <5 seconds to make a right on red.
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Old 04-25-15, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris516
Doesn't a cyclist have a right to expect to be passed safely.
Ofcourse you have the right to expect a vehicle to overtake you safely. But you don't have the right to block the road as a "precaution". You don't see cars blocking each because they are afraid the other car will overtake. Same rule applies for cyclists. Not only is this extremely selfish, it is also extremely dangerous. You are putting yourself in the direct path of vehicles and provoking very aggresive driving. Having to wait on a slow cyclist who is blocking the road, will make most drivers race ahead at 100mph as soon as they have even the slightest opputunity. And ofcourse the other cars in the jam caused by the road block will follow. The middle of the lane is for fast road users only. I can't think of anything more offensive as a cyclist on the road, than to block the road because I'm afraid of being overtaken. If your that afraid then you should avoid those roads or maybe cycling isn't for you. Blocking the road is certainly not the solution. I ride as close to the curb as humanly possible and I have never had any problem with cars overtaking me.
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Old 04-25-15, 06:19 AM
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Originally Posted by bronco71
Never?
I don't recall any hatred or disrespect. I think some cyclist have a tendency to make every traffic accident or bad maneuver into a discussion about hatred and disrespect. Traffic accidents just happen some times. Its the nature of the game. They happen for all road users and cyclists are no exception, even though we may be more exposed than other road users.
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Old 04-25-15, 06:32 AM
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Originally Posted by mozad655
Ofcourse you have the right to expect a vehicle to overtake you safely. But you don't have the right to block the road as a "precaution". You don't see cars blocking each because they are afraid the other car will overtake. Same rule applies for cyclists. Not only is this extremely selfish, it is also extremely dangerous. You are putting yourself in the direct path of vehicles and provoking very aggresive driving. Having to wait on a slow cyclist who is blocking the road, will make most drivers race ahead at 100mph as soon as they have even the slightest opputunity. And ofcourse the other cars in the jam caused by the road block will follow. The middle of the lane is for fast road users only. I can't think of anything more offensive as a cyclist on the road, than to block the road because I'm afraid of being overtaken. If your that afraid then you should avoid those roads or maybe cycling isn't for you. Blocking the road is certainly not the solution. I ride as close to the curb as humanly possible and I have never had any problem with cars overtaking me.
Ah yes, the curb hugging mentality. How do you make left turns then... please tell us... do you manage to actually leave the curb at some point... or do you go onto the curb, push the walk button and proceed across as a pedestrian.

If you make left turns from a left turn lane, at some point you may have actually "blocked" a lane... or do you sit patiently until there is no motor traffic what so ever... and then quickly dart across the lane from curb side to curb side.
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Old 04-25-15, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave Cutter
Well thankfully.... I still live in an area where we require our police to only operate within the law..... and not bend to popular prejudices. I understand that "re-training" is now popular in the Northeast... in the quest for police-public justice. I hope that works out well for everyone concerned.

It sort of makes me wonder..... if the "new training" will eventually require the police to detain and question people who perpetrate such interventions.
Prejudice?, the cyclist had a legit complaint, and in conversing with the LEO, felt that his complaint was going nowhere. Sure, the cyclist could have filed a complaint with the law enforcement involved, but chances are that the complaint would have been archived into some obscure data base.
Thanks to the media and the cyclist video, there was no chance of this law enforcement agency ignoring the situation, but though I feel that the cyclist may have unexpectedly received more attention than he was intending to get.
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Old 04-25-15, 07:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave Cutter
So.... if I show up at your job Monday... and start telling you how to do your job.... you won't see me as having anything wrong with MY behavior? Don't worry... my behavior isn't like that. Some people like to "play cop". Some of the people that like to play cop.... want to play Police Chief Inspector. And that is what the cyclist was doing.

The police in my area seem to handle traffic just fine without that cyclists..... directions. I bet the police in Boston could too!

Talk about throwing the cyclist under the bus. Again, the cyclist had a legit complaint about the LEO parking in the bike lane, with the LEO that he conversed with, and the law enforcement agency involved felt that he did too, in that the agency reportedly asked the cyclist to file one.

The officer is a public servant, and should be able to handle public input in a much better manner than he exhibited. He at least could have directed the cyclist to file a formal complaint at the very least.
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Old 04-25-15, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by mozad655
I don't recall any hatred or disrespect. I think some cyclist have a tendency to make every traffic accident or bad maneuver into a discussion about hatred and disrespect. Traffic accidents just happen some times. Its the nature of the game. They happen for all road users and cyclists are no exception, even though we may be more exposed than other road users.
It must be a cycling haven in your area, I was rather ecstatic when video cameras became compact and high definition enough to attach to a bicycle, and with my now videoing all my commutes. In videoing my commutes, though I have a very thick skin when it comes to motorists' driving behavior, I still report a minimum of two motorists a year for blatant aggressive driving,
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Old 04-25-15, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by dynodonn
Prejudice?
Yes.... as defined, Prejudice: preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience. It isn't always easy to dismiss opinion... and comply to the law. And recent events are pushing some area police to do just that.

Originally Posted by dynodonn
....the cyclist had a legit complaint,
Yes certainly... as the senior Police Officer on site... the cyclist was completely in charge and had full understanding of the situation. Or... he was a guy with behavioral problems who was off his meds and couldn't keep his nose to himself. Who knows?!?!? You prefer to think the random cyclist was in charge? Fine.... you go ahead.

Originally Posted by dynodonn
Talk about throwing the cyclist under the bus. Again, the cyclist had a legit complaint ......
Yes... he was on a bicycle! And obviously he was also a self-important so-and-so. I'd prefer to categorize him as the latter... than as a "cyclist".

Originally Posted by dynodonn
The officer is a public servant, and should be able to handle public input in a much better manner than he exhibited......
Public servant is defined as: a government official.... not as one who works at the direction of any bumkin that can navigate down a street. And maybe a stern "Move it along" would have been a better response for the officer. Being a policeman... wearing a badge... doesn't make anyone perfect.
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Old 04-25-15, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave Cutter
Yes.... as defined, Prejudice: preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience. It isn't always easy to dismiss opinion... and comply to the law. And recent events are pushing some area police to do just that.



Yes certainly... as the senior Police Officer on site... the cyclist was completely in charge and had full understanding of the situation. Or... he was a guy with behavioral problems who was off his meds and couldn't keep his nose to himself. Who knows?!?!? You prefer to think the random cyclist was in charge? Fine.... you go ahead.



Yes... he was on a bicycle! And obviously he was also a self-important so-and-so. I'd prefer to categorize him as the latter... than as a "cyclist".



Public servant is defined as: a government official.... not as one who works at the direction of any bumkin that can navigate down a street. And maybe a stern "Move it along" would have been a better response for the officer. Being a policeman... wearing a badge... doesn't make anyone perfect.
You seem to take issue with this cyclist's actions, thankfully that the law enforcement agency involved, and one of the larger regional bicycle advocacy groups happen to publicly disagree with much of your personal thoughts.

Last edited by dynodonn; 04-25-15 at 08:16 AM.
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Old 04-25-15, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by dynodonn
....... and with my now videoing all my commutes. In videoing my commutes, ........ I still report a minimum of two motorists a year for blatant aggressive driving,
I hadn't seen this post from you... before my previous posts. I apologize if you take my posts personally.

This "video technology" isn't exactly new.... but it IS still culturally unsettled. There is as-of-yet NO correct, acceptable way to secretly spy on private citizens. Although some people (apparently like yourself) see this technology as empowering.... many others see it as invasive and intrusive. Even lawyers and courts have mixed ideas about the legal use of such technology.

But one thing remains certain. Long before cameras became readily available... individuals with behavioral issues injected themselves into situations where they [in reality] had no authority. I understand..... in YOUR mind... you think recording the activity of others and reporting what you believe to be improper is normal. I think most people.... would see errors in your judgment. Just MHO.
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Old 04-25-15, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave Cutter
I hadn't seen this post from you... before my previous posts. I apologize if you take my posts personally.

This "video technology" isn't exactly new.... but it IS still culturally unsettled. There is as-of-yet NO correct, acceptable way to secretly spy on private citizens. Although some people (apparently like yourself) see this technology as empowering.... many others see it as invasive and intrusive. Even lawyers and courts have mixed ideas about the legal use of such technology.

But one thing remains certain. Long before cameras became readily available... individuals with behavioral issues injected themselves into situations where they [in reality] had no authority. I understand..... in YOUR mind... you think recording the activity of others and reporting what you believe to be improper is normal. I think most people.... would see errors in your judgment. Just MHO.
Personally, I do not make my videos available to the public, but other cyclists will, such the one being discussed, and that is their choice. I use my videos only to gather better information so I can make a much more detailed report to give to the local law enforcement that happens to have jurisdiction at the time. I don't see myself as "playing cop", no more than the cyclist reporting that the bike lane being blocked.
Our local state highway patrol division responds quickly if there is any object blocking a normal travel lane on a local highway or freeway, and I feel that this situation should have been basically treated in the same manner.
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