Would a self driving car world make it safe for cyclists?
06-25-17, 03:32 AM
#326
genec
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Please explain or translate what "ins co claims of fewer collisions" means in regards to vehicles that don't currently exist and may (or may not ever) be owned and driven by the public in the future. Do you mean insurance company speculation about future claims on futuristic cars driven on futuristic traffic road systems?
I mean, and provided links for insurance company claims that vehicles equipped with AEB (automatic emergency braking) have typically had fewer collisions than vehicles without AEB.
AEB is a technology that has been developed as one of the features of self driving technology. It is available now in several production vehicles. (I offered a current list). Yes there are ads that tout this life saving technology. It is a standard agreed upon for all new cars by 2022.
This is not some future hype. You can own a car today with this self driving collision avoidance feature that reacts faster than humans and controls the brakes of your car.
Now since you act like you have not been following the thread (this AEB stuff was only in the last few pages), why all the attitude. I offered links and quotes for all my claims... not just speculation.
Have you driven a car made in this current century... how about a car made in the last year or so... one that has some of the features mentioned in this thread?
06-25-17, 03:52 AM
#327
C*pt*i* Obvious
On June 18, 2013, Hastings died in a single vehicle automobile crash in his Mercedes C250 Coupé at approximately 4:25 a.m. in the Hancock Park neighborhood of Los Angeles.[55] A witness to the crash said the car seemed to be traveling at maximum speed and was creating sparks and flames before it fishtailed and crashed into a palm tree.[56][57] Video from a nearby security camera reportedly shows Hastings' vehicle speeding and bursting into flames.[58]
Witnesses described the car's engine being ejected 50 to 60 yards (46–55 m) from the scene.[57][59] Hastings' body was burned beyond recognition. The coroner identified the body by matching fingerprints with those the FBI had on file.[60][61] Two days after the crash, the Los Angeles Police Department declared that there were no signs of foul play.[62] The coroner's report ruled the death to be an accident.[63] An autopsy showed that the cause of death was massive blunt force trauma consistent with a high-speed crash.[63]
Former U.S. National Coordinator for Security, Infrastructure Protection, and Counter-terrorism Richard A. Clarke said that what is known about the crash is "consistent with a car cyber attack". He was quoted as saying "There is reason to believe that intelligence agencies for major powers — including the United States — know how to remotely seize control of a car. So if there were a cyber attack on [Hastings'] car — and I'm not saying there was, I think whoever did it would probably get away with it."[68]
Witnesses described the car's engine being ejected 50 to 60 yards (46–55 m) from the scene.[57][59] Hastings' body was burned beyond recognition. The coroner identified the body by matching fingerprints with those the FBI had on file.[60][61] Two days after the crash, the Los Angeles Police Department declared that there were no signs of foul play.[62] The coroner's report ruled the death to be an accident.[63] An autopsy showed that the cause of death was massive blunt force trauma consistent with a high-speed crash.[63]
Former U.S. National Coordinator for Security, Infrastructure Protection, and Counter-terrorism Richard A. Clarke said that what is known about the crash is "consistent with a car cyber attack". He was quoted as saying "There is reason to believe that intelligence agencies for major powers — including the United States — know how to remotely seize control of a car. So if there were a cyber attack on [Hastings'] car — and I'm not saying there was, I think whoever did it would probably get away with it."[68]
06-25-17, 04:10 AM
#328
genec
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Here's a great example of just how safe modern cars are.
So if there were a cyber attack on [Hastings'] car — and I'm not saying there was.....
THEY can blow up your smartphone too... any time THEY want to.
06-25-17, 04:23 AM
#329
C*pt*i* Obvious
I don't recall older dumbphones having this vulnerability?
Enjoy your automated utopia.
I'm sure nothing can go wrong.
Enjoy your automated utopia.
I'm sure nothing can go wrong.
06-25-17, 08:21 AM
#330
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06-25-17, 08:33 AM
#331
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Now since you act like you have not been following the thread (this AEB stuff was only in the last few pages), why all the attitude. I offered links and quotes for all my claims... not just speculation.
Have you driven a car made in this current century... how about a car made in the last year or so... one that has some of the features mentioned in this thread?
Have you driven a car made in this current century... how about a car made in the last year or so... one that has some of the features mentioned in this thread?
You might as well offer links and quotes about the introduction of automatic transmissions, automatic temperature controls and air bags into production cars as evidence about the future of self driving cars.
Last edited by I-Like-To-Bike; 06-25-17 at 08:43 AM.
06-25-17, 08:41 AM
#332
genec
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Uh, the AEB stuff is here today. Not some future far off thing.
So have you driven a car made in the last 2 years yet?
So have you driven a car made in the last 2 years yet?
06-25-17, 08:43 AM
#333
C*pt*i* Obvious
Modern medicine and all the other technological wonders like GMO food will only increase dependence on technology.
Planned obsolescence has only just begun.
06-25-17, 08:51 AM
#335
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You have nothing to contribute.
You don't care about the current technology. Much less about what is being developed.
You just show up to throw a wrench into the works... and don't even bother to follow links.
Have a nice day, now go away.
06-25-17, 09:03 AM
#336
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Any evidence that the self driving car system of the indeterminate future will be any safer while still delivering an equivalent freedom of personal transportation/mobility? Besides the usual sales promotion by the PR flacks and industry fan boys.
06-25-17, 09:07 AM
#337
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Let me know when you spot a real live self driving car (Level 4) in the wild.
Until then continue to amuse yourself imagining that a modern feature or two in a production car makes it a self driving car.
Last edited by I-Like-To-Bike; 06-25-17 at 09:11 AM.
06-25-17, 09:17 AM
#338
C*pt*i* Obvious
If it isn't obvious already, there will be far less "freedom of personal transportation and mobility" in the future.
Compare with the introduction of the automobile, in the beginning there weren't many rules, it was completely voluntary to have a drivers license or insurance.
Currently, owning a car is often a requirement, not a choice for millions of people all over the world.
Compare with the introduction of the automobile, in the beginning there weren't many rules, it was completely voluntary to have a drivers license or insurance.
Currently, owning a car is often a requirement, not a choice for millions of people all over the world.
06-25-17, 10:23 AM
#339
Senior Member
Anyone who says that self driving vehicles won't happen is right there with the persons/people that said we couldn't and never will go to the moon. Guess what it could be done and we did it... 
As to when it will actually happen that is the question in my mind.
Also will it be safer than human driven vehicles, that too is a forgone conclusion that is a big YES, eventually they will be safer than a human driven vehicle. Not the slightest doubt about that . IMO
Will they be mass marketed is another question that is up in the air, as not everything that can be made is out there...
As to when it will actually happen that is the question in my mind.
Also will it be safer than human driven vehicles, that too is a forgone conclusion that is a big YES, eventually they will be safer than a human driven vehicle. Not the slightest doubt about that . IMO
Will they be mass marketed is another question that is up in the air, as not everything that can be made is out there...
06-25-17, 11:32 AM
#340
Yo
I agree. I think they are doing it already. even though genec lives in utopia he/she is right about AEB, when I changed insurance companies recently they asked if we had AEB on either of our cars, we would get a discount if we did. But we are still a LONG way from self driving cars. It may never happen.
06-25-17, 11:59 AM
#341
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Automatic seat belts
Driver-side and passenger-side airbags
Anti-Lock Brakes
Daytime Running Lights
Blind Spot Detection and Lane-Departure Warning Systems
Rearview Cameras
Tire-Pressure Monitoring Systems
Anti-Theft Systems
Stolen Vehicle Recovery Systems
Emergency Response Systems.
Installation of every single one of the above plus every other modern feature currently available for use on production motor vehicles will not make the vehicle a self driving car no matter how much the insurance rate drops, or how many men walked on the moon, or how amazing smart phones may be, or how many wishful thinking scenarios have been spun up by dreamers and speculators.
06-25-17, 12:15 PM
#342
Senior Member
Hey ILTB, glad to see you believe that men have actually walked on the moon... 
Last edited by 350htrr; 06-25-17 at 12:17 PM. Reason: spelling
06-25-17, 12:32 PM
#343
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Anyone who says that self driving vehicles won't happen is right there with the persons/people that said we couldn't and never will go to the moon. Guess what it could be done and we did it...
As to when it will actually happen that is the question in my mind.
Also will it be safer than human driven vehicles, that too is a forgone conclusion that is a big YES, eventually they will be safer than a human driven vehicle. Not the slightest doubt about that . IMO
Will they be mass marketed is another question that is up in the air, as not everything that can be made is out there...
As to when it will actually happen that is the question in my mind.
Also will it be safer than human driven vehicles, that too is a forgone conclusion that is a big YES, eventually they will be safer than a human driven vehicle. Not the slightest doubt about that . IMO
Will they be mass marketed is another question that is up in the air, as not everything that can be made is out there...
Somebody said it;
You Believe it;
That settles it!
"It" being anything that might happen someday, maybe.
06-25-17, 12:58 PM
#344
genec
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I agree. I think they are doing it already. even though genec lives in utopia he/she is right about AEB, when I changed insurance companies recently they asked if we had AEB on either of our cars, we would get a discount if we did. But we are still a LONG way from self driving cars. It may never happen.
But the question the OP asked was in future terms... "Would a self driving car world make it safe for cyclists."
Well the only real response to that is "if the car obeys all the rules of the road, yes, it would make it safe for cyclists."
Whether that will actually happen is a different thread. But the technology is advancing... and evidence of that is AEB and the list of other collision avoidance technologies that are available now.
The actual self driving part is still off in the future... and no, it is not available today, and indeed it may never come to pass. For that, we just have to be patient and wait. There is no magic eight ball.
06-25-17, 05:08 PM
#345
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Of course not all unsafe motor vehicle events are caused by failure to follow the rules of the road, for example events caused by unpredictable large animals, unseen/undetected road conditions such as potholes and ice, mechanical failure, and in the future perhaps software and/or computer failure.
06-25-17, 06:18 PM
#346
Senior Member
That is true in regards to unsafe motor vehicle events (collisions AKA "accidents") that are caused by a failure to follow the rules of the road, whether the car is driven by a human or computer software. Perhaps future driving systems will raise compliance rates without shutting down the system willy-nilly, perhaps not.
Of course not all unsafe motor vehicle events are caused by failure to follow the rules of the road, for example events caused by unpredictable large animals, unseen/undetected road conditions such as potholes and ice, mechanical failure, and in the future perhaps software and/or computer failure.
Of course not all unsafe motor vehicle events are caused by failure to follow the rules of the road, for example events caused by unpredictable large animals, unseen/undetected road conditions such as potholes and ice, mechanical failure, and in the future perhaps software and/or computer failure.
I believe a few years ago it was 50,000 people who died every year on N American roads... Why is down, to 40,000 a year,? surly it is NOT, because of "the better " driving by the populace over the last decade...
Last edited by 350htrr; 06-25-17 at 07:38 PM.
06-25-17, 07:29 PM
#347
Senior Member
Remember about a year ago, I was obsessed about the world becoming safer for cyclists. I literally wish we had our own cycling highways. But everyday I hear more and more about safer self driving car technology. Now I don't really know how close we are till this technology is improved or perfected. I really don't know.
But if this technology did take off in say 10 years and it was proven to be 100 x safer than human driving, would that be good news for cyclists? Could we just cycle every road without any worries? Imagine what a heaven that would be for us. Just saying.
But if this technology did take off in say 10 years and it was proven to be 100 x safer than human driving, would that be good news for cyclists? Could we just cycle every road without any worries? Imagine what a heaven that would be for us. Just saying.
06-25-17, 08:06 PM
#348
What happened?
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We have 15 pages for a yes/no type answer. I think that explains explaining.
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06-25-17, 10:16 PM
#349
C*pt*i* Obvious
This is about advanced technology that has not yet been released to the public.
So it might actually merit a healthy discussion.
Feel free to ignore this topic, or better yet this forum if you having nothing to add.
06-25-17, 10:30 PM
#350
C*pt*i* Obvious
Public transportation moves millions of people every day, most of it would come to a grinding halt with a simple power outage.
Imagine everyone is connected to the automated matrix, cars, trucks, buses, airplanes, drones, and almost everything that moves. Given that this technology will most likely be centrally controlled, (for efficiency and cost reasons) what happens when there is malicious code or a bad actor that causes that entire system to malfunction?
I highly doubt that kind of scenario will end well.
Imagine everyone is connected to the automated matrix, cars, trucks, buses, airplanes, drones, and almost everything that moves. Given that this technology will most likely be centrally controlled, (for efficiency and cost reasons) what happens when there is malicious code or a bad actor that causes that entire system to malfunction?
I highly doubt that kind of scenario will end well.
Last edited by SHBR; 06-25-17 at 10:33 PM.
