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Would a self driving car world make it safe for cyclists?

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Would a self driving car world make it safe for cyclists?

Old 03-06-18, 07:40 PM
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"It's flat, I tell you, flat. Flat, flat, flat!"
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Old 03-06-18, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
"It's flat, I tell you, flat. Flat, flat, flat!"
Yes, it is... To some people...
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Old 03-06-18, 08:51 PM
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Another extract from the cited article (bolding is mine):
"Uber's trucks stick to the highway

Uber's current Arizona pilot program does not feature trucks making end-to-end runs from pick-up to delivery.

Instead, Uber's Volvo trucks — which have Uber truck drivers monitoring matters from the driver's seat — focus solely on autonomous highway driving.

The way Uber's trucking program works is that trucks driven by humans arrive at hubs set up at weigh stations near the Arizona border, where their trailers' loads are switched over to Uber's Volvos.

These trucks are equipped with hardware, software and an array of sensors developed by Uber's Advanced Technologies Group that help the truck make what amounts to a glorified cruise-control run across the state. Uber ATG also is behind ongoing self-driving car testing in Arizona, Pennsylvania and San Francisco.


Uber did not disclose what items it is transporting for which companies.

Once the Uber trucks exit at the next highway hub near the Arizona border, they are met by truckers who hitch the trailer to own their cab to finish the delivery."

Sounds like another glorified cruise control operation on specially selected roads (test tracks) that fit the limited capabilities of the software. Let everybody know when Uber AV trucks make deliveries in AZ cities without drivers, until then there is nothing to see here but an advanced cruise control perhaps good enough for AZ where the state officials are happy to be in the AV promoters' pocket.
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Old 03-06-18, 09:01 PM
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Of course it is in its infancy. The amazing part is that it is happening and learning and developing every day. Just wait for the terrible twos and then the teen years.
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Old 03-06-18, 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by noisebeam
Of course it is in its infancy. The amazing part is that it is happening and learning and developing every day. Just wait for the terrible twos and then the teen years.
Of course it is in its infancy. Despite what some soothsayers are predicting, successful fielding of a practical driver less vehicle suitable for personal or commercial use is not right around the corner, nor is such success inevitable or guaranteed, no matter how much money is thrown at the project.
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Old 03-07-18, 04:22 AM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
These trucks are equipped with hardware, software and an array of sensors developed by Uber's Advanced Technologies Group that help the truck make what amounts to a glorified cruise-control run across the state.
Funny, when I put my car on cruise control it doesn't steer itself.

Maybe yours does?
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Old 03-07-18, 06:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
Funny, when I put my car on cruise control it doesn't steer itself.

Maybe yours does?
Absolutely ILTB's cruise control does. Your cruise control doesn't?

(Note when ILTB uses cruise control it keeps crashing into things though. Total mystery why.)

-mr. bill

Last edited by mr_bill; 03-07-18 at 08:09 AM.
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Old 03-07-18, 08:29 AM
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BTW, does anyone here know how a jar of Jif gets to your local Walmart?

(Hint, they don't drive it in a single truck from Kentucky to the local Walmart.)

-mr. bill

Last edited by mr_bill; 03-07-18 at 09:42 AM.
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Old 03-07-18, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
Of course it is in its infancy. Despite what some soothsayers are predicting, successful fielding of a practical driver less vehicle suitable for personal or commercial use is not right around the corner, nor is such success inevitable or guaranteed, no matter how much money is thrown at the project.
I'm amazed Uber is far enough along to do this. Just keep in mind, Waymo technology is way ahead of what Uber was able to steal from them.
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Old 03-07-18, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Ninety5rpm
I'm amazed Uber is far enough along to do this. Just keep in mind, Waymo technology is way ahead of what Uber was able to steal from them.
I'd place my bet on a runner ahead at the first mile post of a marathon too, especially when the other runner is lame. The finish line (a fielded practical/profitable driver less vehicle capable of transporting passengers or cargo on paying trips other than shuttle service on a handful of selected routes) is a long way off though.
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Old 03-07-18, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
I'd place my bet on a runner ahead at the first mile post of a marathon too, especially when the other runner is lame. The finish line (a fielded practical/profitable driver less vehicle capable of transporting passengers or cargo on paying trips other than shuttle service on a handful of selected routes) is a long way off though.
Yeah, I think it's still more than a month before Waymo starts their service in Phoenix (initially limited to an area within the Phoenix metro, but not to any particular routes, and probably growing to the full metro area within a year or two).
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Old 03-07-18, 12:25 PM
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https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/...san-francisco/

Raging human drivers slap, body slam innocent self-driving cars
Those people are going to be sorry when Skynet becomes self aware.
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Old 03-08-18, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Ninety5rpm
I keep saying that I don't think that's going to be an issue,
You keep saying a lot of things without objective facts to back them up. Doesn't do any more to make them true than the vastly more repetitions we get from the flat earth, government mind control and chemtrail loonies.
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Old 03-08-18, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by KD5NRH
You keep saying a lot of things without objective facts to back them up. Doesn't do any more to make them true than the vastly more repetitions we get from the flat earth, government mind control and chemtrail loonies.
I would say, he is "extrapolating" from the past, but (recent) things that worked out, Internet, cell phones, digital TV... If 100 years ago you would have said these kind of thing would become "common place", you would have been marginalized.. JUST like what is kind of happening here...
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Old 03-09-18, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
Funny, when I put my car on cruise control it doesn't steer itself.

Maybe yours does?
Miy personal car, no, but I did work on this for a bit at my last place of employment: Super Cruise - Hands Free Driving | Cadillac Ownership.

Some of my current programs include the lane keep systems as well, which will keep your car in lane. They're actually quite annoying when I forget to shut them off on the test track doing other things, with them fighting my input directing the car out of lanes that aren't applicable to what I am doing.
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Old 03-09-18, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by jefnvk
Miy personal car, no, but I did work on this for a bit at my last place of employment: Super Cruise - Hands Free Driving | Cadillac Ownership.
That's just glorified cruise control on a 130,000 mile long test track.

-mr. bill
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Old 03-09-18, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by jefnvk
Miy personal car, no, but I did work on this for a bit at my last place of employment: Super Cruise - Hands Free Driving | Cadillac Ownership.

Some of my current programs include the lane keep systems as well, which will keep your car in lane. They're actually quite annoying when I forget to shut them off on the test track doing other things, with them fighting my input directing the car out of lanes that aren't applicable to what I am doing.
Your guess is as good as mine as to how well the so-called self driving Uber trucks actually operate in AZ or would operate in a scenario not guarded in secrecy by a company with a better reputation for ethics. See https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/06/t...ng-trucks.html
Extracts:
"The trucks operate with a licensed truck driver at the wheel, ready to take over in the case of an emergency."
"Uber isn’t saying much about its self-driving trucks. It won’t disclose how many trucks it is using, how many miles they’ve driven or how often the human safety drivers had to intervene and assist the autonomous system. It is also not revealing many details about how the transfer hubs would work — including what they would look like, where they would be located and how the company planned to roll them out."
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Old 03-09-18, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by mr_bill
That's just glorified cruise control on a 130,000 mile long test track.

-mr. bill
Correct, glorified cruise control with a driver available at the controls. 0 miles of driving on the road without human driver oversight.
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Old 03-09-18, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
Your guess is as good as mine as to how well the so-called self driving Uber trucks actually operate in AZ or would operate in a scenario not guarded in secrecy by a company with a better reputation for ethics
I can separate the technology available from the ethics of the companies developing it. The fact of the matter is, that in a large portion of use cases that both fleet vehicles and truck respectively see, the technology exists and is at minimum as safe as humans. Is it perfect? Absolutely not, but neither is what we currently have killing 30k+ people a year.

Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
Correct, glorified cruise control with a driver available at the controls. 0 miles of driving on the road without human driver oversight.
Guess all that autonomous flying software that has made pretty much eliminated accidental fatalities in flying is pretty unproven too, since we require TWO people to watch it.
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Old 03-09-18, 01:21 PM
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And no existing autopilots will take you all the way from gate-to-gate.

Taxi from gate and takeoff are under manual control.
And taxi to gate after rollout is under manual control.


-mr. bill
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Old 03-09-18, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
"The trucks operate with a licensed truck driver at the wheel, ready to take over in the case of an emergency."
The human truck drivers are training their robot replacements.
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Old 03-09-18, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
"It is also not revealing many details about how the transfer hubs would work — including what they would look like, where they would be located and how the company planned to roll them out."
Yeah, it's a complete mystery how transfer hubs would work - nobody knows what they would look like, where they would be located or how anybody could roll them out.

-mr. bill

Last edited by mr_bill; 03-09-18 at 02:04 PM.
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Old 03-09-18, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by jefnvk
I can separate the technology available from the ethics of the companies developing it. The fact of the matter is, that in a large portion of use cases that both fleet vehicles and truck respectively see, the technology exists and is at minimum as safe as humans. Is it perfect? Absolutely not, but neither is what we currently have killing 30k+ people a year.



Guess all that autonomous flying software that has made pretty much eliminated accidental fatalities in flying is pretty unproven too, since we require TWO people to watch it.
Apparently you can't separate the technology available for flying commercial airlines in its environment and that for driving vehicles on public roads. No different than those who wish to extrapolate a guaranteed successful future for self driving cars from the unrelated and irrelevant success of smartphones.

You may be among those more bedazzled by press releases about test results from ethics deficient organizations.
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Old 03-09-18, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
Apparently you can't separate the technology available for flying commercial airlines in its environment and that for driving vehicles on public roads. No different than those who wish to extrapolate a guaranteed successful future for self driving cars from the unrelated and irrelevant success of smartphones.

You may be among those more bedazzled by press releases about test results from ethics deficient organizations.
The difference is what, exactly? You are implying you can't trust computers to drive cars, because they have oversight (which isn't generally being used to override the vehicle, and which is slowly starting to go away completely). Why do you trust airplanes, who we still require two pilots to monitor even though the majority of what they do is sit around and stare at gauges?
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Old 03-09-18, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by KD5NRH
You keep saying a lot of things without objective facts to back them up. Doesn't do any more to make them true than the vastly more repetitions we get from the flat earth, government mind control and chemtrail loonies.
In the very same post I cited a source that gives very good reason for what I was saying: government regulations are not going to be a significant roadblock to the rolling out of AV technology.
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