Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Advocacy & Safety
Reload this Page >

Should young children be riding on busy MUPs?

Notices
Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

Should young children be riding on busy MUPs?

Old 05-26-17, 07:33 AM
  #1  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
asmac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,261

Bikes: Salsa Vaya

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 172 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Should young children be riding on busy MUPs?

We had a recent tragic case in which a 5-year-old was riding on an MUP beside a busy road, protected by a curb, when he veered off the path into the street and was killed.


Here's a link: Stretch of Lake Shore Road where boy was killed 'a tragedy waiting to happen,' says safety advocate - CBC.ca | Metro Morning


There are often families out on these paths teaching very young kids to ride and it seems to me that it's a bad idea. Obviously one slows down and tries to avoid them as they wobble around with no idea of where the right side is but it seems like a bad idea to be there in the first place. Better barriers might be a good idea but I don't think it the issue in this case.
asmac is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 07:47 AM
  #2  
Standard Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Brunswick, Maine
Posts: 4,239

Bikes: 1948 P. Barnard & Son, 1962 Rudge Sports, 1963 Freddie Grubb Routier, 1980 Manufrance Hirondelle, 1983 F. Moser Sprint, 1989 Raleigh Technium Pre, 2001 Raleigh M80

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1290 Post(s)
Liked 925 Times in 482 Posts
The problem isn't the M.U.P. or the age of the users. The M.U.P. should never have been put next to a busy road without a fence or some other sort of barrier.
On M.U.P.'s that are protected from motor traffic, the users, young and old alike, only have to be concerned with the (fortunately rare) bike riders, runners, rollerbladers, etc. who do not have the self-control to travel slowly enough to keep everyone safe. If you see a child up ahead (on a bike or on foot), slow to a crawl or get off your bike and walk it. These paths are supposed to be safe for everyone.
1989Pre is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 08:04 AM
  #3  
Time to Fly!
 
Bikeforumuser0019's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 336
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 23 Times in 12 Posts
Originally Posted by 1989Pre
If you see a child up ahead (on a bike or on foot), slow to a crawl or get off your bike and walk it. These paths are supposed to be safe for everyone.
Physical safety is pretty close to the bottom of Maslow's hierarchy of needs. If a driver sees a child up ahead, even if it's on a MUP that is "protected" by a curb, they have a responsibility to slow down. Every person deserves safety regardless of their age, where they are, or what activity they're doing.
Bikeforumuser0019 is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 08:09 AM
  #4  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I grew up riding on suburban streets in southern California and am not sure if my parents were failing to be responsible then or if today we're unrealistically focused on 100% safety. Or perhaps some of today's MUPs are more dangerous for child bicyclists than my neighborhood's streets were.

You do have me considering that I would not recommend young children riding on the most popular local MUP near me because of the high-speed bike traffic on it. There are other paths around here that would be safer for children.
Gidgmom is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 09:20 AM
  #5  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
asmac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,261

Bikes: Salsa Vaya

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 172 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by College3.0
If a driver sees a child up ahead, even if it's on a MUP that is "protected" by a curb, they have a responsibility to slow down.

Agreed but there it is also the responsibility of parents to supervise their young children and not put them in harm's way. MUPs are not just recreational. People actually use them to get somewhere. The idea of getting off and walking every time you see a kid is a bit much.
asmac is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 09:30 AM
  #6  
Time to Fly!
 
Bikeforumuser0019's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 336
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 23 Times in 12 Posts
Originally Posted by asmac
Agreed but there it is also the responsibility of parents to supervise their young children and not put them in harm's way. MUPs are not just recreational. People actually use them to get somewhere. The idea of getting off and walking every time you see a kid is a bit much.
In this particular instance, the child was struck by a motor vehicle, not a bicyclist. It was because he fell into traffic that was on the other side of a curb separating vehicles from the MUP. No child deserves to get smashed on the grill of a car. And no one's parents deserve that, either. No amount of blaming the victims is OK in this situation.

Regarding MUPs, since I personally don't use any MUP on a regular basis I have no comment about how an adult user of such should accommodate a child user. However, I would hazard a guess "with all respect due". Just because the presence of a child poses an inconvenience for an adult using a MUP doesn't mean the child or their parents are doing something wrong.

Discretion on a case by case basis. Again, safety is a fairly basic need; everyone deserve safety.

Last edited by Bikeforumuser0019; 05-26-17 at 09:38 AM.
Bikeforumuser0019 is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 09:51 AM
  #7  
New Orleans
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,794
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 157 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Tragedy
but 5 yo kids can't safely control a bike
many parents don't have any feel for what is safe
"I did it when I was a kid-I didn't die-so my kid won't"
It is the parent's fault-
a kid-barely more than a toddler- didn't belong anywhere NEAR car traffic

The MUP-tiny curb- the curb MIGHT make it more dangerous-bump it sideswipe it-and you will lose control-kind or adult
better off without the curb-
phoebeisis is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 09:59 AM
  #8  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
asmac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,261

Bikes: Salsa Vaya

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 172 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
It's not a matter of blaming victims (a go-to conversation stopper in A&S) but a matter of looking at the cause of a tragedy and thinking about how another similar incident might be avoided. I'm sure the parents are doing enough self-blaming and I expect they wish they had never gone for that ride.


In my opinion, anyone using a busy path should have the ability and judgment to use it safely and we should act reasonably to accommodate others. I wouldn't send a young kid down a busy ski hill on their first day out on the assumption everyone else would avoid them and I would apply the same to an MUP. Anyhow, I'm very fortunate I was never caught out when making an error in judgment with my kids. There but for the grace of god...
asmac is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 10:10 AM
  #9  
Time to Fly!
 
Bikeforumuser0019's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 336
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 23 Times in 12 Posts
Originally Posted by asmac
We had a recent tragic case in which a 5-year-old was riding on an MUP beside a busy road, protected by a curb, when he veered off the path into the street and was killed.


Here's a link: Stretch of Lake Shore Road where boy was killed 'a tragedy waiting to happen,' says safety advocate - CBC.ca | Metro Morning


There are often families out on these paths teaching very young kids to ride and it seems to me that it's a bad idea. Obviously one slows down and tries to avoid them as they wobble around with no idea of where the right side is but it seems like a bad idea to be there in the first place. Better barriers might be a good idea but I don't think it the issue in this case.

You should have titled this thread differently, because it doesn't seem like the article is about a "busy MUP" at all.... it's about a child who fell into high-speed traffic within more-or-less 6 inches of a MUP, which had no protective barrier in between.
Bikeforumuser0019 is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 10:12 AM
  #10  
Time to Fly!
 
Bikeforumuser0019's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 336
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 23 Times in 12 Posts
Originally Posted by asmac
It's not a matter of blaming victims (a go-to conversation stopper in A&S) but a matter of looking at the cause of a tragedy and thinking about how another similar incident might be avoided. I'm sure the parents are doing enough self-blaming and I expect they wish they had never gone for that ride.


In my opinion, anyone using a busy path should have the ability and judgment to use it safely and we should act reasonably to accommodate others. I wouldn't send a young kid down a busy ski hill on their first day out on the assumption everyone else would avoid them and I would apply the same to an MUP. Anyhow, I'm very fortunate I was never caught out when making an error in judgment with my kids. There but for the grace of god...

The article is not about a busy MUP. It's about a traffic-related death. They even state in the article that it's an infrastructure problem, and no one was at fault.
Bikeforumuser0019 is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 10:17 AM
  #11  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
asmac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,261

Bikes: Salsa Vaya

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 172 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by College3.0
The article is not about a busy MUP. It's about a traffic-related death. They even state in the article that it's an infrastructure problem, and no one was at fault.


As it happens it is a busy MUP that I use regularly and I have never felt unsafe. Some people are trying to turn it into an infrastructure issue and ignoring the fact that no one should be riding there if they can't control where they are going. I see it all the time and think it's worth discussing.
asmac is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 10:39 AM
  #12  
Cycle Year Round
 
CB HI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 13,644
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1316 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times in 59 Posts
Early on, cyclist lobbied and worked for the construction of Bike Paths for commuting away from motorized traffic. Cyclist especially wanted cut throughs for more direct routes in the suburbs.

Cyclist lobbied and got 1% of Federal Transportation funds for use in building Bike Paths for commuting. Cyclist were happy with the new Bike Paths and politicians were happy to have those cyclist off car roads.

Cyclist used the Bike Paths for safe fast transportation as well as safe recreation and safely teaching our kids how to ride a bicycle. All was fine in cycling world.

Hikers and dog walkers got jealous with the Bike Paths. Their sidewalks were no longer good enough. So they started hiking and walking their dogs on the Bike Paths. These walkers demanded to be allowed legally on the Bike Paths. Not wanting to loose votes, Politicians had a solution, let us just rename these transportation Bike Paths into Multi-Use Paths (MUPs).

The walkers then wanted Bike Paths now called MUPs to be more like sidewalks but not sidewalks, and complained about the fast commuting cyclist that the Bike Paths now called MUPs were designed for. So Politicians put up 10 mph speed limit signs.

Then slow recreational cyclist began to whine unendingly about fellow cyclist who cycled too fast for the slow cyclist liking (you know, the fast commuting cyclist that got the Bike Paths now called MUPs build in the first place). So they began calling the fellow cyclist kitted or racer wannabe boys as terms of derision and demanded those kinds of cyclist use the car roads for their fast cycling.

Now these Bike Paths now called MUPs are no longer useful for transportation. That does not stop Politicians from demanding that the 1% of Federal Transportation funds be used for these new MUPs, all that is required is that they lie, claiming the new MUP is primarily for transportation use.

Now slow cyclist want to even kick the kids off the Bike Paths now called MUPs.



.
__________________
Land of the Free, Because of the Brave.

Last edited by CB HI; 05-26-17 at 10:49 AM.
CB HI is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 10:47 AM
  #13  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,256
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4232 Post(s)
Liked 1,333 Times in 924 Posts
Originally Posted by asmac
There are often families out on these paths teaching very young kids to ride and it seems to me that it's a bad idea.
MUPS (busy ones) are not really appropriate places for "teaching very young kids".
njkayaker is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 10:53 AM
  #14  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,256
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4232 Post(s)
Liked 1,333 Times in 924 Posts
Originally Posted by College3.0
It was because he fell into traffic that was on the other side of a curb separating vehicles from the MUP.
The path appears to be at curb level. The curb really isn't a barrier. Riders can just roll off the path into the roadway.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.6346...=en&authuser=0
njkayaker is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 11:10 AM
  #15  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Ottawa,ON,Canada
Posts: 1,272

Bikes: Schwinn Miranda 1990, Giant TCX 2 2012

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 486 Post(s)
Liked 10 Times in 7 Posts
When I was ridding when my kids were that age, he would ride between me and the side of the road. I prefer if he would run into me than hit by a car.
SylvainG is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 11:12 AM
  #16  
genec
 
genec's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Posts: 27,079

Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2

Mentioned: 86 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13658 Post(s)
Liked 4,532 Times in 3,158 Posts
Originally Posted by College3.0
You should have titled this thread differently, because it doesn't seem like the article is about a "busy MUP" at all.... it's about a child who fell into high-speed traffic within more-or-less 6 inches of a MUP, which had no protective barrier in between.
A road safety advocate is calling on the city to install more barriers between roadways and bike lanes after a 5-year-old boy was killed on Wednesday while cycling on Lake Shore Boulevard.
The terminology of the above quote is a bit misleading... at least to an American reader. This is an actual path not a "bike lane." It does parallel the Lake Shore Blvd as can be seen here in this google map link: https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ma....4288342?hl=en

Technically it might be considered a "sidepath," except it does not just parallel the road, but leaves that proximity and goes through some parks.

The argument given in the OP and other comments is regarding children on paths being in danger. The danger here is actually the proximity to the road and that someone young and unguided might go out on the road or fall into the road. This is a completely different issue from that of speed differential on a bike path or MUP.

Now, having said all that, about a path I have never been on, and merely researched on the web... let me say this about bike paths for transportation and MUPs: Any users of any transportation facilities, be they sidewalks, MUPs, paths, horse trails, or just plain old streets is responsible for not hitting or colliding with those in front of them. It really is that simple. You must take caution to avoid hitting those folks in front of you... regardless of your mode. If you are driving, you do not hit the cars, bikes, or pedestrians in front of you. If you are cycling, you do not hit the slower cyclists, pedestrians, skateboarders, etc in front of you. If you are running, you do not hit the walking people in front of you.

It really is that simple... anyone closing on anyone else in front of them, has the responsibility to avoid hitting what is in front of them.

Now we can go on to best designs for MUPs and high speed paths and all the discussions that rise from good and bad design. I will throw in my own anecdote about a particular transportation path in San Diego. This is the route 56 path that runs from Poway area to Sorrento Valley. This path was in part designed by Cal Trans to allow transportation cyclists to commute from the east county to the area of Sorrento Valley when a farm highway was converted to a limited access freeway.

Most of the path is well designed, with two wide well marked lanes, access to traffic light signal buttons and high quality bridges that span the gorges in the area.

https://www.google.com/maps/@32.9665...!3m1!1e3?hl=en

https://www.bikeforums.net/images/attach/jpg.gif
https://www.bikeforums.net/images/attach/jpg.gif
https://www.bikeforums.net/images/attach/jpg.gif

The turns are wide, the visibility generally good and the ramps to and from this path are well laid out... right up to the street... but this is where the fail begins to happen. Where the path meets the various surface streets, there are no signs and no curb cuts. So if you happen to be on the surface street above, you may notice the path, but you have no real notification that it exists, and no easy access to it. I contacted the engineers that designed the path and asked why this situation occurred. I was told it was so "the kiddos using the path would not ride out into the busy streets..." This of course is quite counter to the original design idea, that transportation cyclists would use this path.

The path design is further marred by proximity to a condominium complex, where it does become a mommy path full of small children and wandering mothers who tend to converse in packed groups... again somewhat counter to the needs of transportation cyclists.

https://www.google.com/maps/@32.9480...!3m1!1e3?hl=en

The path is further marred in one location by crossing the top of a water weir, which at times is wet, and grows slippery algae... again, counter to the needs of transportation cyclists... or anyone, for that matter that doesn't want to slip and fall. https://www.google.com/maps/@32.9430...!3m1!1e3?hl=en

The photos below (we used to be able to embed these into the text... ) show the best parts of the path.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
bridge.JPG (43.4 KB, 230 views)
File Type: jpg
underpass_freeway.JPG (50.6 KB, 226 views)
File Type: jpg
offramp.JPG (41.8 KB, 230 views)

Last edited by genec; 05-26-17 at 11:17 AM.
genec is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 11:20 AM
  #17  
genec
 
genec's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Posts: 27,079

Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2

Mentioned: 86 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13658 Post(s)
Liked 4,532 Times in 3,158 Posts
Originally Posted by CB HI
Early on, cyclist lobbied and worked for the construction of Bike Paths for commuting away from motorized traffic. Cyclist especially wanted cut throughs for more direct routes in the suburbs.

Cyclist lobbied and got 1% of Federal Transportation funds for use in building Bike Paths for commuting. Cyclist were happy with the new Bike Paths and politicians were happy to have those cyclist off car roads.

Cyclist used the Bike Paths for safe fast transportation as well as safe recreation and safely teaching our kids how to ride a bicycle. All was fine in cycling world.

Hikers and dog walkers got jealous with the Bike Paths. Their sidewalks were no longer good enough. So they started hiking and walking their dogs on the Bike Paths. These walkers demanded to be allowed legally on the Bike Paths. Not wanting to loose votes, Politicians had a solution, let us just rename these transportation Bike Paths into Multi-Use Paths (MUPs).

The walkers then wanted Bike Paths now called MUPs to be more like sidewalks but not sidewalks, and complained about the fast commuting cyclist that the Bike Paths now called MUPs were designed for. So Politicians put up 10 mph speed limit signs.

Then slow recreational cyclist began to whine unendingly about fellow cyclist who cycled too fast for the slow cyclist liking (you know, the fast commuting cyclist that got the Bike Paths now called MUPs build in the first place). So they began calling the fellow cyclist kitted or racer wannabe boys as terms of derision and demanded those kinds of cyclist use the car roads for their fast cycling.

Now these Bike Paths now called MUPs are no longer useful for transportation. That does not stop Politicians from demanding that the 1% of Federal Transportation funds be used for these new MUPs, all that is required is that they lie, claiming the new MUP is primarily for transportation use.

Now slow cyclist want to even kick the kids off the Bike Paths now called MUPs.



.
Yeah, it seems like every little group wants their own chunk of "path" of some sort that they can use to "get away" from "busy traffic." That alone is somewhat telling about the intrusion of the automobile into every day life and how we need to escape from that "intrusion." But we keep building cars and faster and faster roads... go figure.
genec is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 12:47 PM
  #18  
For The Fun of It
 
Paul Barnard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Louisissippi Coast
Posts: 5,844

Bikes: Lynskey GR300, Lynskey Backroad, Litespeed T6, Lynskey MT29, Burley Duet

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2132 Post(s)
Liked 1,642 Times in 824 Posts
The answer is yes. Kids should be riding on busy MUPs. They are M UPs. Parents should supervise closely. Other users should exercise a great deal of care in negotiating the young 'uns. SLOW down.
Never pass up an opportunity to tell kids they have a cool bike or a cool helmet.
Paul Barnard is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 01:17 PM
  #19  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 933
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 170 Post(s)
Liked 13 Times in 7 Posts
Originally Posted by College3.0
Physical safety is pretty close to the bottom of Maslow's hierarchy of needs. If a driver sees a child up ahead, even if it's on a MUP that is "protected" by a curb, they have a responsibility to slow down. Every person deserves safety regardless of their age, where they are, or what activity they're doing.
I agree with you! I believe in the concept of vulnerable users, which is every one not in a metal cage.
Equinox is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 01:26 PM
  #20  
Time to Fly!
 
Bikeforumuser0019's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 336
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 23 Times in 12 Posts
Originally Posted by Paul Barnard
Never pass up an opportunity to tell kids they have a cool bike or a cool helmet.
Bikeforumuser0019 is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 01:49 PM
  #21  
Senior Member
 
kickstart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Kent Wa.
Posts: 5,332

Bikes: 2005 Gazelle Golfo, 1935 Raleigh Sport, 1970 Robin Hood sport, 1974 Schwinn Continental, 1984 Ross MTB/porteur, 2013 Flying Piegon path racer, 2014 Gazelle Toer Populair T8

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 396 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times in 7 Posts
Public assets are about "we", not "me". If sharing is too much to ask, don't use it, or learn to live with what-comes-around-goes-around.
kickstart is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 02:36 PM
  #22  
Senior Member
 
rumrunn6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 25 miles northwest of Boston
Posts: 29,537

Bikes: Bottecchia Sprint, GT Timberline 29r, Marin Muirwoods 29er, Trek FX Alpha 7.0

Mentioned: 112 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5222 Post(s)
Liked 3,568 Times in 2,334 Posts
reminds me one of the 1st times I rode the Cape Cod Rail Trail start to finish. I had been commuting so I was all decked out with hi-viz shirt & strobes. came upon a cpl w a young boy on a 2 wheeler coming in the opposite direction. he was barely keeping it upright, must have just taken his training wheels off. his parents were on bikes right behind him. they were headed toward a road crossing I had just passed. the little tike looked up at me & lost it, falling down as I passed. the parents gave me a dirty look. I felt bad for distracting the young rider. almost stopped to apologize

when my kids were this novice at riding, we were on recreational areas away from ppl. not until they were proficient & in control, did we take them out in public w other riders
rumrunn6 is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 02:37 PM
  #23  
The Infractionator
 
AlexCyclistRoch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 2,202

Bikes: Classic road bikes: 1986 Cannondale, 1978 Trek

Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 875 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
You know, it all depends on the kid, or even the adult. Last week when I went on my MUP, there was a father with his daughter, who looked like she was about 7, and she was ALL over the path (as was her dad, on his fat bike...), then a few minutes later, a dad with his 5-year old were both riding quite well, and pretty fast, too. The 5 year old wasn't using training wheels, and he seemed to have remarkable control and awareness.

But, no, the MUP is NOT the place to introduce a small kid to cycling. First, you need to spend time on a driveway, followed by at least a couple hours in a vacant parking lot.
AlexCyclistRoch is offline  
Old 05-26-17, 02:44 PM
  #24  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 38,610

Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter

Mentioned: 139 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5737 Post(s)
Liked 2,481 Times in 1,371 Posts
The notion that this is dangerous or an "accident waiting to happen" implies that everyone living along a busy road shouldn't allow their children to play in front of their houses.

Yes, there's a risk, but it's not outrageous or even much greater than the everyday risks of living in the city. I'll venture that there are far more children injured riding on sidewalks and/or crossing streets and driveways than on MUPs along busy roads (even after norming for usage numbers).

I find it annoying that folks seize on every tragedy to claim that something or other is inherently dangerous, or that parents are somehow neglectful. Stuff happens, and the only way to ensure a safe world is to keep children (and adults) securely locked in their homes (and even that isn't safe).
__________________
FB
Chain-L site

An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.

Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.

“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN

WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FBinNY is online now  
Old 05-26-17, 02:45 PM
  #25  
Senior Member
 
rumrunn6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 25 miles northwest of Boston
Posts: 29,537

Bikes: Bottecchia Sprint, GT Timberline 29r, Marin Muirwoods 29er, Trek FX Alpha 7.0

Mentioned: 112 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5222 Post(s)
Liked 3,568 Times in 2,334 Posts
Originally Posted by AlexCyclistRoch
the MUP is NOT the place to introduce a small kid to cycling. First, you need to spend time on a driveway, followed by at least a couple hours in a vacant parking lot.
since my kids had been playing t-ball it dawned on me to teach them on the dirt field they were accustomed to. plus it offered a soft landing (even tho I had them loaded up with safety gear like knee pads, gloves, wrist guards & helmets LOL. I especially remember my son's experience. he had gotten over the fear of playing ball & running the bases etc. amazing what team sports will do for a kid. so we began small. ride from home plate to 1st base. then try two bases. it took a little while. a cpl falls. was so proud of him dusting himself off & getting back on to try again. no tears. & I remember his big smile when he made it all around for a home run! when my daughter made the same accomplishment I got it on tape

Last edited by rumrunn6; 05-26-17 at 02:53 PM.
rumrunn6 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.