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Daytime running lamps = Safer cycling ??

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Daytime running lamps = Safer cycling ??

Old 05-30-17, 04:16 PM
  #1  
NattyBumpo
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Daytime running lamps = Safer cycling ??

I started running "daytime running lamps" on my road bike and I have been shocked how effective they are at 'encouraging' motorists to leave additional room when they overtake me.

Last year I was cycling in the middle of bright, sun-shiny day when an oncoming flashing white light rounding a bend in the road about a quarter of a mile ahead of me caught my eye. Turns out it was another cyclist coming my way with a front-mounted DRL. I only got a glimpse of the light as we passed but it appeared to be a tiny thing and I saw no indication of an external battery pack.

The incident reminded me of something from eons ago, the first detailed study of motorcycle safety. About 35 years ago, a motorcyclist turned safety expert named Larry Hurt published the results of a study on motorcycling accident statistics that he'd spent five years compiling. How apropos is it that the first scientific treatise on the subject would become known as the Hurt Report?

Anyway, many of the report's conclusions will have a familiar ring to most any 21-st Century bicyclist. Stuff like novice riders tend to crash more than the old hands, and we're more likely to crash on a bike before the 'new' is worn off than we are after. Intersections are death traps. Helmets work. That sort of thing.

But the one thing in the report that was most surprising was that motorcyclists with operating headlights and wearing high-visibility garments were dramatically underrepresented in the accident statistics. The more noticeable bikers are to cagers, the less likely the cager is to run over them. While that point in itself has a pretty low transference to bicyclists (because so many of us roadies take our fashion cues from the European peloton, which means we dress in bright colors to rival the neon sign on a strip joint), the underlying principle of human behavior still applies ...in spades:

The most effective strategy for ensuring that motorists notice you is to shock them out of their complacency. Make it so they can't not notice you.


On background, I live in a state where cyclists as a group are given short shrift. Yeah, we have a 3-Foot Law, but it's an unenforced joke. I know to a certainty there have been at least three bicyclists who were struck and killed by ("at-fault") motorists since the law was enacted but none of the three drivers was cited for violating it. Whitetail deer are given more aggressive legal protection.

In fact, in my experience, the police themselves are among the worst offenders. More than once I've had to resist the temptation to grab hold of the passenger's side mirror on a police cruiser that was violating my three feet and take a tow, just to see how the 5-Oh would react. And to prove a point.

Passing motorists here behave as if bicycles were rubber safety cones: "It's best to miss them but if you do happen to hit one, at least it won't cause much damage." We do have some few bicycle lanes but they're mostly badly located and the street sweepers don't bother keeping them clean. Which makes them a magnet for all the debris you'd sooner not be riding over, so 'real' cyclists (the ones riding on gossamer-light tires not sold at Wally-World) avoid rather than use them.

So in the midst of this high(ish)-threat environment, I chance across Mr. Blinky Light, the first 'modern' DRL I had encountered in the wild (yeah, I don't come to town much). And I was impressed by the increased visibility it demonstrated (a point not lost on me on account of I have had a number of Close Encounters of the Bumper Kind with motorists who ignored my right of way). Which got me thinking back to the Hurt Report, along with the idea of maybe trying DRLs myself.

Like a lot of ...ahem ...experienced cyclists, I have a box full of old taillights, right between the box of spare toe straps and the box of half-used tubes of sew-up glue. But they're all more than 10 years old, and LEDs that far back weren't bright enough to be conspicuous in direct sunlight. Which is one reason I'd never much considered using them as DRLs.

But the new el-cheapo Chinese lights I just bought are a whole different kettle of cod. They're hella-bright. Bonus points for being USB-rechargable, so I never have to buy additional batteries (at least as long as these hold out). Not just bright enough to be un-missable even in midday sun, they throw a bit of a beam and could be pressed into service as a (red-tinted) headlight in a pinch. I bought them expecting just to replace the old AA LED light that I only turned on when visibility unexpectedly went to pot due to rain or fog, or when I got caught out after dark. But they're so bright, I thought they'd be perfect candidates for trial DRLs (at least rear DRLs).

And the motorists' response to these new lights has been nothing short of amazing. Most drivers now give me so much room when overtaking, you'd think I had an obvious case of ebola. Or was wearing an explosive vest.

I can't cite numbers because I didn't actually count but I would guesstimate that the number of motorists who now yield the entire lane when overtaking -- and I'm talking all four tires completely on the other side of the centerline -- has increased four fold. Probably half of all overtaking vehicles now yield the entire lane, or very nearly all of it.

Do you ever have motorists who seem to be lagging back behind you as you ride because they don't want to pass against a double-yellow centerline? Even though there's NO opposing traffic? I estimate that the incidence of this happening to me with my new DRLs has increased similarly, about 400% (Kind of creepy having a car following like that, for no obvious reason, but not as creepy as a ride in the meat wagon).

Maybe most significantly, in the four months since I started using the DRLs, I haven't had a single close call or "punish pass." Not one. Over that length of time, in my experience, this is unprecedented. One thing I find humorous is I still get hoots and jeers from time to time, but even then the carload of (ahem) hooters and jeerers is substantially further away than they used to be.

Numbers aside, it's obvious that I am impressed with the increased margin of safety running DRLs provides. And the only thing I can attribute this change to is the pair of extremely bright blinking red lights.

I think I like it. Not only because I'm old and skeerdy, but also because it's very little investment in terms of money and inconvenience, and it pays quite a large safety dividend. So to round out the set, I've also ordered a blinking white light for the front, just waiting for it to arrive.
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Old 05-30-17, 04:36 PM
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I am still not entirely convinced with the DRL method. Even with motorists'.
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Old 05-30-17, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris0516 View Post
I am still not entirely convinced with the DRL method. Even with motorists'.
???

1) make things worse?
2) have no effect?
3) have a possible or small benefit?
4) have a magical effect (where they make collisions impossible)?
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Old 05-30-17, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris0516 View Post
I am still not entirely convinced with the DRL method. Even with motorists'.
I don't know... But my impression is that it does make a "difference"... Whenever I turn mine on, it seems like motorist give me more room and even not cut me off as "often"... Placebo effect.? I don't know... But it does seem to make a difference.
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Old 05-30-17, 05:08 PM
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I have to agree with Chris0516 . While all my bicycles run generator hubs and run their lights all the time, in reality 1-2 watts of light really is no competition for sunlight. I mostly run them all the time because they can't be turned off unless there is a electrical problem, so I would have to disconnect them from the hub.


Now sure, it seems to me like drivers give me more room when I'm riding with working lights than when I'm not, but that may just be some form of confirmation bias. Often we feel something is true when it's not.


Also helmets don't really 'work'. You can't apply what works for a motorcycle to a bicycle. Speeds are different and so is the hat. Just look at countries that mandated helmets and saw their rate of wearing them shoot up, yet saw no appreciable decline in head injury rates. Nail in the coffin for helmets IMHO. If they really worked, those countries should have seen head injury rates plummet.
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Old 05-30-17, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by harshbarj View Post
Also helmets don't really 'work'. You can't apply what works for a motorcycle to a bicycle. Speeds are different and so is the hat. Just look at countries that mandated helmets and saw their rate of wearing them shoot up, yet saw no appreciable decline in head injury rates. Nail in the coffin for helmets IMHO. If they really worked, those countries should have seen head injury rates plummet.
Citation needed. Post it it the helmet thread.

If helmets "didn't work" (had no effect), one would expect no change in head injuries (all other things kept the same).

If the numbers "shot up" (citation needed), something else has to be happening.

Expecting injury rates to "plummet" (whatever that means, exactly) is would likely be overly optimistic.

Are head injuries ever noted as the cause of death?

Last edited by njkayaker; 05-30-17 at 05:42 PM.
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Old 05-30-17, 06:49 PM
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[QUOTE=njkayaker;19620801]Citation needed. Post it it the helmet thread.

If helmets "didn't work" (had no effect), one would expect no change in head injuries (all other things kept the same).

If the numbers "shot up" (citation needed), something else has to be happening.

Expecting injury rates to "plummet" (whatever that means, exactly) is would likely be overly optimistic.

Are head injuries ever noted as the cause of death?[/QUOTE]

Unfortunately they are, a car doing 60MPH hits a bicyclists or two, and kills him/them, that is recorded, as a bicycle accident... Well, a helmet will not save you from a vehicle hitting you at speed...
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Old 05-30-17, 07:07 PM
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I use a headlight on the pulse or blink setting, a blinking taillight on the back of my seat bag, and a solid taillight on the back of my helmet. My riding jerseys are bright colors as are the backs of my gloves when I signal.
Maybe I've just been lucky but I haven't had a situation yet where I got the impression I wasn't seen.
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Old 05-30-17, 07:09 PM
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DRL make a car, especially a neutral color or low slung form factor, a lot more visible in overcast conditions. Daytime flashers would do the same thing for a cyclist IF they had anywhere near the lumen output of DRL. Most don't. Most cyclists aren't hauling around 350 w/h alternators and 45lb of battery storage. Bikes have 2200mah - 4400mah of storage which amounts to a runtime of ~30min. @ 500 lumens. If they have a generator hub they have 110 lumens x indefinite run time. Cars have 3,000 - 6,000 lumens and indefinite run time. I choose to save my precious run time for the night (dark) hours and use day-glo (hi viz) clothing in the day. I don't need cars to drive off the road when they pass me. Normal passing behavior suffices. YMMV.
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Old 05-30-17, 07:27 PM
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I notice that cars are almost too cautious pulling out in front of me when I'm running a flashing headlight in the daytime. I don't think my rear lights are bright enough to have a large impact in bright sunshine, but they still help a bit on shady roads. It can't hurt in any case.
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Old 05-30-17, 07:36 PM
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Been using multiple lights(day & nite) for a few years now. USB charging make battery
management easy. At least 2 in the rear; in case 1 falls or stops working. For the front;
1 on the bars and another on my helmet that I can direct the beam where I want it to go:
Lights on my Brompton by 1nterceptor, on Flickr
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Old 05-30-17, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
Bikes have 2200mah - 4400mah of storage which amounts to a runtime of ~30min. @ 500 lumens..
Huh?

So I'm running 14,000mah up front and 3400mah rear. I easily get 5 hours of runtime.

1000 lumens in front and 100 lumens rear.

Unless a car is running high beams during the day, there is no way DRLs put out 3000-4000 lumens.

Have a look in your rear view mirror sometime, (if you have one) and compare a cyclist, or a motorist that has lights to one that doesn't.

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Old 05-30-17, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
???

1) make things worse?
2) have no effect?
3) have a possible or small benefit?
4) have a magical effect (where they make collisions impossible)?
2, Because it doesn't seem to matter to stupid drivers. Who could care less, who is on the road.
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Old 05-30-17, 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted by 350htrr View Post
I don't know... But my impression is that it does make a "difference"... Whenever I turn mine on, it seems like motorist give me more room and even not cut me off as "often"... Placebo effect.? I don't know... But it does seem to make a difference.
I have done DRL before, and I saw no difference in the passing distance.
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Old 05-30-17, 09:43 PM
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I'm satisfied for my own purposes that DRL and hi-vis clothing help. I can see other cyclists at a distance when they use these. Cyclists who don't use DRL and wear black/gray are much less visible to me. So I equip myself accordingly, based on what I've observed makes other cyclists more visible to me.

Regarding driver courtesy, yes, I've noticed a significant improvement over the years. But that's due to many factors including public service announcements, signs and markers reminding drivers that cyclists may share the road, etc. It's been a long, gradual process of improvement.

And there are still occasionally reckless and inconsiderate drivers. I encountered one Tuesday. But despite his vocally aggressive and obnoxious behavior, he didn't actually crowd me off the road. He was just unhappy about having to share it for a split second with me, the only other person on the road. Jerks are gonna jerk. Overall his ilk are in the minority and I find most drivers at least tolerate us.
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Old 05-30-17, 09:45 PM
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From my point of view lights are useless on a sunny day. I see the cyclist before I spot any lights during the day. Maybe because I'm a cyclist I can spot them but to me lights are only good in low light situations.
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Old 05-31-17, 07:18 AM
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I'd have to disagree with some of the post. From my own experience I've been able to see other cyclist lights in bright FL sunlight from way off. Sometimes before I could make out that the shape in the distance was a bicycle. Of course these are going to be the kind of lights that are made to be seen in sunlight.
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Old 05-31-17, 07:31 AM
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Originally Posted by 350htrr View Post
Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
Are head injuries ever noted as the cause of death?
Unfortunately they are, a car doing 60MPH hits a bicyclists or two, and kills him/them, that is recorded, as a bicycle accident... Well, a helmet will not save you from a vehicle hitting you at speed...
It doesn't seem that it's ever said that they died of a head injury specifically.

A helmet might not do much for a motorcyclist being hit by a car doing 60MPH either. These kinds of collisions isn't what helmets are for in any case.
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Old 05-31-17, 07:37 AM
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I started using them. I found the front bright blinker helps with wayward joggers/walkers too. Not a perfect solution, but the increase in the odds is worth the effort to turn them on. Too many close calls with a soccer mom texting in a mini van.
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Old 05-31-17, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris0516 View Post
2, Because it doesn't seem to matter to stupid drivers. Who could care less, who is on the road.
??? Are all drivers stupid or are only some of them stupid?

If you ride on the road, you know that the vast majority of drivers (stupid or not) manage not to hit you.

The tiny fraction of drivers that do hit you are divided into two groups: ones that hit you regardless and ones that hit you for other reasons.

The ones that keep hitting you regardless you can't do anything about (except by not riding).

For the other group, there might be some things that you can reasonably do that might reduce the rate that they keep hitting you.

As long as it's not too expensive or inconvenient, why would you not do those things?
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Old 05-31-17, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Bmach View Post
From my point of view lights are useless on a sunny day. I see the cyclist before I spot any lights during the day. Maybe because I'm a cyclist I can spot them but to me lights are only good in low light situations.
I routinely notice flashing rear or front lights thousands of feet before really noticing that it's "a cyclist" in bright daylight.

Another place they work is if the cyclist is in shadow and the observer is in open sunlight.

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Old 05-31-17, 07:44 AM
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Here are my thoughts. DRL and high vis do nothing to make you safer where alert and attentive drivers are involved. They will see you and react appropriately. DRLs and high vis won't help with deeply distracted drivers. DRL and high vis may be just what it takes to catch the attention of partially attentive drivers.
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Old 05-31-17, 07:56 AM
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OK, I've posted these before but since there are still nonbelievers in front daytime lights:

These two incidents were NOT uncommon before I started running a daytime front flasher. They happened at least once a year, usually 2 or 3 times a year. It was these two within a couple of weeks of one another that started me always riding with a front flasher.


These were in summer of 2013. Since then I have started riding a commute twice as long (first part on the same roads though, going past my old workplace then another 13 miles). I have not had this happen a single time since running a front flasher. I HAVE seen cars start to pass, then (I assume) see me and pull back behind the car they were about to pass.

FWIW I run a Cygolite Metro 550 in strobe mode. In fog or rain I go to pulse mode. In the winter when I'm in the dark pretty much all the time I'm using a solid Chinese 600-ish lumen light.
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Old 05-31-17, 08:12 AM
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Use DRLs if it makes you feel better, but there is no evidence that they do anything to increase cyclists' safety. Please turn them off on the bike path where they are obnoxious and totally unnecessary.
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Old 05-31-17, 08:18 AM
  #25  
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Some of you guys seem to think that if a piece of safety equipment is not magically capable of protecting you from a semi truck going 100mph, that it is useless. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.
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