Please get off the road when you see a school bus
12-09-17, 04:29 PM
#51
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Well.., maybe you should. Would hailing over to the side, just to be safe, kill you? Take a break and whistle a happy song. Will you?!
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12-09-17, 04:45 PM
#52
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Discounting all the bike advocate arguments, I offer one practical comment.
There's no logic to asking bicyclists to get off the road when we SEE a school bus. Since most of us don't have mirrors or eyes in the back of out heads, the school buses we see are in front of us and there's no benefit to anybody in us moving over anymore.
Of course we also see buses as they pass, but here too, it's pretty much over, and was the bus driver's responsibility to make sure he had the distance ahead needed to complete the pass safely.
My real point to the OP, is to not attempt to transfer his responsibility for his passengers onto other road users. He needs to be in charge of his destiny (and that of his charges) and drive accordingly, even if it means losing a minute here and there while waiting for a opportunity to pass safely,m whether it's a car, truck bicycle, pedestrian or even loose dog running down the road.
There's no logic to asking bicyclists to get off the road when we SEE a school bus. Since most of us don't have mirrors or eyes in the back of out heads, the school buses we see are in front of us and there's no benefit to anybody in us moving over anymore.
Of course we also see buses as they pass, but here too, it's pretty much over, and was the bus driver's responsibility to make sure he had the distance ahead needed to complete the pass safely.
My real point to the OP, is to not attempt to transfer his responsibility for his passengers onto other road users. He needs to be in charge of his destiny (and that of his charges) and drive accordingly, even if it means losing a minute here and there while waiting for a opportunity to pass safely,m whether it's a car, truck bicycle, pedestrian or even loose dog running down the road.
12-09-17, 04:50 PM
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Except it does help to continue to feed what is guaranteed to be a feisty thread!
12-09-17, 04:54 PM
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The best alternative is for O.P. and other school bus drivers to pass the cyclist as closely as they need to to stay within the boundaries of the travel lanes in their present direction. While some states have signs recommending a "3-foot rule", three feet looks like 3 inches from a bus, so you have to be really good at judging distances (over-the-road semi drivers are masters of this)Three feet is a perfect distance to allow the bus to stay within safe territory, not having to venture out to opposing traffic lanes. Make it two feet if you have to. We won't melt.
If there was constant on-coming traffic and I saw a bicyclist up ahead, I would pass the cyclist as closely as I needed to, to not swing into opposing lanes.
If there was constant on-coming traffic and I saw a bicyclist up ahead, I would pass the cyclist as closely as I needed to, to not swing into opposing lanes.
12-09-17, 05:48 PM
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No, I would not ask a bus driver to endanger children. You, as the driver should be able to safely navigate all traffic situations.
I'll help you. Wait, then make the pass on a stretch where there are no side streets.
If you can't figure out how to drive the bus safely, maybe you shouldn't be in charge of such precious cargo.
Saying "Shame on you" is about as condescending, judgmental, and holier than thou as it gets. Very ugly choice of words.
I'll help you. Wait, then make the pass on a stretch where there are no side streets.
If you can't figure out how to drive the bus safely, maybe you shouldn't be in charge of such precious cargo.
Saying "Shame on you" is about as condescending, judgmental, and holier than thou as it gets. Very ugly choice of words.
And that sense of entitlement puts all other users (not just cyclists) of the road at risk.
12-09-17, 07:07 PM
#57
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The best alternative is for O.P. and other school bus drivers to pass the cyclist as closely as they need to to stay within the boundaries of the travel lanes in their present direction. While some states have signs recommending a "3-foot rule", three feet looks like 3 inches from a bus, so you have to be really good at judging distances (over-the-road semi drivers are masters of this)Three feet is a perfect distance to allow the bus to stay within safe territory, not having to venture out to opposing traffic lanes. Make it two feet if you have to. We won't melt.
If there was constant on-coming traffic and I saw a bicyclist up ahead, I would pass the cyclist as closely as I needed to, to not swing into opposing lanes.
If there was constant on-coming traffic and I saw a bicyclist up ahead, I would pass the cyclist as closely as I needed to, to not swing into opposing lanes.
"...so you have to be really good at judging distances..." "Make it two feet if you have to."
The OP has made it clear they aren't capable of making a good choice or staying safe by passing completely in the left lane. For goodness sake do you think it's a good idea to encourage them to pass in the SAME lane within inches?
This person should not be driving a bus and frankly, not even a motor vehicle.
12-09-17, 07:29 PM
#58
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Every professional driver should understand this. Maybe you aren't in the right profession.
12-09-17, 07:47 PM
#59
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I drive a school bus. I ride my bike to work. (3500 miles in the 2 years I've driven a bus.)
I've been driving for 42 years overall.
1.3 milion miles in a tractor trailer, before I started driving the bus.
What have I learned?
A road is the most dangerous place you can be after (and I have to assume here, because I am not a veteran) a battlefield. Use extreme common sense at all times. The smaller the vehicle you are on or in, the greater your risk for injury or death.
I've been driving for 42 years overall.
1.3 milion miles in a tractor trailer, before I started driving the bus.
What have I learned?
A road is the most dangerous place you can be after (and I have to assume here, because I am not a veteran) a battlefield. Use extreme common sense at all times. The smaller the vehicle you are on or in, the greater your risk for injury or death.
12-09-17, 08:13 PM
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If you actually own a driver's license, you would have learned the rules for sharing the road with bicycles when studying for your written exam. That would have included that bicycles are classified as road vehicles by every state and have the same rights as motor vehicles. If you have forgotten the rules for interacting with bicycles, go look them up. And stay out of the driver's seat until you have fully familiarized yourself.
How would you pass Grandma Sunday driver if you are in such a hurry? You'd manage it just fine and you wouldn't be saying that Grandma Sunday driver is somehow controlling your bus in such a way as to endanger the kids. Same difference.
I wonder if you are the one that just laid on the horn behind me that one day. Who then rushed to pass me on the left despite a perfectly usable right turn lane on the other side, and then cut back in super close to me to move over to the right turn lane.
12-09-17, 08:21 PM
#61
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The OP uses children to make himself/herself saintly. Chances are, when he's driving an empty school bus or his family car, he has the same prejudice/hostility toward cyclists.
12-09-17, 08:21 PM
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You did read his post, didn't you? Either they had it all in pictures and he "passed" by not coloring the grass blue and sky green, or someone had to read it to him.
your state DOT publishes a book, you read it and had to pass a test to get your Driver's licence , did you not?
12-09-17, 08:24 PM
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Yeah, but we're talking about school bus drivers here; most of them go straight from the short bus to the front seat.
That's why they only use a lap belt in the driver's seat; the shoulder strap wouldn't let them lick the windows.
That's why they only use a lap belt in the driver's seat; the shoulder strap wouldn't let them lick the windows.
12-09-17, 09:30 PM
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Should cyclists pull off the road when mommie or daddy are driving by with children in the car? Should we pull off the road when a truck or one of those giant cement mixers approaches us from behind because it might pass us by going into the oncoming lane and could crash into an oncoming school bus? Or is the OP's point that we should just get the hell off the road?
A quick search revealed that a typical school bus weighs between 22,000 and 28,000 pounds. If I have an extra stack of pancakes for breakfast and carry lots of water and a heavy lock, my bike and I don't reach 200 pounds. And the OP is worried about the kids? Most of the school bus drivers I've experienced work for just a few hours a day. Most aren't professional truck drivers; they are part-time hacks driving around in huge vehicles.
I think the law that doesn't allow other vehicles to pass a stopped school bus is a good one but I think we need to explore ways to have these buses be less of a cause of traffic. Where I live, all the roads are two-lane roads (i.e. one lane in each direction). Once you get behind a school bus, you're pretty much stuck behind it until it either reaches the school or turns. Often, it just takes a main road with no turns and traffic just piles up while the bus driver yaks with the mommies or daddies who are picking up or dropping off the kids. Maybe more turns need to be built into bus routes to facilitate the flow of traffic. Or maybe, at least on the way to school, a bus driver could wave all the backed up traffic around them once all the kids are safely on the bus. The current system stinks.
And, as someone else pointed out, we've raised childhood obesity to an art form. For those who really need to ride a school bus, fine; but why not push to have more kids cycle to school or walk to school? The national Safe Routes to School program is trying to do exactly that but, at least in my area, they aren't getting anywhere. The local high school's bike rack only has one or two bikes there on a typical school day.
One last pet peeve ... every weekday morning on the corner of my street, there are several parked cars with their engines running. They sit there idling away (against the law after five minutes) for anywhere from ten to fifteen minutes. It's not just my street, of course. It's all the side streets that intersect with the busier street the school bus uses. It would take no extra time to drive to the nearby schools and back. I'm all for mass transit but all this idling is crazy.
A quick search revealed that a typical school bus weighs between 22,000 and 28,000 pounds. If I have an extra stack of pancakes for breakfast and carry lots of water and a heavy lock, my bike and I don't reach 200 pounds. And the OP is worried about the kids? Most of the school bus drivers I've experienced work for just a few hours a day. Most aren't professional truck drivers; they are part-time hacks driving around in huge vehicles.
I think the law that doesn't allow other vehicles to pass a stopped school bus is a good one but I think we need to explore ways to have these buses be less of a cause of traffic. Where I live, all the roads are two-lane roads (i.e. one lane in each direction). Once you get behind a school bus, you're pretty much stuck behind it until it either reaches the school or turns. Often, it just takes a main road with no turns and traffic just piles up while the bus driver yaks with the mommies or daddies who are picking up or dropping off the kids. Maybe more turns need to be built into bus routes to facilitate the flow of traffic. Or maybe, at least on the way to school, a bus driver could wave all the backed up traffic around them once all the kids are safely on the bus. The current system stinks.
And, as someone else pointed out, we've raised childhood obesity to an art form. For those who really need to ride a school bus, fine; but why not push to have more kids cycle to school or walk to school? The national Safe Routes to School program is trying to do exactly that but, at least in my area, they aren't getting anywhere. The local high school's bike rack only has one or two bikes there on a typical school day.
One last pet peeve ... every weekday morning on the corner of my street, there are several parked cars with their engines running. They sit there idling away (against the law after five minutes) for anywhere from ten to fifteen minutes. It's not just my street, of course. It's all the side streets that intersect with the busier street the school bus uses. It would take no extra time to drive to the nearby schools and back. I'm all for mass transit but all this idling is crazy.
Last edited by welshTerrier2; 12-09-17 at 09:35 PM.
12-09-17, 10:08 PM
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And, as someone else pointed out, we've raised childhood obesity to an art form. For those who really need to ride a school bus, fine; but why not push to have more kids cycle to school or walk to school? The national Safe Routes to School program is trying to do exactly that but, at least in my area, they aren't getting anywhere. The local high school's bike rack only has one or two bikes there on a typical school day.
And of all the things that could have killed me in my young and dumb days, walking and biking were not one of them. Well, biking one time could have, when the bullies stepped in front forcing me to stop and then grabbed the bike, twisted it to knock me off and hit me with it. That really doesn't count I think though.
But back to buses, if one is being a jerk to be a jerk and holding up traffic after all the kids are off, there are times you can legally pass them. Specifically when they are on private property, as most traffic laws cannot be enforced on private property. Where I used to live some guy got a ticket for passing a stopped bus, took it to court, argued that it was private property and that traffic laws do not apply, and the judge agreed. Made big time local news.
Or if you are on your bicycle and the driver is just chatting it up with a parent, get off, push your bike past and then get back on. Pedestrians can pass stopped school buses. Normally I'm a good girl, because I'm not usually am in a rush where a couple of minutes matter. But if all the kids are on the grass and Mommy wants to flirt with the bus driver, or if the kids are on the grass and the bus just sits there doing paperwork or whatever, game on.
12-09-17, 10:11 PM
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Here we got a sidewalk that goes from one school to another ~ 300 yards away, and does so in an impressively poor manner. So it's a "safe route to school" only if you live at the other school.
Yes, it really does dead end into the parking lot about as far from the building as it can be, so kids using it have to dodge the regular school morning parking lot traffic the rest of the way. And IME, even the school buses don't stop for the minimally marked crosswalk in the middle of it. (Which is inexplicably about 40 yards away from the T intersection where one would normally expect pedestrians crossing.)
12-09-17, 10:43 PM
#67
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This is a great thread. Some serious issues here. And I thought the cyclists I had to deal with when I worked at a bike shop were a bit touched. This opens up a whole new world of bizarreness. I got to get my meds adjusted to cope with this mess. I'm getting really close to just hangin my bike up in the shed. But .... my bike is "too good for the shed".
12-09-17, 11:19 PM
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I presume this is a troll, but if you are serious, you should not be behind the wheel of a car, let alone a bus. I have little tolerance for anyone who can't or is too impatient to pass another vehicle in safe regard for themselves and others.
Please, for the safety of those kids, quit your job. You are a danger to them.
Please, for the safety of those kids, quit your job. You are a danger to them.
12-10-17, 01:25 AM
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12-10-17, 01:59 AM
#70
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Threads like this are very helpful for viewing the minds of too many motorist. We may never understand their attitudes, but knowing their sentiment can be helpful. Closing the thread on such a basis would be wrong. If you are no longer interested in this thread, feel free to not click into it again.
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12-10-17, 02:14 AM
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The driver of a vehicle is the one who takes responsibility to initiate a safe pass of a slow moving vehicle. In all my years of riding a bicycle and driving a vehicle, never once have I ever thought, jeez, this person should pull over so I can pass. I wait until there is a safe amount of space to pass, and go around. Not sure if this is a troll or if this is really how someone feels. If it is a troll, whatever, it will pass and they will be banned. If it truly is a bus driver, please join in the conversation and be active on this forum. Most of us would like to hear your perspective I think and it would make for an interesting debate.
12-10-17, 04:37 AM
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I drive a school bus and I have come on this forum ask cyclist who rides bikes on one lane roads ( esp country roads) to please pull off the road and stand on the side so school buses can pass you safely, so we do not have to put children in harms way by going into the opposite lane of traffic on the other side of the road to pass you. Please remember Buses are wider and do take up all the one side of a lane. Many of you I assume have children, so please, I am asking you do this for the children!
thank you, have a good blessed holiday and be safe
thank you, have a good blessed holiday and be safe
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12-10-17, 07:11 AM
#74
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Oh THIS is good information. <roll eyes> Yeah, stay in the lane and pass a cyclist, pedestrian, scooter, etc. See how that works out for you, killing a cyclist.
"...so you have to be really good at judging distances..." "Make it two feet if you have to."
The OP has made it clear they aren't capable of making a good choice or staying safe by passing completely in the left lane.
"...so you have to be really good at judging distances..." "Make it two feet if you have to."
The OP has made it clear they aren't capable of making a good choice or staying safe by passing completely in the left lane.
I think we should give this driver (O.P.) some credit, here, for trying to do the right thing by taking the initiative and enlisting the aid of the cycling community (if we can call ourselves that) to keep things progressing methodically.
If there is a constant stream of on-coming traffic and no passing lane (or passing lane is occupied), I should be able to reach out and wipe some road-dirt off that bus as it passes.
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12-10-17, 07:21 AM
#75
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Give this guy the credit he deserves for totally over-estimating our adaptive
and receptive capabilities. He comes here asking for our help and we stone-wall him.
Very immature.
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