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Two bikers down

Old 07-15-19, 01:43 PM
  #1  
McBTC
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Two bikers down

One already died and the other... San Jose, CA


https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Bicyclists-Struck-SUV-San-Jose-512732871.html
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Old 07-16-19, 12:42 PM
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ugh rush hour ... 3rd fatal bike crash in last 3 months for that city. wonder where the driver was coming from in that parking lot & if she stopped to look. wonder if that sign & those trees obscured her view. too sad







that's a darn big sign


https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/20...ol-expressway/

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Old 07-16-19, 12:59 PM
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"Pulling out of the parking lot"? Apparently excessive speed was not a factor. The only way to explain a death in that case is if she was distracted and simply drove over them after the collision. Texting while driving?
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Old 07-16-19, 01:41 PM
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Oh... tough one. And, yes, the question is why she wasn't able to stop before there were serious injuries. Or did the the bikes side-swipe the car?

It looks like there was probably a bike lane that disappeared into a turn lane.

I often try to check behind myself, and pull left when I see an anxious looking driver pulling onto the road. But, that may not always be possible, or practical.

I hope for a speedy recovery for the cyclist that remains in the hospital.
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Old 07-16-19, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by AndreyT View Post
"Pulling out of the parking lot"? Apparently excessive speed was not a factor.
Why do you assume that? A "California stop" and then rapidly accelerate to get into traffic and not have to wait behind those cyclists...
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Old 07-16-19, 02:36 PM
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An example of one my most hated and feared vehicular interactions; the 90˚ approach.

I hate, Hate, HATE when a vehicle approaches at a 90˚ angle such as side streets or parking lot exits and we come together at the same time. Drivers are looking for vehicles not bicycles and often roll right through without a careful stop. I've had more close calls than I care to think about over the 90˚ situation. I'd like to see the full extent of the law applied here, but seriously doubt it will happen. One dead, one fighting for his life, and one who wasn't paying attention. So sad.


-Kedosto
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Old 07-16-19, 02:55 PM
  #7  
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Originally Posted by AndreyT View Post
"Pulling out of the parking lot"? Apparently excessive speed was not a factor. The only way to explain a death in that case is if she was distracted and simply drove over them after the collision. Texting while driving?
Looking at that first pic without watching the feed I'd guess speed had to be a factor, and ......if in addition she then proceeded to run them over because she was TWD she deserves more than prison.
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Old 07-16-19, 03:40 PM
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I looked at a study from the 70s that showed up to 89% of car bike collisions were at intersections. Any driveway or stop or signal. I looked at the video and I did not hear the news caster state the direction of travel for the bicyclists. I have had close calls were I turned in where they were turning out or yelled and they stopped. Somebody was distracted and mayhem happened. This is very bad and tragic.
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Old 07-16-19, 03:42 PM
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Bike forums forensics experts are on the case.
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Old 07-16-19, 04:44 PM
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"Authorities said the incident is the 26th fatal collision that occurred in San Jose this year.

Gene Hill, a resident of the area for 47 years, says drivers can be seen rolling through nearby stop signs all the time.

ďBut, itís really tough for bicyclists. Thereís a huge amount of traffic on this street. I admire them getting their exercise and getting out in this beautiful air. Itís a nice neighborhood. But Iím sorry this sort of thing happens,Ē said Hill."
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Old 07-16-19, 09:37 PM
  #11  
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I recently was talking with my sister about biking. She said she never sees them, meaning when she does see the biker its too late to react. I said to her... If you're tailgating the vehicle in front of you, You won't see the biker. If you're not tailgating, you will see the biker. It made her think.

Hard to read these sort of stories. Loved ones lost.
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Old 07-17-19, 03:30 AM
  #12  
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Obviously I'm not familiar with the junction but one possible explanation for collisions at intersections is 'constant bearing, reducing range'. There's a very interesting article on this centered around a particular junction in the UK where this is an issue: Collision Course: Why this type of junction will keep killing cyclists
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Old 07-17-19, 04:32 AM
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Originally Posted by BirdsBikeBinocs View Post
I recently was talking with my sister about biking. She said she never sees them, meaning when she does see the biker its too late to react. I said to her... If you're tailgating the vehicle in front of you, You won't see the biker. If you're not tailgating, you will see the biker. It made her think.

Hard to read these sort of stories. Loved ones lost.
As a long time motorcyclist and MSF Instructor I am all too familiar with the "I didn't see him" response. People in cars expect to see cars. 2-wheeled vehicles often don't show up in their brains. This happens all the time.
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Old 07-17-19, 04:35 AM
  #14  
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Some intersections are very problematic. There is one on my commute home where, in the last couple of months, I've had 3 cars pull in front of me when I am clearly in view. The other afternoon, a girl passenger started hitting the driver in the arm and yelling at them that there was a bike there. I have learned to expect that to happen there.
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Old 07-17-19, 04:58 AM
  #15  
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Sad, sad, sad, I worry a lot down here in Ventura County it is becoming more and more dangerous. I know distraction is a huge factor in most cases , but we do not know the details. I was riding a bike lane when a police officer suddenly pulled in front of me and stopped. I barely missed being part of the rear of the SUV police vehicle. As I went around to the drivers window that was rolled down, he was on a dash mounted laptop!!! I let him know how upset I was at his negligence and he apologized and I went about on my way. I don't get it, if it is not safe for anyone to use a computer while driving , why do it? Yes our phones are computers!! Joe
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Old 07-17-19, 04:59 AM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by bruce19 View Post
.............................. People in cars expect to see cars......................
Sadly, many people don't even see cars or trucks or motorcycles. Just had a 4 wheel turn left as 2 wheel (motorcycle) approached. 2 wheel went into passenger door resulting in 2 wheel rider death + passenger in 4 wheel vehicle. Didn't see??? and/or a lack of comprehension in speed of approaching 2 wheel???
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Old 07-17-19, 05:55 AM
  #17  
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People are not seeing what they don't expect to see. I have trained myself to look for every sign, pedestrian, bicyclist, dog and rodent etc. This takes practice. When riding in congested areas I have had to turn in where the right hooking motorist is going and Turn to there inside where they are coming onto the road several times to keep from being hit. My voice and the use of lights helps helps keep them from rolling into me when they are entering the rode. Our requirements for operating a motor vehicle on the road are not up to the task. Proper training and education are not a priority because of the cost. My last year in the military I was in Germany. There requirements for operating a motor vehicle down the road are extreme compared to us getting our license in a cracker jack box. The difference was very noticeable.

Last edited by Rick; 07-17-19 at 05:59 AM.
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Old 07-17-19, 06:40 AM
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Nothing's perfect

... but this is where my Airzound helps: On the Stone Mountain trail, going downhill at speed. Approaching t-intersection and can see vehicle coming quickly to stop sign. Two bursts before we got there and the driver slowed to a stop for me to proceed.

Much better than 30 mins before when the 82nd Airborne A-hole made a right turn by driving totally on the sidewalk and right at me. Thought they trained dem pingers to read and obey manuals....
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Old 07-17-19, 07:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Kabuki12 View Post
Sad, sad, sad, I worry a lot down here in Ventura County it is becoming more and more dangerous. I know distraction is a huge factor in most cases , but we do not know the details. I was riding a bike lane when a police officer suddenly pulled in front of me and stopped. I barely missed being part of the rear of the SUV police vehicle. As I went around to the drivers window that was rolled down, he was on a dash mounted laptop!!! I let him know how upset I was at his negligence and he apologized and I went about on my way. I don't get it, if it is not safe for anyone to use a computer while driving , why do it? Yes our phones are computers!! Joe
cops are ppl too & they can make dumb mistakes too
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Old 07-17-19, 07:11 AM
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in looking at those pics again the trees are too tall to obstruct the driver's view. that sign doesn't obscure all the view. maybe while approaching, but there's a line of sight (if she stopped at the road & looked before proceeding). I would guess she gave a glance, didn't see them & was distracted by something else. who knows, it could have been a bird or her cell phone. & we don't know how fast the pair was moving. meaning: now you don't see them cuz of the sign, but now you do see them as you drive over them?
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Old 07-17-19, 07:16 AM
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I almost hit a kid on a bike one sidewalk as I was exiting a McDonalds, one time. I stopped & looked both ways, as usual, but I had to keep looking left for oncoming auto traffic. when I turned to look forward again, the kid was flying past me as I started to roll, but I stopped w/o hitting him. in hindsight, I should not have rolled forward before looking & maybe he shouldn't have sped in front of my car cuz he could see I was about to enter traffic. I've been going to this McD's for years & never had a situation like that before. but now, of course I'm more attentive especially in the afternoon when the school kids are getting out. oh also the kid probably should not have been riding on the sidewalk in the opposite direction of that traffic. he was "salmoning" but on a sidewalk
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Old 07-17-19, 07:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Rick View Post
use of lights helps helps keep them from rolling into me when they are entering the rode
I believe my front strobe does the same. many times a car will be coming from my right, a driveway or a road & they're anticipating a rolling stop but when they see my strobe, they stop their car. but sometimes I wonder if I didn't have that light would I be feathering the brakes instead of just steady pedaling. I also wonder if I trust the front strobe too much
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Old 07-17-19, 09:32 AM
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Drove a commercial truck for 35 years. Window pillars are just wide enough to cover thin objects like bikes and pedestrians. Throw in a California stop and the bike and car movement can keep them out of view.
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Old 07-17-19, 09:57 AM
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good point, I've noticed mine, in my car, block my view of things & depending on my movement & the objects movement the view of that object can be obscured for more than a split second
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Old 07-17-19, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by rumrunn6 View Post
in looking at those pics again the trees are too tall to obstruct the driver's view. that sign doesn't obscure all the view. maybe while approaching, but there's a line of sight (if she stopped at the road & looked before proceeding). I would guess she gave a glance, didn't see them & was distracted by something else. who knows, it could have been a bird or her cell phone. & we don't know how fast the pair was moving. meaning: now you don't see them cuz of the sign, but now you do see them as you drive over them?
Originally Posted by rumrunn6 View Post
ugh rush hour ... 3rd fatal bike crash in last 3 months for that city. wonder where the driver was coming from in that parking lot & if she stopped to look. wonder if that sign & those trees obscured her view. too sad

Let me posit that she likely was making a left hand turn out of the parking lot.

A left turn means crossing the bike lane plus about 2 traffic lanes, plus merging into the left traffic lane on the opposite side of the road.

There is a curb placed in the road, preventing pulling into the center lane, then merging as a 2-step process.

Plus, it divides one's attention between vehicles in both directions.

So, see a hole... and HIT THE GAS!
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