Notices
Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

Speed Kills

Old 09-11-23, 04:45 AM
  #1  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
work4bike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlantic Beach Florida
Posts: 1,945
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3773 Post(s)
Liked 1,042 Times in 789 Posts
Speed Kills

Another report on the growing popularity of ebikes and rise in accidents. I see more and more of these things and what's really concerning is that I'm seeing very young kids now riding little ebikes. I see them zipping in and out of the roads, going way too fast on sidewalks, many of which have blind spots. I do wonder how many more accidents before the trend plateaus.




work4bike is offline  
Likes For work4bike:
Old 09-11-23, 05:09 AM
  #2  
Senior Member
 
Bald Paul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Upstate SC
Posts: 1,698
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 817 Post(s)
Liked 1,651 Times in 778 Posts
"I don't think our streets and infrastructure are properly laid out for our rider safety."
It's a shame that an increase in crashes and serious injuries caused by some of the novice or irresponsible e-bike riders may just be the impetus for change. This is something that too many cyclists (not on e-bikes) have known for some time, but for some reason, it hasn't garnered the attention of lawmakers and road planners.
I just shudder to think of the knee-jerk laws that may be placed on the cycling community as a whole as a result. As they say, be careful what you wish for.
Bald Paul is offline  
Likes For Bald Paul:
Old 09-11-23, 07:45 AM
  #3  
I'm good to go!
 
Iride01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 14,982

Bikes: Tarmac Disc Comp Di2 - 2020

Mentioned: 51 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6190 Post(s)
Liked 4,806 Times in 3,315 Posts
We still have parents letting their very young kids ride big heavy four wheelers with no helmets at high speeds down the roads. Why should it be any different with e-bikes or other utility or sport vehicles?
Iride01 is online now  
Old 09-11-23, 09:49 AM
  #4  
Full Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Foothills of West Central Maine
Posts: 410

Bikes: 2007 Motobecane Fantom Cross Expert, 2020 Motobecane Omni Strada Pro Disc (700c gravel bike), 2021 Motobecane Elite Adventure with Bafang 500W rear hub drive

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 174 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 143 Times in 94 Posts
I've had an ebike for three years after riding conventional bikes for 60 years on roads.

My advice to anyone regarding ebikes is that you should be an experienced rider of conventional bikes before trying an ebike. Also, you should be familiar with your route so you know the danger points along the way. Take extra care to have good mirror(s) adjusted precisely, and test brakes before starting out.

The higher average speeds on an ebike needn't add a lot of danger if you slow down in trouble-prone areas, like intersections and densely travelled areas. A good rule in rural areas is to use speed limits as a guide to your speed on an ebike.

I typically use power level one around intersections, and increase power level as I get further from town centers. Power level one in 25mph zones, level two in 35mph zones, level three in 45mph and up works well on a five power level setup. That's about 20mph or so on my ebike, which is plenty fast for cruising rural roads.
Chuckles1 is offline  
Likes For Chuckles1:
Old 09-11-23, 09:51 AM
  #5  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,992
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2494 Post(s)
Liked 738 Times in 522 Posts
Originally Posted by Bald Paul
"I don't think our streets and infrastructure are properly laid out for our rider safety."
It's a shame that an increase in crashes and serious injuries caused by some of the novice or irresponsible e-bike riders may just be the impetus for change. This is something that too many cyclists (not on e-bikes) have known for some time, but for some reason, it hasn't garnered the attention of lawmakers and road planners.
I just shudder to think of the knee-jerk laws that may be placed on the cycling community as a whole as a result. As they say, be careful what you wish for.
Paris has banned all rental stand-up scooters entirely. Laying streets out differently, altering infrastructure is simply not going to happen. Nor can it. Why not? Because your idea of what good layout looks like and a different engineers idea will always differ. The fact that there can never be consensus on anything, anywhere, creates gridlock.
Leisesturm is offline  
Likes For Leisesturm:
Old 09-11-23, 09:58 AM
  #6  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,992
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2494 Post(s)
Liked 738 Times in 522 Posts
I've seen only one small kid on an e-bike and they were with a parent. Unsupervised children on e-bikes is less about the bikes and more about parenting. There are a lot more bikes around now that many are e-assist. Most are not going fast. It's been a Bike Forums thing to inflate the speed profiles of EVERYTHING for decades. Long before e-bikes y'all were inflating your own speeds on your 'acoustic bikes. You also inflate the speeds that crazy cagers use while blasting through residential neighborhoods. What I wonder is how long it will take till the e-bike hysteria dies down and acceptance takes place.
Leisesturm is offline  
Old 09-11-23, 11:20 AM
  #7  
Been Around Awhile
 
I-Like-To-Bike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Burlington Iowa
Posts: 29,969

Bikes: Vaterland and Ragazzi

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked 1,532 Times in 1,043 Posts
Originally Posted by Leisesturm
It's been a Bike Forums thing to inflate the speed profiles of EVERYTHING for decades. Long before e-bikes y'all were inflating your own speeds on your 'acoustic bikes. You also inflate the speeds that crazy cagers use while blasting through residential neighborhoods. What I wonder is how long it will take till the e-bike hysteria dies down and acceptance takes place.
Maybe in about the same amount of time as the hysteria from some BF posters subsides about all the drivers that they see texting while driving and/or their certainty that every collision was caused by a texting driver.
I-Like-To-Bike is offline  
Old 09-11-23, 11:30 AM
  #8  
Senior Member
 
rumrunn6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 25 miles northwest of Boston
Posts: 29,549

Bikes: Bottecchia Sprint, GT Timberline 29r, Marin Muirwoods 29er, Trek FX Alpha 7.0

Mentioned: 112 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5224 Post(s)
Liked 3,581 Times in 2,342 Posts
Originally Posted by Leisesturm
I've seen only one small kid on an e-bike and they were with a parent
reminds me of when I see parents teaching a kid how to ride a bike, or just going out with their kids after dinner, parents walking with kid way ahead on their bike. those parents have no control over that kid. they can't make them stop at a road crossing 900 feet ahead. they are powerless. that's not how I managed my kids when they started learning how to hike in the woods & ride bikes. we stayed together. sorry for the rant, I'm remembering the 6yr old that was run over while riding with their parents on a bike trail. the kid roade across the intersection w/o stopping & there was high grass at the trail obscuring the driver's view of any oncoming pedestrian or bike traffic. so avoidable
rumrunn6 is offline  
Old 09-11-23, 02:17 PM
  #9  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,435
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 623 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 396 Times in 274 Posts
You can't legislate intelligence. Even with laws and parental supervision you can't guarantee the safety of children. You can't stop adults from driving while texting or running over their own children in car ports either. Although a small percentage of people end up injured or dead because of these and other activities we see and sometimes feel the effects. Some of us occasionally have opportunities to attempt education or change. Others make fun of things. I heard something about an enforced ebike training or class for children in California recently.
Rick is offline  
Old 09-11-23, 02:22 PM
  #10  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Posts: 4,811
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1591 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,018 Times in 571 Posts
Originally Posted by Leisesturm
I've seen only one small kid on an e-bike and they were with a parent. Unsupervised children on e-bikes is less about the bikes and more about parenting. There are a lot more bikes around now that many are e-assist. Most are not going fast. It's been a Bike Forums thing to inflate the speed profiles of EVERYTHING for decades. Long before e-bikes y'all were inflating your own speeds on your 'acoustic bikes. You also inflate the speeds that crazy cagers use while blasting through residential neighborhoods. What I wonder is how long it will take till the e-bike hysteria dies down and acceptance takes place.
I don't see a lot of hysteria and it seems ebikes are pretty much readily accepted in most places. There are a few complaints on internet boards but someone is always complaining about something on the internet. I know there have been some significant concerns regarding battery fires in NYC but I don't think I'd call that hysteria.
jon c. is offline  
Old 09-12-23, 05:24 AM
  #11  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
work4bike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlantic Beach Florida
Posts: 1,945
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3773 Post(s)
Liked 1,042 Times in 789 Posts
There's a section of beach-front road I almost always travel at the end of my rides to cool down. It's a little over a mile in length, it has a speed limit of 20-mph and there is a stop sign just over every 300 feet (I've measured them on my computer, they're each 0.06-mile apart).

This road use to be just filled with lazy beach cruisers riding up and down this road. And no one ever paid attention to the stop signs. However, nowadays they've all been replaced by ebikes riding up and down this road -- I hardly see a beach cruisers anymore. And these ebike are moving at at least 20-mph with no regard to the the stop signs. And they do this in all parts of the road, including little kids, which makes it very difficult for others to see them coming, due to all the visual obstructions (parked cars).

The other day I come up to one of these stop signs at the same time a car does and I wave them on and he starts to go, but then I see him stop very quickly, I wave again and he waves back, then all of sudden an ebike comes zooming past me and then it makes sense on why he suddenly hit his brakes. I just shrug my shoulders, as if to say, Sorry
work4bike is offline  
Likes For work4bike:
Old 09-14-23, 11:24 AM
  #12  
Junior Member
 
Bleu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2023
Posts: 76
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 39 Post(s)
Liked 26 Times in 17 Posts
Originally Posted by work4bike
There's a section of beach-front road I almost always travel at the end of my rides to cool down. It's a little over a mile in length, it has a speed limit of 20-mph and there is a stop sign just over every 300 feet (I've measured them on my computer, they're each 0.06-mile apart).

This road use to be just filled with lazy beach cruisers riding up and down this road. And no one ever paid attention to the stop signs. However, nowadays they've all been replaced by ebikes riding up and down this road -- I hardly see a beach cruisers anymore. And these ebike are moving at at least 20-mph with no regard to the the stop signs. And they do this in all parts of the road, including little kids, which makes it very difficult for others to see them coming, due to all the visual obstructions (parked cars).

The other day I come up to one of these stop signs at the same time a car does and I wave them on and he starts to go, but then I see him stop very quickly, I wave again and he waves back, then all of sudden an ebike comes zooming past me and then it makes sense on why he suddenly hit his brakes. I just shrug my shoulders, as if to say, Sorry
Bummer to be put in this situation huh.. The thing that is most irritating about "ebikes" is that most people lump them in as bicycles rather than un licensed un registered mopeds or motorcycles. And thus when they do something asnine, motorists look at cyclists and give us the old 'see what I mean' bs.
Bleu is offline  
Old 09-14-23, 12:09 PM
  #13  
20+mph Commuter
 
JoeyBike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Greenville. SC USA
Posts: 7,515

Bikes: Surly LHT, Surly Lowside, a folding bike, and a beater.

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1434 Post(s)
Liked 331 Times in 219 Posts
Originally Posted by Bleu
...when they do something asnine, motorists look at cyclists and give us the old 'see what I mean' bs.
I'm not crazy about e-bikes personally. I see so many of them around - rentals and privately owned. The ONE thing I do appreciate about e-bike riders though is that they do not feel compelled to dress like trapeze artists while riding their bikes, which in my mind makes them look like "normal" people. The more motorists who look at cyclists as "normal people" the better IMO.
JoeyBike is offline  
Likes For JoeyBike:
Old 09-15-23, 08:07 AM
  #14  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,260
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4245 Post(s)
Liked 1,351 Times in 937 Posts
Originally Posted by JoeyBike
I'm not crazy about e-bikes personally. I see so many of them around - rentals and privately owned. The ONE thing I do appreciate about e-bike riders though is that they do not feel compelled to dress like trapeze artists while riding their bikes, which in my mind makes them look like "normal" people. The more motorists who look at cyclists as "normal people" the better IMO.
You need to get out more.

Most cyclists are not dressing like “trapeze artists”.
njkayaker is online now  
Old 09-15-23, 08:31 AM
  #15  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Posts: 4,811
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1591 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,018 Times in 571 Posts
The only people who hate cyclists in spandex are other riders who don't wear cycling gear. I have no idea why this prejudice exists. Why would they care what other riders wear? I have absolutely no reason to believe that it makes the slightest difference to non cycling drivers but certain riders fervently promote this myth.
jon c. is offline  
Likes For jon c.:
Old 09-15-23, 08:40 AM
  #16  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,260
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4245 Post(s)
Liked 1,351 Times in 937 Posts
Originally Posted by Paul Barnard
Oh look, another confrontational post from 'yaker. That's just so darling.
And I am not wrong.

Your post manages to be nothing more than “confrontational” (It didn't include anything, pro or con, about the topic at hand). Where is the rule that allows you to be confrontational (just to be confrontational) and yet complain about other people?

And it’s not like JoeyBike is not routinely confrontational. As he was in the exact post I replied to. How the heck did you manage to miss that?

Where is the rule that says people can only post things you approve of?

Ridiculous.

Last edited by njkayaker; 09-15-23 at 09:13 AM.
njkayaker is online now  
Old 09-15-23, 09:25 AM
  #17  
Punk Rock Lives
 
Roughstuff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Throughout the west in a van, on my bike, and in the forest
Posts: 3,305

Bikes: Long Haul Trucker with BRIFTERS!

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 119 Post(s)
Liked 45 Times in 39 Posts
You guys are no fun

Originally Posted by jon c.
The only people who hate cyclists in spandex are other riders who don't wear cycling gear. I have no idea why this prejudice exists. Why would they care what other riders wear? I have absolutely no reason to believe that it makes the slightest difference to non cycling drivers but certain riders fervently promote this myth.
Years ago I was riding near Whitefish, Montana. It was a smaller town back then! I remember I had on a pair of really shiny European cut lascivious spandex. I was on a slow road through town. This black girl on the passenger side rolled her window down, stuck out her arm and gave my left butt cheek a big FANNY WHACK. One small step for humanity.
Roughstuff is offline  
Likes For Roughstuff:
Old 09-15-23, 10:05 AM
  #18  
Senior Member
 
Bald Paul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Upstate SC
Posts: 1,698
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 817 Post(s)
Liked 1,651 Times in 778 Posts
Originally Posted by Roughstuff
Years ago I was riding near Whitefish, Montana. It was a smaller town back then! I remember I had on a pair of really shiny European cut lascivious spandex. I was on a slow road through town. This black girl on the passenger side rolled her window down, stuck out her arm and gave my left butt cheek a big FANNY WHACK. One small step for humanity.
LOL! I had the same experience years ago, riding from Boston to Cape Cod. The WHACK was followed by a "Nice *$$!", to which I responded "Thank you!" I caught up to them at the next intersection and asked her for a date. Didn't work out, she was a little embarrassed.
Bald Paul is offline  
Likes For Bald Paul:
Old 09-15-23, 11:30 AM
  #19  
For The Fun of It
 
Paul Barnard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Louisissippi Coast
Posts: 5,851

Bikes: Lynskey GR300, Lynskey Backroad, Litespeed T6, Lynskey MT29, Burley Duet

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2134 Post(s)
Liked 1,644 Times in 826 Posts
Originally Posted by njkayaker
And I am not wrong.

Your post manages to be nothing more than “confrontational” (It didn't include anything, pro or con, about the topic at hand). Where is the rule that allows you to be confrontational (just to be confrontational) and yet complain about other people?

And it’s not like JoeyBike is not routinely confrontational. As he was in the exact post I replied to. How the heck did you manage to miss that?

Where is the rule that says people can only post things you approve of?

Ridiculous.
And another.
Paul Barnard is offline  
Old 09-15-23, 12:04 PM
  #20  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,260
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4245 Post(s)
Liked 1,351 Times in 937 Posts
Originally Posted by Paul Barnard
And another.
So, not being allowed to defend myself is another one of your made-up rules. It wasn't "confrontational" at all.

This sort of sniping isn't really allowed, by the way (it's a form of harassment and ad hom attack). Given that this minor bothers you so, you should really refrain from using the internet at all. You definitely didn't understand the post you replied to.

Last edited by njkayaker; 09-15-23 at 12:21 PM.
njkayaker is online now  
Old 09-15-23, 12:38 PM
  #21  
Punk Rock Lives
 
Roughstuff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Throughout the west in a van, on my bike, and in the forest
Posts: 3,305

Bikes: Long Haul Trucker with BRIFTERS!

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 119 Post(s)
Liked 45 Times in 39 Posts
Roughstuff is offline  
Old 09-17-23, 11:39 AM
  #22  
20+mph Commuter
 
JoeyBike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Greenville. SC USA
Posts: 7,515

Bikes: Surly LHT, Surly Lowside, a folding bike, and a beater.

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1434 Post(s)
Liked 331 Times in 219 Posts
Originally Posted by jon c.
The only people who hate cyclists in spandex are other riders who don't wear cycling gear. I have no idea why this prejudice exists. Why would they care what other riders wear? I have absolutely no reason to believe that it makes the slightest difference to non cycling drivers but certain riders fervently promote this myth.
If you have any non-cyclist friends who commute to work by car in a metropolitan area daily, ask them. You will be surprised. If they aren't straight up hating cyclists they are laughing out loud at the pointy helmets and matching leotards emblazoned with the logos of Italian dish soap companies. Those costumes tend to dehumanize cyclists mostly to non-cyclists who encounter said costumed cyclists on the roadways. Ask around.
JoeyBike is offline  
Old 09-17-23, 05:06 PM
  #23  
Newbie
 
Join Date: Mar 2023
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 7 Posts
Originally Posted by JoeyBike
If you have any non-cyclist friends who commute to work by car in a metropolitan area daily, ask them. You will be surprised. If they aren't straight up hating cyclists they are laughing out loud at the pointy helmets and matching leotards emblazoned with the logos of Italian dish soap companies. Those costumes tend to dehumanize cyclists mostly to non-cyclists who encounter said costumed cyclists on the roadways. Ask around.
I agree with both this and the post you are responding to, and I am a cyclist who wears ordinary clothes.

It's not a matter of "hating" the Spandex wearers. It's just seen as a little pretentious and unnecessary, like a grown man bringing his glove to a Major League baseball game. Exactly the same way in weightlifting gyms, where the really strong guys are wearing loose jeans and a t-shirt and maybe a backwards ball cap, and they might snicker at some guy in Spandex with logos on it and who looks like he just had his hair done. But that's all it is, some minor ridicule, no one is hating anyone.

But I do bring my glove to a baseball game! Hey you never know, line drive into the stands and I have to protect myself. (Or they might offer me that contract, you never know...)
MagnaRota is offline  
Likes For MagnaRota:
Old 09-18-23, 12:01 AM
  #24  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,992
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2494 Post(s)
Liked 738 Times in 522 Posts
This thread has taken a bizarre turn. Motorists do not care a whit what a cyclist wears. Your street clothes do NOT make you more acceptable to a cager. Only your being in a car of your own lets you in their exclusive club, so stop hating on Spandex wearers. I'm not sure what you expect a Cat 3 roadie out for a training ride to wear. Cut-off's and Chuck Taylors?? And no, I don't see head to toe Spandex on the main commute routes. That just doesn't happen. So stop it.

When me and mine commute to work I do NOT wear Khakis and a Dockers button down under a Levis Jacket. That would be stupid. I change into those once off the bike. For any trip longer than a mile I'm wearing cycling tights or shorts and they just might have Spandex in them. Sue me. It's my (fine) @$$ so I'm not sure why anyone else should care what I wear over it. I probably will not wear a Team colors Jersey but my zip-off sleeve cycling jacket is cut long in back and has 3 pockets across the back, just like you know what ... again, sue me. I've been commuting in get up like that for years and guess who buys it all. My DW, blind since birth. Has never seen a cyclist but manages to look very much like one when cycling. She can navigate the Terry website to buy herself a pair of shorts or SPD shoes, and can do the same on Amazon and order me a pair of Pearl Izumi shorts to cycle in. SMH.

When we join our tandem club for a 40 miler through the Vineyards and back-roads, Spandex is the order of the day. We would not be allowed to participate without a pointy helmet (pointy?) and cut-offs could not be prohibited, but we would probably get some questions about what we are going to do if we get saddle sore and cannot finish the ride. Our club does not drop dnf's but they would sure be pissed at having to scrub a perfectly good ride because a team came improperly dressed and suffered because of it. WTF are some of you smoking? Give it up. It's making you cray cray. Not a good look.
Leisesturm is offline  
Likes For Leisesturm:
Old 09-18-23, 12:13 AM
  #25  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,992
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2494 Post(s)
Liked 738 Times in 522 Posts
Originally Posted by MagnaRota
I agree with both this and the post you are responding to, and I am a cyclist who wears ordinary clothes.

It's not a matter of "hating" the Spandex wearers. It's just seen as a little pretentious and unnecessary, like a grown man bringing his glove to a Major League baseball game. Exactly the same way in weightlifting gyms, where the really strong guys are wearing loose jeans and a t-shirt and maybe a backwards ball cap, and they might snicker at some guy in Spandex with logos on it and who looks like he just had his hair done. But that's all it is, some minor ridicule, no one is hating anyone.
When you are on a road bike and have a 50 mile out and back, are you sitting in the stands or are you on the field?! You don't see the difference? How long would you last at First without your glove? Never mind, your analogy is so inappropriate it doesn't even stand up to argument. I've yet to see a fully kitted out roadie that was slow. Even loafing they are rolling along at 18mph+. Do you know where they are going or how far? I never assume they are riding to the office like that. But their office might be 20mi away and I don't expect them to commute 20mi in Khakis and Dockers button downs!! If you can wear 'ordinary clothes' on the bike you aren't hammering, or not going far, and that's fine. You do you. Those of us who plan to work up a sweat, have different needs. Can you get your head around that?
Leisesturm is offline  
Likes For Leisesturm:

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.