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People are jerks

Old 05-27-06, 11:43 PM
  #1  
nm+
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People are jerks

I'm not normally an anti-car person, I like my car.
However, today really drove me off the edge. I'm riding the Northern Tier fully loaded and was climbing Loup Loup Pass on Washington 20. First some jerk throws a soda can ad me. I didn't get the plate, which sucked cause I will file assault charges (And I just met the local sherriff the other day, he was nice, small town cops can bbe very good allies).
However, the thing that really bothered me was this. I was clipped and forced off the road which had a steep soft shoulder. I slide down the ledge toward some barbed wire. Four cars, plus the clipper (again no plates) saw me fall. No one of them stopped.
I just dopn't get it, another human being is potentally seriously hurt (I wasn't just some scrapes) and not one person stopped. Jerks.
As a side note, I sat by the side of the raod with my first aid kit for 5 minutes before anyone sto[pped and asked if I was fine, a guy who hadn't even seen the fall.
What's the point of this? I dunno. i kinow I would have stopped, and these people probably would have stopped if I had been a motorcycle or car. I also know in Minnesota, and dare I say, my native California, where every driver is a jerk -- myself inculded -- one of five would have stopped. I assumed most people woyuld stop before now, but apparently not.
Ah bike v. car the only hit and run that seem accepted by society.
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Old 05-27-06, 11:47 PM
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I agree with you, I had similar memory when I used to bike to work as a kid.

Its also one of the reasons if I was to cycle to work I would be on the sidewalk on the very busy roads to avoid being in "assault" range of the punk kids.

So beyond the ill news, hows the trip been so far? Try to get some pics for me of your bike and all the stuff your towing im intrested in seeing what your taking with you across the US.
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Old 05-28-06, 07:05 AM
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And tomorrow you might be taking a break and some motorist may stop and give you a cold bottle of water and maybe a bag of cookies or they may offer to let you camp in thier yard. There is a lot more good people out there than bad.
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Old 05-29-06, 07:05 AM
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I had the full on bike wreck with bike going airborne with me under it on the hot pavement right on the corner of an intersection at a transit train station. There were people on the corner waiting to cross the street when I wrecked. After everything settled after the wreck with me, my bike and all the broken crap in the street - the lights changed and the pedestrians crossed the street like nothing had happened. A few were doing that stare away with a smirk thing like they were holding back laughter.

I used to live next to a predominantly hispanic occupied apartment complex where the custom was for everyone to sit outside in the parking lot. (Don't ask, I don't know). There was that chunky, rocky gravel all over the road that had leaked out of everyone's driveways since none of the driveways were paved. Of course, returning from a ride one day, somehow I hit this gravel in a braking turn and went down fast and hard face first - right in front of my house. It must have looked hilarious because the entire complex erupted into laughter. I wasn't getting up because I was hurt - turned out to be broken ribs. Eventually the laughter died off as I lay there. When it did, all the people just went inside in that 'I don't want to be recognized as one of those laughing at someone really hurt' look on their faces. Not one person came over to help me. I literally had to crawl back to my house.

On a recent rerun on Funny Videos Show, one of the clips featured a cyclist getting spooked by a frisbee player and wrecking awkwardly into a body of water. A bicycle accident is nothing but a comedy routine for everyone who's not a cyclist.
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Old 05-29-06, 07:46 AM
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A couple of times on my ride yesterday, a couple of cars moved in close to the curb so I couldnt get through on the inside. I later decided it wasnt intentional, because when I got in front of them they gave me plenty of room when passing.
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Old 05-31-06, 10:39 PM
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Originally Posted by 古強者死神
So beyond the ill news, hows the trip been so far? Try to get some pics for me of your bike and all the stuff your towing im intrested in seeing what your taking with you across the US.
I guess this should probably go in the touring forum, but since this is here, its going ok so far.
My bike

and a better less aw'ing photo

Way too much stuff, but I can't figure out whyat I'd get rid of. The disadvantage to soloing is that there's stuff you need to take (stove, pan, tools) that don't really reduce with one person, but you can't share the load.
I use the backpack to counter the disadvantage of ortliebs, so I can keep non-water sensitive stuff where I can get it.
---
On sherman most people were much more accomidating. Everyone but those damn logging trucks (damnj cowboys) got well over.
Honestly, things seem to gtet better as I go east. Perhaps the stereotype of western v. eastern Washington needs to be reversed.
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Old 06-01-06, 12:28 AM
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Cool, thanks for the update. I tend to agree on the west/east thing to some extent.. My time in Cali was painfull compared the east side of the states, but im also from the east so I guess I just didnt fit in too well with the Cali crowd.

Next time I will go with you and we can split the load. Better on my bike than on my back like the old days.
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Old 06-01-06, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by nm+
I'm not normally an anti-car person, I like my car.
However, today really drove me off the edge. I'm riding the Northern Tier fully loaded and was climbing Loup Loup Pass on Washington 20. First some jerk throws a soda can ad me. I didn't get the plate, which sucked cause I will file assault charges (And I just met the local sherriff the other day, he was nice, small town cops can bbe very good allies).
However, the thing that really bothered me was this. I was clipped and forced off the road which had a steep soft shoulder. I slide down the ledge toward some barbed wire. Four cars, plus the clipper (again no plates) saw me fall. No one of them stopped.
I just dopn't get it, another human being is potentally seriously hurt (I wasn't just some scrapes) and not one person stopped. Jerks.
As a side note, I sat by the side of the raod with my first aid kit for 5 minutes before anyone sto[pped and asked if I was fine, a guy who hadn't even seen the fall.
What's the point of this? I dunno. i kinow I would have stopped, and these people probably would have stopped if I had been a motorcycle or car. I also know in Minnesota, and dare I say, my native California, where every driver is a jerk -- myself inculded -- one of five would have stopped. I assumed most people woyuld stop before now, but apparently not.
Ah bike v. car the only hit and run that seem accepted by society.
Sounds like a good illustration for a modern "Who's my neighbor?" parable. ". . . A certain cyclist was riding on the road to Damascus when he was run off the road by a jerk. A man in an SUV passed by, but did not stop. A woman in a minivan on the way to soccer practice passed by, but she did not stop. Then an illegal immigrant rode up on a Schwinn beater, and he stopped . . . ! Who was the neighbor to the cyclist?"

Also reminds me of an article on a recent death on Mt Everest. There was an amateur climber who had reached the summit on a solo climb and became fatigued on the descent. He sat down in the snow. About 40 climbers passed him, some even checked on him, gave some oxygen, noted he was poorly equipped. But none attempted a rescue. The man died. Who was his neighbor?
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Old 06-01-06, 10:26 AM
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Alot of people just fall into the "Not my problem" category. Or they just figure someone else will help. Anyone remember Kitty Genovese (sp?) in New York? In fact I remember reading some Psychological studies that found the larger the crowd, the less likely anyone was to help. They called it diffusion of responsibility or something similar.
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Old 06-01-06, 10:40 AM
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it's actually called the bystander effect. people just assume that "someone else" will help, so they don't.
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Old 06-01-06, 11:08 AM
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Sorry but I have to chime in and note that helping someone after a bicycle accident and helping someone near the top of Mt. Everest are two complelety different things. High altitude mountaineering has inherent risks that you must accept before attempting. The possibility always exists of not coming back and ultimately you can only rely on yourself and your climbing partners. Climbing Everest takes all of one's strength, attempting a rescue at that altitude is near impossible without a strong climbing party. Whereas helping someone from a bike accident requires no superhuman effort. You could probably argue that cycling has inherent risks, but fatality rates are no where near those of climbing.
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Old 06-01-06, 11:10 AM
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I was riding SR-50 West out of Somerset PA last July and they were doing some paving. There was a lip of pavement running parallel to my position on the shoulder for several miles. At one point it (the lip) began to veer over into the shoulder and I didn't notice it. I hit it doing about 20 and it threw me down onto my side. There was no one around, except for one road crew guy about a mile away from the rest of the guys working. I was fine, a bit of roadrash, and got up and dusted myself off. He just stared, not even an "Are you OK, buddy?" kind of thing. It mostly hurt my ego that he was there to see it, otherwise no one would have witnessed my dumbass crash, but still common courtesy goes a long way.
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Old 06-01-06, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by B10Cycle
but still common courtesy goes a long way.
Problem is, it just ain't "common" any more...
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Old 06-01-06, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by billh
Sounds like a good illustration for a modern "Who's my neighbor?" parable. ". . . A certain cyclist was riding on the road to Damascus when he was run off the road by a jerk. A man in an SUV passed by, but did not stop. A woman in a minivan on the way to soccer practice passed by, but she did not stop. Then an illegal immigrant rode up on a Schwinn beater, and he stopped . . . ! Who was the neighbor to the cyclist?"

Also reminds me of an article on a recent death on Mt Everest. There was an amateur climber who had reached the summit on a solo climb and became fatigued on the descent. He sat down in the snow. About 40 climbers passed him, some even checked on him, gave some oxygen, noted he was poorly equipped. But none attempted a rescue. The man died. Who was his neighbor?
Well put. I remember the parable and try to apply it to my life, as well as the golden rule. Kindness is a trait never overused. As for the climber, those people chose to climb on rather than assist him getting down the mountain. Is any accomplishment more important than a human life? No.
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Old 06-01-06, 12:02 PM
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Well, I have had two pretty good falls on roads. In both cases mutliple cars stopped and asked if I needed help or if they should call 911. This was in the East Bay, CA and down here in FL. I was even stopped once by the side of the road making a saddle adjustment and had couple of young women stop ask me if I was Ok or needed help. I guess they figured someone with gray hair and all sweaty must be having a heart attack or something. :>)
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Old 06-01-06, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by scottmorrison99
Well put. I remember the parable and try to apply it to my life, as well as the golden rule. Kindness is a trait never overused. As for the climber, those people chose to climb on rather than assist him getting down the mountain. Is any accomplishment more important than a human life? No.
You help others, if for nothing else, in the hope that when something happens to you, someone will help.
A history professor of mine grew up in Eastern Montana and said that they would always stop for a broken down car because of the low road volumes. They wanted to make damn sure that when you broke down, you weren't stuck somewhere for hours, probably withoyut food or water.
Perhaps this is why rural folks seem more likely to help (My fall was Memoral day weekend in an area saturatedf with Seattle tourists). When I ride in rural Minnesota and Wisconsin, I often get annoyed when stoppiung because every damn car seems to stop to make sure I'm alright. I'm always polite and thank them for stopping because, I know those folks may either help me or another cyclist stuck out there with a taco'd wheel or injury.
In the city, people seem to worried about getting to work on time to help. I'll admit, I'm probaly guilty of this. I'm not sure its something you always notice.
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Old 06-01-06, 02:00 PM
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I don't know why I am so lucky, but somehow I never ran into this particular sort of trouble with the human race (I do have many other peeves about it though ). People seem to want to help, and it's no different whether you're in a car, on foot or on a bike.

A few years ago my boyfriend was riding his bike downtown Toronto when he noticed his left shoe was completely soaked in blood. He has some bad veins very close to the surface, so even a small scratch can start a huge leak. So he got off his bike, poured the blood out of his shoe and called me asking to bring bandages. This happened only about a mile away from our house, so I hopped onto a bike and got to the spot within a few minutes of his call. He said in that short time he's had about sixty people enquire about his well-being and offer help. The rivers of blood were pretty spectacular though, that could've been a factor.

In fact, I think if a study were to take place, I'd expect it to find that people are least likely to stop and help somebody in the suburbs. They are just so... impersonal.
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Old 06-01-06, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by EUV
Sorry but I have to chime in and note that helping someone after a bicycle accident and helping someone near the top of Mt. Everest are two complelety different things. High altitude mountaineering has inherent risks that you must accept before attempting. The possibility always exists of not coming back and ultimately you can only rely on yourself and your climbing partners. Climbing Everest takes all of one's strength, attempting a rescue at that altitude is near impossible without a strong climbing party. Whereas helping someone from a bike accident requires no superhuman effort. You could probably argue that cycling has inherent risks, but fatality rates are no where near those of climbing.
I think the analogy still holds. There is more at stake on the Everest climb. The helpers have more to give up, for some a significant financial investment and for some a once in a lifetime opportunity. But still they have weighed all that against a human life and made their decision. Some of those who passed the climber were still on their way up, fresh and well-equipped. It was not impossible for them to stop and rescue the man. They just chose not to. The point of the article was that the climbing scene on Everest had changed from only the most experienced (who would not hestitate to rescue) to a theme-park mentality. How much is a human life worth? How bad off do they have to be before you help?

https://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/new...C%22everest%22
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Old 06-01-06, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by o-dog
it's actually called the bystander effect. people just assume that "someone else" will help, so they don't.
There are other reasons too. I was dating a gal one evening and she (a nurse) drove right past an accident that had just happened. The car involved had passed us not 30 seconds before at about 90 mph. She told me that she was afraid that she could get sued if she tried to help. But there was no penalty for not stopping.

No penalty for her at least. Both teens in the car died, and I heard announcements on TV asking for help in identifying them for about a week.
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Old 06-01-06, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Artkansas
There are other reasons too. I was dating a gal one evening and she (a nurse) drove right past an accident that had just happened. The car involved had passed us not 30 seconds before at about 90 mph. She told me that she was afraid that she could get sued if she tried to help. But there was no penalty for not stopping.

No penalty for her at least. Both teens in the car died, and I heard announcements on TV asking for help in identifying them for about a week.
This is completely untrue. Every state (in the US at least) has good samaritan laws. These protect you basic ally unless you do something willful or claim you're a doctor when you're not.
Also, I believe that this is taught at med and nursing schools. Heck, itv was taught in my basic red cross first aid class.
She should have stopped.
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Old 06-01-06, 03:50 PM
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BTW that Everest climber that was left by one group for dead, has been found by another group and has been rescued and is recuperating.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...ationworld-hed
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Old 06-01-06, 03:55 PM
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I believe the thread title shoud have been "Some People are Jerks" or "Many People are Jerks." I really don't think we all are.
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Old 06-01-06, 04:00 PM
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I think I ment to type "some" but dropped the word.
Dunno what freud would say about it. Something about my mom prolly
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Old 06-01-06, 04:02 PM
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I wouldn't have helped them because they got what they deserved for driving so recklessly.
And yes, I'm an jerk. I've had the thought many times when passed dangerously by some jerk doing 90, that I would love to see them take themselves out.

Both teens in the car died; Darwin award.


Originally Posted by Artkansas
There are other reasons too. I was dating a gal one evening and she (a nurse) drove right past an accident that had just happened. The car involved had passed us not 30 seconds before at about 90 mph. She told me that she was afraid that she could get sued if she tried to help. But there was no penalty for not stopping.

No penalty for her at least. Both teens in the car died, and I heard announcements on TV asking for help in identifying them for about a week.
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Old 06-01-06, 05:03 PM
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I think you just got unlucky. One thing I've noticed is that people tend to model their behavior off others. When I'm riding and someone pulls out to pass, the vehicles behind tend to do the same. Likewise, if a couple cars in a row buzz me I can expect the same from the next several vehicles behind. This means that if you are unlucky and the first half dozen cars are jerks, people who would have otherwise stopped might not.

My experiences with motorists offering help have been very good. I'm trying to think if I have ever crashed in view of others and not been offered assistance. On the two occasions where I hit a car and it was my fault, the drivers offered assistance before assessing damage to their vehicles even though I just had a few scrapes and was obviously fine.

I have also had people offer assistance when I was fixing my bike many times. When riding in dark winter storms, I've even had people hold their lights on me and refuse to leave until they saw me riding again.
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