I don't think so.

I suspect ILTB is waiting for someone to mention the book Effective Cycling by John Forester so he can say something nasty about it or Forester. He seems to thrive on saying nasty things about people and ideas with whom and with which he disagrees. It's really pathetic, and, frankly, I feel sorry for him. What a miserable way to waste so much time in one's precious life.

Is that the book that is used by LCI's to teach the course? If not then ok, what is the title of the book. If so, cool, I can't wait to read it. I may even buy a copy before hand. I'm sure I can find a copy at Barnes & Noble.

The book Effective Cycling is not used directly in the Road 1/2 courses, but much of the material comes from it and Forester's original "Effective Cycling" training materials. In the LCI certification course, there is required reading from the book.

The latest edition is from 1992 or something, so much of it is outdated (particularly anything about equipment or technology). I suggest skimming through those parts.

However, the stuff about where to ride on the streets when is all applicable today.

Check out the reviews on Amazon.com.

The Grand LCI's WannaBeez! I think this; no I think that. Yep, $50 to listen to these two preach bicycling safety or is it crystal ball reading? Anyone who volunteers for such an ordeal, deserves it. But no cyclist should be mandated by do-gooders to sit through any class that allows characters like this to be "certified" to preach their own nut house views about cycling.

Who said anything about mandating anything? We can't make anyone take the courses. Just offer them & if anyone signs up, teach them. I don't think the curriculum is something that is made up by anyone other then the LAB & is to be used by the LCI for the course. Despite what my views on cycling are I will comply to using the LAB materials to teach the course as an LCI. I have a feeling my views are closley matched to what is taught the Road 1/2 course & what I will teach as an LCI.

So before you go off spouting what you think our "nut house" views are & what you think we wil teach get the ****ing facts first! Besides I thought you liked verifiable proof. And here you go assuming ****! Gee, hmm sure looks like you're not practicing what you preach but have no problem telling others to do so.

Tell you what. I'll make a special trip to Burlington & offer the class to anyone who wants to take it & will not charge you for it. I'll let you know when I obtain my LCI certification, then we can work out a time for me to travel to Burlington so I can teach the course.

There are currently 3 LCI's in the state of Iowa registered with the LAB. There are 6 in Nebraska, 4 in Omaha alone. I think one or two of them are coming up to teach the course on the 23rd. I will make number 4 in Iowa, I will also cover this part of Nebraska & South Dakota.

ILTB do you belong to this fun looking group? http://www.bikeburlington.org/

I've had the pleasure of riding & having a drink with this fun group. As tight assed as you are I can not imagine you're a member or even ride with them.

You might be interested to know that most LCIs supplement the LAB material with their own. In particular, there is a powerful PC presentation, with very interesting video (taken with dual headed, one front-view and one rear-view, helmet-mounted cameras) that conveys many of the key concepts we discuss here (and are part of the LAB curriculum) much more efficiently and effectively than anything I've ever seen.

There is a good chance this presentation will be adopted by LAB for use by all LCIs, one way or another.

The book I was referring to is the Road 1 Manual (or whatever class you are teaching). I have never read anything from Effective Cycling, so I cannot comment on information that might be carried over to the LAB Manuals.

The camera work being done for the classes is wonderful. It really shows students what they might encounter on the road before they are taken out as part of the class. I know that I also have my own presentation to use in my shortened classes for the MS Ride and I have not compared that to the Road 1 Manual.

As for mandating classes.... the BP MS150 ride requires participants to attend a safety clinic and it has become such a part of the culture around the event that 'Safety is Cool'. That could translate into better safety on all the organized rides in the area if many other charity rides contemplate a method to emulate the BP MS150.

Sounds like CircleVision 360 with a limp. :p Seriously though, do they distribute it at all, or is it one of those "for paid up local folks only" kinda deals? I'd be curious to see certain maneuvers executed from both viewpoints.

The developers of the video material feel that it's important that the information be presented only when trained and certified instructors can explain the context, underlying principles, and field any questions, because it's much more effective that way.

But if you plan on any trips to the L.A. area, maybe we can get you into a class.

^^ and by LA area, he roughly means anywhere south of Pismo Beach and as far east as Vegas^^ :)

Also, the creators could speak to this better, but I do not believe that they have been able to show it to everyone so it might not be 'officially' blessed yet. (I have been know to insert my foot into my mouth before, so don't quote me on this) I know that I would love to have a copy of everything so that I could start incorporating it into my own presentations.

That's right. It's not officially blessed by the LAB yet, but it doesn't need to be for LCIs to use it...

I was afraid of this. They really can't integrate such contextualization into a freely-distributed presentation (maybe under a Creative Commons license to ensure they still get credit?), or failing that, at least as a film anybody anywhere can purchase for viewing in the privacy of their own home? I hate to pull a "gee, sounds like somebody's got ulterior motives" card, but it seems to me that if they genuinely believed in spreading the practices encouraged by these courses and their apparent subsequent benefits, it wouldn't be so exclusive or expensive. Are we to believe that those who can't afford course fees and/or aren't in a given geographical area don't deserve to learn these allegedly safer practices, or what?

Or maybe the creators want to work out all the "bugs" before distributing to a wider audience?

Good point. I missed the bit you quoted and made the mistake of assuming it to be older than relatively recent. Sorry for not reading more carefully. My bad.

EDIT: OTOH, why don't they sanction some semi-public version of the footage, clearly mark it as a work-in-progress, and circulate it for feedback, and then implement the "best" changes? They'd stand a chance at making more progress in a shorter space of time this way, yet their discretion still wins out and they can still get their desired message across (whatever it may be).

If I was independently wealthy I would happily travel to your location to show this to you free of charge. Until then, could you meet me halfway by setting up a group of students to attend the class and I will work to get sponsorship for the class so that no one has to pay money.

I hope that gets rid of that 'ulterior motives' card... :D

Sure does! I meant it more as a general statement...but hey, I should know better than that, too, right? :o Really, thanks for the offer. Chances are I won't be sending you any students (don't know enough interested parties, and I feel odd advising people to partake in something I haven't been involved in myself), but sounds like the offer's really coming from the right place.

Oh, and trust me, I understand the funding thing. I help run a computer refurbishment/recycling program here in Chicago. We've had a ton of people come through, a fair amount of media coverage, and we *still* can't get grants, even when we're having folks earn "free" computer systems through 20 hours of volunteer time. Rough lot to be in, trying to do things for the "greater good"...