Helmet Head

Which do you prefer? A 4 lane highway with bike lanes, or a 6 lane highway with narrow outside lanes?

If it depends, go by this specific example:
https://www.bikeforums.net/advocacy-safety/265635-bike-lane-removed-highway.html

SingingSabre 

Of course, everyone who answers "I prefer 4 lanes + bike lanes" is wrong.

Helmet Head

No one can be wrong about a preference, SingingSabre.

Eatadonut

I prefer 4 lane highways with super wide lanes, super wide shoulders, and plenty of grass on both sides. If there's a 20' grass median in the middle, even better.

Plenty of those in Oklahoma I'll take my lane when I feel safe, and when I start to feel the bad juju, I retreat to my massive shoulder.

Brian Ratliff

Here's the rub. Am I a cyclist or a driver? I prefer different things in each respective vehicle.

I've seen plenty of evidence that enlarging roads doesn't have the effect of decreasing car density like one would think, but rather, it simply attracts more cars. Opening the road up might make side streets more pleasant, or it might not, depending on how many people currently limit their car trips because of the traffic, but the level of congestion will likely stay constant after a year or two period of fluctuation.

I don't see anything but bad in making a current 4 lane + bike lane into a 6 laned NOL road.

noisebeam

What if that outer lane had sharrows or a bicycle icon or some such regular reminder that cyclist are to use its full width?

What if that road had an intersection every 200' or so, a major one every 1/4mi?

What if there was a 3mi stretch with no intersection, but a sign at the begining of the stretch said 'pass cyclist using adjacent lane' or some such language?

What if cyclists regularly used this road and it was commonplace to encounter them using the full lane?

Al

I-Like-To-Bike

It might look like this even on two lane roads. I think I would like that; how 'bout you?

sbhikes

I think 6 lane roads are evil no matter what you drive. It's a sign of some sort of failure.

Helmet Head

How would a cyclist get anywhere with all those bicyclists in the way?

chipcom 

Same way all those bicyclists do I would assume.

donnamb 

Oh, I just might, ILTB.

rajman

I had a 'funny' post about condeming the communist highway builders at the expense of the free market. Seriously though - if there are six lanes worth of traffic there is money to be made in a train... Stop the communists from ramming roads down our throats!

rajman

oops - the 'funny' post made it through, oh well...

Bekologist

i guess to helmet head, cyclist and driver are interchangable, he certainly confuses his RV for a bike on occasion.

really helmet, do you really think riders will prefer highway speed roads with nothing but narrow lanes? You really are pretty out of touch with real time riding. chest beating from the armchair, sure. You're out of touch with reality, buddy.

Helmet Head

Sure, but the enlightened ones still comprise only a small percentage. But the numbers are growing...

Bekologist

hahaha. in your imagination, i guess. not compared to total ridership. your little 'dream' is a fade in the wash.

sbhikes

If where I ride they took a 4 lane + BL road and turned it into a 6 lane no BL road first of all, there would be such an outcry from the bicycle advocates and the sustainable transportation people that this would never happen. But if it did, I certainly would NOT ride a bike there. I'd find a secret shortcut, and if none existed I would give it up. In fact, I would move away.

No thank you. Call me what you wish. But I'd rather fire up my still, play my fiddle on the porch and eat another bowl of possum stew.

CommuterRun

A benefit of not having the bike lane on roads with multiple same direction lanes, particularly if narrow lanes, is it gives the cyclist the entire width of the right most lane to ride in, giving motor vehicles the other same direction lane(s) to pass. A wider lane gives the cyclist more options as to road position. A bike lane as wide as a motor vehicle lane is extremely rare.

Multiple, narrow, same direction lanes are the best facility for cyclist safety. Bike lanes tend to gather debris and lead to closer, and higher speed, passing. As if the painted line is some kind of unbreachable wall.

I-Like-To-Bike

You mean a Real ÜberCyclist like the kind who would post such a question about bicyclists "in the way"? I don't worry about the "needs" of such characters for exclusivity.

I-Like-To-Bike

The shame and pity is that this self described "enlightened" poster is actually serious that his views on bicycling advocacy/bicycling safety are "enlightened".

genec

Are these dedicated bike roads or just regular streets empty of cars?

The width and appearance are similar to what I might call "bike hiways," and it is similar to a short stretch of such a "bike hiway" here in San Diego.

Although frankly riding along in that country scene just looks quite peaceful.

What is the story there ILTB?

sbhikes

Until some jack donkey decides to teach him a lesson and drive him into the curb, or until some little old lady driving her original 1965 Cadillac with her poof of white hair barely visible over the steering wheel plows into him, or until the town votes to ban the cyclists from this road because they are impeding traffic, or until...

I much prefer a city that plans alternative transportation into the system than one that leaves it to fend for itself.

SingingSabre 

I didn't exactly choose to be Jewish, it was just how I was raised. It made a lot more sense to me than the other religions did, but as long as we all got along, it didn't matter what religion we were. When I was a kid, many, many times people would harrass me on the bus because I was Jewish. They said that I had killed Jesus, that I was going to Hell, that G-d didn't like me, I had killed his only son, etc. Basically, they harassed me because I was of a different mindset than they were.

What can I say? It worked for me. I didn't hurt anyone, I didn't want to. I existed and didn't have any problems.

Perhaps you can see my analogy coming already, perhaps not. Either way, here it goes.

Don't put "ineffective cyclists" down simply because we like our facilities, because we don't want to ride outside the lane when we have a perfectly good lane to ride in, because we don't think like you. Don't be like the immature kids on my bus acting like they were bigger than me while hiding behind their parent's beliefs. It doesn't make you a bigger, more intelligent man who's ahead of the curve and thinks better than other people; it just irritates the snot out of many, many people on this board.

This forum does not need a jihad between VC and non VC. We all ride, that should be enough. Occasional debate is good, but turning a large number of threads into "debates" when it's really just VC proselytizing in remarkably inappropiate. Just like proselytizing on the school bus, it's out of place, out of line, and wholly ineffective.

chipcom 

I'll take 4 lanes with a WOL or bike lane over 6 lanes and a NOL any day, because the 6 lane monstrosity will inevitably become NO BIKES ALLOWED.

joejack951

FYI, it's legally impossible to impede traffic on a roadway with more than one same direction lane.