Cleave

Hi,

I was driving over to the LBS on Thursday night to pick up my new stem. I was going south on PCH towards Seal beach and I saw two guys on bikes: one on a road bike with a backpack (and a helmet?) and one on a fixed gear without a helmet. Traffic was normally heavy for the six o'clock hour and these guys were very close to each other but they were obviously not riding together.

So why the soapbox? Both of them were blatantly and with little caution, running red lights!

Of the 3-4 lights that I saw them run, cars definitely had to brake to avoid hitting them. Fortunately nothing was so close as to cause accidents between cars but it steamed me because here were a couple of "geniuses" adding fuel to the fire that causes drivers to tell the rest of that we shouldn't be riding our bikes on the streets.

With all of the posts the past couple of days on this sub forum and the Road Cycling sub forum about cars harassing riders, I thought that I'd post this to "balance" the discussion. Not that I think that most drivers are angels, but we don't need to incite more drivers with bad habits like this.

Anyway, I know that I'm MOSTLY preaching to the choir, but I felt the need to preach anyway.

redal

What kits? My brother in law lives in that area and I yell at him all the time when we are riding together.

Cleave

Hi,

No kits. The road bike guy looked like he was commuting and the fixie guy was a messenger poseur.

redal

OK, I can hang up the phone. Tony would have been totally decked out, looking like a poseur to some.

Cleave

It definitely wasn't Tony. BTW, his daughter, Alexi, goes to the same middle school as my youngest son.

redal

Alexi is a hammer. The women's peloton better watch out in a few years.

Happytime

+1 Agreed!

Extort

I really hate cyclists like that. They are making the next car driver angry at me for simply enjoying my ride.

VanceMac

Definitely preaching to the converted here. And I'll pile on a little. As much as I love SFVBC, and everyone in it, their larger group rides frustrate the tar out of me anymore. They get stuck in this gray area between recreational ride and serious pacelining, resulting in chaos. It's not fun, and makes drivers nervous as heck.

merider1

+2...these types of riders do nothing but harm the cycling community.

markw

<rant> Today on the amtrak, a bunch of guys wearing OCRR jerseys piled up at a stop sign. I was in front of them, and they were pacelining blowing stopsigns I guess. Anyway, I checked the mirror, they were a few hundred yards back. I stopped since there was an SUV coming from the other direction with his blinker on and he was there first. SUV gets partway into the lane, then I hear "stopping" from behind me, then I hear the sound of bikes colliding and some guy hits the pavement next to me. One of them starts going off on me for stopping. "Dude, you can't stop like that" Like I was supposed to blow the SS and face the SUV. I wasn't in their group, they were a good hundred yards back when I stopped and motioned the SUV to go, after all, he had the been at the intersection before me and had waited while the group in front blew the SS. So here we were with guys picking themselves up and myself and a moron in a shouting match about why you should stop at an SS. It still bothers me that these guys were blowing SS's and running lights to keep their pace up. They had done it earlier and went blowing right by me at a redlight, yet I still had caught them and passed them down the road, go figure.
I'm not innocent of blowing a SS, and do it quite often, but I do slow, and there's usually no other traffic at the intersection or approaching the intersection. These guys were flat out blowing through them in traffic. </rant>

herbm

Sigh....I have to agree..unfortunately....even today I saw some stuff that I would never do....and I hate it if I am in the middle of the pack, you have no choice but to go with the flow...

cjbruin

Yesterday I was driving on Culver toward Newport and there was a cyclist who ignored the "no bicycles" sign at the intersection with Campus. This is the area where the construction has been going on and is very narrow. Cars were passing him slowly since there wasn't a lot of room. When I passed him, I said out the window, "That's not very smart, mate." Of course, he shook his head at me as if I was the one doing something wrong.

I've learned to face it...as many cool people as I know who are road cyclists, there are at least as many ******bags who think they own the road and give the rest of us a bad name. Live and let live (or die) I always say.

Recumbents Suck

Mr. Wolfe,

I find your story very interesting and entertaining. Sounds like you did everything right, and were unjustly accused of causing an accident. You checked your mirrors, stopped at the SS, motioned for the truck to proceed, etc. But, I'm curious. If you did everything right, why were you in a shouting match about with someone about the incident? What was their side of the story? It sounds like you took it upon yourself to direct traffic at an intersection. You waived the truck through. Did you signal for the approaching cyclists to stop? If so, and they disregarded you, I can see your point. If not, then don't you feel partly responsible? If you felt it was your responsibility to direct traffic at an intersection, signed or not, then you're responsible to insure ALL parties understand your directions. Oh well. According to your tale, at least one of the reckless cyclists yelled “Stopping!”

You also said the cyclists were a "few hundred yards back." That seems to be plenty of distance for them to react to a truck turning in front of them. I'm curious as to just how fast they were going to "pile up" at an intersection just seconds after you waived the truck through. Well, let’s do some simple math and find out. Lets assume for the sake of argument that you and the truck are both stopped, starring at each other. The wanton cyclists are bearing down on you from behind. Let’s further assume that, from the moment you waved the truck on, it took a generous 5 seconds for him to start moving (time to understand your hand signal, react at the controls, and the truck to move forward). Assume also the cyclists, at the time you signaled were a few hundred yards back (In reality, it was when you looked in your mirror, but we’ll assume you’re quick on the draw). A “few” is usually more than two, so let’s assume 300 yards. If they covered the 300 yards from the moment you waived until the truck blocked the intersection, that’s 300 yards in 5 seconds, or 180 ft/sec. Another words, they were traveling at 122 mph?!?! Wow! The WERE reckless. Maybe it wasn’t quite 300 yards. How about 200? That’s still 120 ft/sec or 81 mph! Hmm. Were they 100 yards back, traveling 60 ft/sec? 40mph is possible for pro cyclists, but fools like this? I’m a CAT3 cyclist. In a flat sprint I can hit 38mph, but only for a few seconds. Was this a screaming downhill? (I have a confession to make. I was there. It was dead flat.) So, it wasn’t a descent. Then, it’s not likely that they were maintaining 40mph. We should probably assume these were just average Joes, cruising at a brisk 20mph. That’s, 29.3 ft/sec. So, if it took an entire 5 seconds for the sluggish driver to block the intersection, the reckless cyclists were really only about 150ft behind you? Were objects closers than they appeared in your mirror? I’d have to say yes.

So, let’s recap so far. You decided to direct traffic at an intersection, did not signal to all traffic, misjudged the distances, then POW, a pile up! Funny, I remember just one guy who didn’t stop quite fast enough, and touched wheels with the guy in front of him. Your story gets a little vague about what the injuries were, and what happened next. I’m guessing it’s because, following the accident and the brief exchange of words, you immediately rode away. At least the guy in the truck was nice enough to ask if everyone was OK. What was it the moron said to you? “Dude, you can’t stop like that.” You’re right, he’s clearly a moron. I recall how eloquently you responded. Your parting words of wisdom explaining your position perfectly, making it clear you were in the right. From the middle of the intersection, you screamed “F___ YOU!” Classy.

If you’re going to rant on the internet about how the whole world is insane, except you, you’d better take a hard look in the mirror first. Maybe if you rode with a cycling group like OCRR on a more regular basis, you'd be more familiar with common cycling etiquette. Accidents happen. We get on and we’re going to fall off. But, we don’t need inexperienced, inconsiderate, self-righteous, belligerent jerks like you on the road making bad decisions and adversely affecting those around you. Mr. Wolfe, the fact that you have the balls to claim you were completely innocent is appalling.

Shame on the rest of you for believing Mark Wolfe's BS post.

Happytime

Troll Alert!!!!

Psydotek

Why do you hate insanity?

I've already accepted my own insanity so...

Happytime

ronjon10

I don't care if the cyclists were only 20 feet behind him. If there was a car stopped at an intersection while the cyclists hadn't made it to the intersection yet, the cyclists need to stop or slow way down. Period.

StrangeWill

Psh I cut in front of heavy machinery, because as we all know, if it comes down to it, I'll totally win.

Psydotek

Can we feed you instead?

Happytime

Chicken sandwich with avocado and tomatoes, please. Fruit on the side.

ggallin

critical mass, midnight ridazz, etc

bac

Don't worry - Darwin is at work.

... Brad

Extort

There was a Stop Sign... get it, that means STOP....


I - d - 1 - 0 - t

ovoleg

this is no way a balance I hope you arent serious

In a bike you get killed, in a car you kill the rider.

When the cars violate the law it results in a death of the innocent.

When the rider breakers the law it generally results in death of the violator.

big big difference.

I dont even know how you compared them.