noisebeam

Note the cyclist to my right didn't even check if another vehicle was turning right. The turning vehicle should yield, but counting on it is not wise.

I have ridden at 15mph on this street (often when I get groceries and load up) and my wife used to every day as well at close to those speeds. She moved from sidewalk to street without us even talking about it (she cycle commuted before I did) because she had so many close calls with entering exiting traffic.

The average speed of the buses that run ever 15min on this street is ~15mph (including stops) when load is high. When cycling I have to pass them quite often. Of course they get up to 40mph between the 1/4mi spaced stops.

My comment about my speed was not that it is needed to ride on this street, but specifically to BarracksSi who mentioned a speed saying I would not make the next light anyway and that the sidewalk would be better. The sidewalk is not even safe at 10mph.

Al

genec

I disagree that the sidewalk is not safe at 10MPH. It is the intersections that are not safe... the sidewalk probably works quite well at 10MPH. At least around here they work... so few pedestrians use them.

However, my point is not that you blocked traffic, nor that you could or could not have made the light. My comment IS about much faster roads and how well cyclists integrate on those roads. Frankly you fit into the traffic pattern perfectly.

Personally I think vehicular cycling works very well at 25MPH, and even perhaps up to 35MPH where traffic is probably averaging about 28MPH... but multilaned arterial roads with speeds of 50+MPH with heavy traffic moving at that rate, are NOT the ideal location for lane using vehicular cyclists. And for those situations, if traffic is going to move smoothly, there has to be some other solution. And no, sidewalks are not the solution either.

noisebeam

Gene- I have only occasionally ridden on 50mph posted roads that had a narrow outside lane - and these were all in more of a rural setting where there was much less faster traffic - so passing was easy.
All my riding on suburban roads posted 50mph have either had a wide outside lane or a ridable shoulder. So I can't comment with any experience on the situation you ask about.

Of course many roads I ride on with narrow outside lanes are posted 40mph or 45mph and traffic moves faster than that unless due to congestion. The road in the video is 40mph posted (it was 45mph until late 2005)

Here is a different 40mph posted road with NOL. Note that all motorized traffic is faster than me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNYSvFc50qA

Al

noisebeam

Sure between intersections 10mph is OK. But there are so many intersections. How many do you see along the sidewalk here? Can you map out a safe route at 10mph on this sidewalk?

https://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...0&d=1174496455

Note in this video I posted above (The one I pass bus on left) at 1:55 a dense group of pedestrians waiting to board bus. At 2:05 a car exiting driveway completely over x-walk. At 2:25 three abreast kids. What would I do then? Jump between sidewalk and road? That creates unpredictable behavior.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NnobUTTcHk

Al

CommuterRun

I disagree. In my experience Noisebeam is as far to the right as is safe for cycling on a road like that, in those traffic conditions. I would have certainly not been any further to the right in a lane too narrow to share, with intersecting side streets and driveways. The horn blower was just a jerk cager out to prove they're a jerk cager. If they can't read traffic any better than that, to know when they need to change lanes to pass, then they are incompetent.

Actually, I would consider that road to be very good - excellent for cycling. The lanes are obviously too narrow to be shared, but there is another same direction lane that motorists can move into to pass without having to be concerned with on coming traffic.

1Easyrider

It's legal to take drugs but does that make it right????

How would it be reckless and illegal to pass an object without touching. It's amazing what a wake-up call can do for some cyclists though isn't it?

Admitted, it could be unsafe, especially if a dithery cyclist wobbled and touched my paintwork.

CommuterRun

Motorists who do this only demonstrate their own incompetence.

In a state with a 3' passing law a closer pass is illegal. However 3' isn't enough to be safe when being passed by larger vehicles at higher speeds. This is why it's up to the cyclist to control the lane by their position, and making it blatantly obvious that a pass without changing lanes is impossible in a lane too narrow to share.

A wake up call? To me a close pass is a wake up call. It indicates that I need to be further to the left in the lane. Even if further left is the middle of the lane.

Biiig negative on this one. Sure the physical space is there, but many motorists won't use it. It has been my experience that the more space I keep on my right, up to a point, being the middle of the lane, the more room I am typically given on my left by passing motorists. This does not account for the occasional pinhead cager who is going to play harass the cyclist, regardless of the cyclist's road position. And by staying further left rather than up against the curb, I have room to maneuver to negate the pinhead's tactics.

Much more hazardous to the cyclist to stay too far to the right.

1Easyrider

Don't try to be clever because you're obviously not one of the brightest bulbs in the box are you?

So what you are saying is that side-by-side is sharing, yet single file is not sharing.

Don't give up your day job fella. LOL

1Easyrider

and you are rude and obnoxious, I hope your children don't see what you write on here.

1Easyrider

You talk as if out of you're backside...... a load of crap: 'considerate, aggressive, rebarbative, "teach 'em a lesson", endanger life'? So many expletives.

Firstly, a considerate cyclist would cycle near to the kerb.

Secondly, try to look at driving a motor vehicle from the male perspective.

I'm a male motorist and you are a female motorist, so I can see where you are coming from. In my experience most women have a big problem when it comes to manoevering their motor vehicles. Giving an excessively wide berth whilst overtaking, or not even having the balls to overtake at all is just one of them.

I am quite comfortable overtaking parked vehicles, moving vehicles and even cyclists by even the narrowest of margins and have never had any problems in doing so, as I would expect that most male drivers and the odd female driver not to have. You as a woman though, would probably need have half a mile of clear distance from oncoming traffic and probably 3 lanes in which to manoever in and then still decide not to overtake.

So come on, look it from a male perspective! Overtaking is not such a big deal.

1Easyrider

Noisebeam, you tube. It's the 25.4% (at the time of writing) that just want to antagonise (Queens English, it's spelt with an 'S' not a 'Z').

I trust you're one of the 25.4% then.

JeffB502

LOL damn easyrider you're on quite a tirade! Personally, although I don't agree with most of the things you say, I frequently find your comments quite entertaining (and sometimes the discussions that come from them). Keep going! Maybe somebody that wants to argue will respond. I'll just sit back and enjoy the good times

CommuterRun

DUDE!! That's the biggest load of completely idiotic, misogynistic, BS I've heard in a looong time!

ghettocruiser

You're providing more *perspective* on the type of people that honk than you realize.

1Easyrider

[QUOTE=CommuterRun;5817883]DUDE!! That's the biggest load of completely idiotic, misogynistic, BS I've heard in a looong time!
QUOTE]

Hey DUDE, (you sound like a Beatle) my comments certainly aren't idiotic or BS, a little misogynistic maybe, but hey it's not a crime to be misogynistic. It is a fact of life though that women have problems manoevering their motor vehicles.

So, without being totally misogynistic I will hold my hand up and admit that there are some guys out there who drive like women!

CommuterRun

Umm, "Hey Jude" is the song you're thinking of. Being from that side of the pond, I would think you would know that. But maybe your knowledge of music is no better than your driving competence.



Advocating curb hugging at the expense of safety, and threatening anyone who doesn't comply with unsafe, harassing and illegal driving is both and more.

Scout!

In the Queen's English, one uses a possessive apostrophe. In Queens, NY, English, one doesn't give a damn about spelling.

rando

I like Pie!

rando

I find that motorists are 25.4% more likely to be courteous if you offer them a slice of pie.

Bekologist

just because someone (1easyrider) owns a bike doesn't mean they ride much- just look at this forum's primadonna safety nanny for similar examples of autocentric thinking not befitting someone (purportedly) getting in lots of saddle time.

soooo, I think most of us are in agreement some lanes are shareable and some are meant to be taken. Some posting here feel you need to slow the motorists up by taking the lane EVEN IF THERE'S PLENTY OF ROOM, but that's a separate issue more evocative of paranoia than sound cycling advice.

1Easyrider

"Lane Controlling Position"???? What are you like? Where are you coming from?

You really do cycle like a real life JoeJackAss.

Cyclists don't have "lane controlling positions". It's those big metal things with at least 4 wheels the control the lane. Cyclists should keep out of the way as much as possible otherwise they'll cop it from irate motorists one way or another, or in your case you'll continually keep getting stopped by those nice Law Enforcement Officers.

powerhouse

For me it would depend upon various situations wherever and whenever I happened to be riding. I don't take the lane unless I need to and share the road with others. However, here are some of those circumstances when I might take the lane.

1. Lane width and whether or not I would have a place to safely move over to.
2. Amount of traffic.
3. Road hazards (i.e. potholes, railroad crossings, bridges and bridge decks, poor pavement conditions and pavement endings
endings,
4. Speed limits.
5. Road or street width.
6. Bicycle, side, or breakdown lanes.

1Easyrider

Stuff and nonsense, there are 2 lanes for overtaking for christ's sake and the idiot cyclist decides to extract the preverbial urine by cycling in the centre of his lane.

1Easyrider

[quote=CommuterRun;5818802]Umm, "Hey Jude" is the song you're thinking of. Being from that side of the pond, I would think you would know that. But maybe your knowledge of music is no better than your driving competence.QUOTE]

Jeez, of course it was the song I was referring to. I was taking the pi$$, but it went straight over your head, just like those motorists will if you keep cycling in the centre of the lane.

1Easyrider

Dib, dib, dib. Dob, dob, dob.

......and on the WWW we don't give a jack$hit about grammar, much the same in NY as cyclists appear not to give a damn about other road users. old chap.