Allister

Are you still whining? Surely a better direction for all that energy is at the idiots on the MH comments section.

cudak888 

Glad to hear everyone survived this one - it certainly has the appearance of an accident that could have been fatal.

EDIT: Forgot to take into account injuries. How did the 10 riders fare?

-Kurt

P.S.: Anyone salvage a left-hand Dura-Ace 7800 crankarm out of the wreck, by any chance?

Allister

BF forensics is based on old episodes of Starsky and Hutch.

It was mentioned that he continued a way after striking them. It's kinda hard to hold your lane with a bike wedged up under the wheel like that, even when you're awake, so I daresay the final position of the taxi reveals little about the collision itself. Also note that bike wreckage is pretty liberally strewn about the right lane, even onto the shoulder.

uke

If you consider correcting misinterpretations whining, sure.

Allister

Then we are in agreement. See how easy that was?

Personally, I'm more interested in this 'RationalCaneHomer' character, and his mysteriously unnamed 'anti-cycling group'. I googled 'anti-cycling group' and the only thing that looked like an actual group was this one. If that's RationalCaneHomer's, I wish him all the luck in the world.

KarmicPedals

it's not like "rational" and "'cane" together aren't an oxymoron anyway. :-P

My point about the taxi in the center lane was that it was well centered - and it didn't give any appearance of a sudden stop. The Miami Herald has become fact weak on most of their reporting in the last years -- so the 150 feet or more before the taxi stopped wasn't mentioned during the day.

-=(8)=-

Have to agree. Or maybe wannaride doesnt commute, daily ?
Easily the most hostile enviroment Ive ever seen. One even
has to have 'sno-bird' routes because when they are here, your
normal route just becomes to dangerous to ride. The northernized
section on SC, around Charleston, Mt. Pleasant and a few other areas
comes close, though.

San Rensho 

[QUOTE=wannaride;7335221]This is far from the truth. From what I've read on this board we are relatively lucky here in SoFla. I rarely have problems with cars. Today I had much bigger issues with other riders including some genius who doing 35 mph coming off the Key Biscayne bridge whistled loudly instead of saying "on your left" when he came up on a slower rider which caused the other rider to almost take out his buddy and me. Another problem is the following group who doing 30 or so will pass riders on both sides. While very unfortunate you can understand some of the riduculous and outrageous comments made about bicyclists as these idiots will do equally stupid things around cars.

Back on point, this was an absolutely unnecessary tragedy. I will not ride the McArthur Causeway because of the glass on the side of the road and the fact that cars fly here. The next causeway up is a pretty nice ride and except for the bridge work - which I get by doing Key Biscayne after Miami Beach - there is no reason to be on McArthur Causeway. Of course they should be able to ride it without risk and this should never have happened.

No one mentioned that Saturday morning a runner got killed by a car crossing US 1. Absolutely no reason that should have happened although many runners do not make themselves as visible as they should.

We have a lot of work to do here.[/QUOTE]

You are so wrong. I don't know what Miami you ride in, but it surely isn't the Miami I ride in. The Miami I ride in is the Miami where the poeple who submitted comments to the Herald like "the taxi-cab driver should get a medal for running over the cyclists" buzz me, cut me off, slam on the brakes in front of me and yell "get on the sidewalk, ******."

And you are the one that has a lot of work to do if you are so removed from reality and hate cyclists so much. You are the problem, not the solution.

San Rensho 

[QUOTE=genec;7334880]Hey this looks just like the California arterials I ride all the time... same freeway like setting, same "shoulder"/bike lane, same excessive speeders...

Yup real bike friendly. So much for 10 cyclists being "conspicuous" enough...

"dem cyclists musta swerved... " [/QUOTE]

After reading the newspaper today, it looks like that is going to be the defense.

They were riding in the breakdown lane, but the breakdown lane disappears as you approach an intersection, which forced the riders to move into the right lane, where they were hit.

My prediction is the cabbie doesn't even get cited.

Unfortunately, the funneling of cyclists off of breakdown lanes or bike paths into a lane of traffic is a serious road design defect thast occurs all the time. A couple of years ago a cyclist was killed on Key Biscayne where the bike lane ended abruptly at an intersection that had an island blocking the bike lane.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/miam...ry/656397.html

hurricane harry

I see not much has changed since I left 13 years ago. Once all the cyclists are gone, then they can get back to the business of killing other motorists.

wannaride

I ride the roads here at least three days a week and cover everywhere from Homestead to Hollywood. I ride my bike to work in Downtown Miami once a week or so. How often do you ride?

Once I got run off the road once but I don't think it was deliberate. No one has ever called me a ******. I've been yelled at a couple of times but no one has ever thrown anything at me. I often take the lane but if I do I'm moving 20 plus. I use lights and visable clothing. I thank cars that are nice to me which is fairly often.

Compare that to the situation in California where a Dr. deliberately brake checked bikers, in Portland where a truck driver deliberately ran over a biker and in Boulder where there is an open and ongoing war in the canyons between the bikers and the locals.

I'll chalk your comments up to your obvious ignorance.

geo8rge

Cab company is going to **** their pants - Cab was probably leased, I suspect that will shield the owners of the medallion. Driver probably has the min insurance needed (thousands not millions).

The driver probably feel asleep(see earlier post with link), end of Sat. night shift, if I get the Sun. morning time right. Driver may have been driving extra hours due to economy too.

ochizon

That really sucks. I gotta say, though, I would never think to ride across I395 like that. Ill stick to Key Biscayne for the early morning rides.

I hope they are alright.

Kurt Erlenbach

Good followup article today. Here are the highlights:

"Michael Kaufman, an attorney for Checker Cab who is represeting Morais, said the cyclists were in the wrong.
''He shouldn't even get a traffic ticket,'' Kaufman said. ``Emergency lanes are not meant for travel. He wasn't being reckless. He didn't lose control. He was stunned, shocked, destroyed.''
Cyclists are allowed to ride in the roadway, except on expressways, as long as they follow the rules that govern motorists.
Kaufman denied Morais had fallen asleep; he had started his shift at Checker Cab at 3 a.m., nearing closing time for clubs.
''He could have been knocked out by the crash,'' Kaufman said. ``He wasn't asleep.''

...

Valori, the 911 caller, is still baffled as to why the cabbie failed to see the cyclists.
Wearing pointed helmets and Spandex gear, the group was riding east toward the beach on the causeway. To avoid an obstruction near Palm Island, they had entered the roadway on the causeway, riding two-by-two.
Valori described to the dispatcher what he saw:
''We were in the center lane a little behind the cabbie. We saw the bikers about 1,000 feet ahead of us. . . We moved over to the left lane and were going a little faster than him; he stayed in the right lane,'' said Valori, who was in the passenger seat.
''He never swerved, drifted or slowed down, he just plowed into them,'' Valori said. ``They were in the lane of traffic, but I think they have the right to do that.
''It was like he was asleep or unconscious,'' Valori said of the cabbie. ``It was the craziest thing ever.''

genec

Is this road specifically prohibited from cyclists in any manner? Is this causeway on any cycling maps as a route?

genec

Oh, well I'm surprised... he's not using the old "they swerved" defense. He's going for a different defense... the old "bikes don't belong" defense. I suppose the "that's just how I drive" defense had been taken, eh?

If the cabbie had hit a slower CAR in the same position... the driver would have gotten a ticket... no question. But since these are cyclists on bicycles... watch this whole thing fizzle away with the driver simply "suffering from terrible remorse... "

Comes down to this... no matter how legally cyclists ride, if hit by a car, the odds are against you... both physically and legally.

Same Roads, Same Rules, Same Rights. Riiiight...

Allister

Is riding on the wrong road punishable by being hit with a car? Is any citizen allowed to judge and penalise offenders on the spot? I fail to see the relevance of whether or not it was legal. Besides, if it wasn't, I'm pretty sure it would have been mentioned by now.

Allister

Yeah, must be a shock to wake up to a cyclist on your bonnet. I think I'll stick with the witness' stories. You, Mr. Kaufman, deserve to be hit with a car.

JoeyBike

I don't think that's what genec meant. From a legal standpoint, I think it would go easier on the cab driver in court (not saying he deserves it) if cyclists were forbidden or not expected to be there. If a slow moving car would have been in place of the cyclists, he may have hit that just the same if he fell asleep. So it's not just about expecting to see cyclists in this case.

If I try to control a lane on I-10 and get crushed by a taxi, that is a whole lot different than a taxi crawling up on a sidewalk and performing a "hit man" murder on me because it is illegal to bike on a sidewalk.

Even you should be able to see the distinction there.

(wow....I think that may have been my first personal attack here...leme add a smily to smooth things out)

Even you should be able to see the distinction there.

There

No one said anything about purposeful punishment of cyclists on this string.

genec

Good points.

Although apparently, according to the lawyer... yes, cycling on the "wrong road" is an offense of some sort...

As I mentioned, if the cabbie had rearended a car, a ticket would have been issued on the spot.

I am just really wondering if that route shows up on any "sanctioned" bike maps.

da07079

There is a witness account in today's follow-up story.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/top-...ry/657894.html

Allister

If it does, the justice system is a joke. If it were illegal to ride there, the only difference would be that the cyclists get a ticket. It is entirely irrelevant when it comes to someone ploughing into a group of cyclists that he really should have easily seen and avoided.

Maybe not, but that's the logical extension of questioning whether they should have been there or not. "If they weren't supposed to be there, it's not the driver's fault." is so utterly wrong-headed I'm not sure I have enough common ground with the person saying it to be able to explain why it's so utterly wrong-headed in terms they'll understand, and it's only a short logical leap away from saying "they deserved it". It's all moot anyway. Nothing I've read indicates that it's illegal to ride there.

genec

That is the direction the lawyer is going with his comments... so I am just exploring if there is any mention at all that cyclists are restricted. I am also asking whether the route is recommended in any way.

If the only thing governing that roadway are the state laws that equate cyclists to motorists... then the lawyer is WRONG and using a poor defense. (good, I hope they hand him his head... )

Here are the comments from the lawyer:
As far as the "they deserved it comment... " just read some of the opinions in the paper...

I joked about it earlier... but here are the typical driver "defenses:" "the cyclists swerved," this "they don't belong there" defense, and sadly the usual, "I didn't see the cyclists" and "that's the way I always drive... "

As I mentioned earlier, if the cabbie had hit a car, a ticket would have been issued on the spot... yet with cyclists in the mix, the "games" begin. SIGH...

HoustonB

Police identified the driver as Hebert Morais, 52, with the Checker Cab company.

''He's openly admitted to falling asleep behind the wheel of the car,'' said Detective Juan Sanchez, a police department spokesman.

One of the witnesses is highly credible and the 911 recording alone is damning; a Miami attorney said "People were 10 feet up in the air. It's the most horrible thing I've ever seen. You need to send multiple ambulances now!" the 911 caller, is still baffled as to why the cabbie failed to see the cyclists.
...
described to the dispatcher what he saw:

Allister

Indeed. I wouldn't even mind him using such a stupid 'defence' if I didn't think there was a good chance it'd be successful. That's what really gets my goat in these situations.

Yeah. That's what I was alluding to. I rarely get as appalled at the state of humanity as when I read reader's comments following a cyclist's death.

If he hadn't hit the cyclists, I like to think that he would have slept on until he hit the bend at Terminal Island, which I think would have been a fitting end to him.