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Do you believe that cyclists should ride rudely?

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Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.
View Poll Results: How should cyclists ride?
1) I think it is NOT OK for a cyclist to violate the Right-of-Way of other users of the road.
66
86.84%
2) I think it is OK for a cyclist to violate the Right-of-Way of other users of the road.
10
13.16%
Voters: 76. You may not vote on this poll

Do you believe that cyclists should ride rudely?

Old 11-18-08, 07:16 PM
  #26  
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I didn't respond to the poll because I'm not sure how you define your terms.

I don't violate anyone's right of way in the sense that I don't ride in a way that would make someone else swerve or slam on their brakes to avoid me. But if no one is there, I will run stop signs or lights with glee. Theoretically, the lanes I'm crossing have the right of way, but if there is no actual car there, I ignore that. In other words, I ride by the rules of nature, not the artificial rules of law.
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Old 11-18-08, 07:26 PM
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this thread brings up another question: why aren't motorcycles subject to noise ordinances?
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Old 11-18-08, 07:28 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
this thread brings up another question: why aren't motorcycles subject to noise ordinances?
I often wonder this myself. I can't stand those absurdly loud motorcycles.
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Old 11-18-08, 08:28 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
this thread brings up another question: why aren't motorcycles subject to noise ordinances?
Far better advocacy groups.
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Old 11-18-08, 09:08 PM
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It's because motorcyclists don't have scofflaw members giving the rest of them a bad name....

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Old 11-18-08, 09:38 PM
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Originally Posted by zeytoun
...I wanted to do a poll and see what people think.
I will do whatever it takes to get home in one piece.
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Old 11-18-08, 09:40 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by zeytoun
It's because motorcyclists don't have scofflaw members giving the rest of them a bad name....

I assume you are being sarcastic by the winkie. You should check this vid out anyway.

Bike Video 5 (Rock Version)
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Old 11-18-08, 10:21 PM
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I fail to see how breaking the law is the minimum for rude behavior. I think it's helpful to be rude when I bike, but that doesn't mean violating others right of way. It mostly means taking mine whenever I practicably can even if a typical driver would yield. It's easy to get pushed around out there.

So I wanna check both options of your poll.
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Old 11-18-08, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by apricissimus
I often wonder this myself. I can't stand those absurdly loud motorcycles.
I grew to despise motorcycles in college. I had a basement level room next to a parking lot. There's little that can wake me from a deep sleep but revving a typical motorcycle 20 feet away did it a few times.

I'd direct my anger at the school for designing the lot that way but what sort of child revs his engine in a parking lot?
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Old 11-18-08, 10:28 PM
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Originally Posted by pacificaslim
I didn't respond to the poll because I'm not sure how you define your terms.

I don't violate anyone's right of way in the sense that I don't ride in a way that would make someone else swerve or slam on their brakes to avoid me. But if no one is there, I will run stop signs or lights with glee. Theoretically, the lanes I'm crossing have the right of way, but if there is no actual car there, I ignore that. In other words, I ride by the rules of nature, not the artificial rules of law.
The rules of nature would not allow for the traffic efficiency we achieve. Every intersection would be a major decision which would involve slowing down. So I'm glad to hear that you sacrifice a bit and follow the law when there is other traffic .
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Old 11-18-08, 11:26 PM
  #36  
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it seems the overall group behavior on american roads nearly dictates rudeness from a majority of road users regardless of mode of travel. such it is. there's a lot of waves and smiles too, don't get me wrong, but wether driving a car, bike or walking, i get the general impression from other road users of disregard of all others in pursuit of ones one expediency.

I don't see why the bicyclists should be expected to act any better than the motorists.
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Old 11-19-08, 01:13 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by Bekologist
it seems the overall group behavior on american roads nearly dictates rudeness...
Naw. Using the behavior of others as an excuse for bad behavior is lame, 'fine print' clauses/qualifications notwithstanding.

It's often useful, even necessary, to be assertive. It's never appropriate to be rude (although rudeness is often in the eye of the beholder).

I won't violate someone's ROW. But I'm not going to wait all day while they decide whether they're going to exercise their ROW or not. If you snooze, I'm gone, baby. I'm also not going to give up my ROW easily. I don't doubt that some think I'm being rude. Actually, I'm quite polite. I just don't play silly games (especially the "I can wait longer than you can" game).


Originally Posted by Bekologist
I don't see why the bicyclists should be expected to act any better than the motorists.
I've learned not to expect anything from other bicyclists although I would hope that they would not base their behavior on the worst behavior they see in others. Some motorists act like jerks; many do not.


Originally Posted by zeytoun
I've noticed quite a few people accusing the Advocacy & Safety forum members of being summarily pro-bike, anti-car, to the point of always siding with bicyclists no matter how illegal or rude their behavior.

This is not my impression, so I wanted to do a poll and see what people think.
This thread seems to be based on a false premise-- that it's possible to characterize the opinion of A&S posters as if they are a homogenious group. Thinking of people as individuals is a lot more useful than categorizing them. I generally ignore comments regarding "bicyclists" or "A&S members" or "motorists," etc. because the makers of such comments surely don't have a clue.

Bicyclists are probably the most dispirate "group" I've ever been associated with. About the only trait that seems to characterize bicyclists is that a lot of them are nuts.

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Old 11-19-08, 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by genec
Yeah I see your point... does it count if the motorist flinched a bit as you dashed in front of them.
My point is that all those scenarios I presented are situations in which the cyclist has ROW and it is taken away by a heavy handed (footed) motorist... which results in cyclists "riding rudely" as a defense mechanism.

***********************************************

So back to the OP; I don't believe that cyclists start out rude, but are created that way by the environment in which they ride. I think there are fine lines between assertive, aggressive, and rude...
No, they must learn to HTFU.

As far as not giving up the right of way to a bully driver, thats not riding rudely, thats just driving assertively. If drivers think its rude, too bad.
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Old 11-19-08, 09:36 AM
  #39  
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Pedestrians, in my humble opinion, should be given much more kindness and consideration than drivers.

No, this is not anti-car, just pro-pedestrian.
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Old 11-19-08, 09:46 AM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
this thread brings up another question: why aren't motorcycles subject to noise ordinances?
Yeah, well, that question brings to mind something a motorcyclist said to me. I was showing him my Electric Bike, and he was dumbfounded, flabbergasted, or whatever, and he said to me "But the only reason I ride is to make noise."
The concept of silent electric propulsion was lost on him.
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Old 11-19-08, 09:49 AM
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I've gotten much more courteous as I've grown older.
I often yield the right of way to motor vehicles.

This hasn't resulted in any arguments, but if it does, I'm going to say "I gave you the right of way, right? How could give you the the R.O.W. if I didn't have it in the first place?"

Circle logic at it's best.
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Old 11-19-08, 09:58 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by hotbike
Yeah, well, that question brings to mind something a motorcyclist said to me. I was showing him my Electric Bike, and he was dumbfounded, flabbergasted, or whatever, and he said to me "But the only reason I ride is to make noise."
The concept of silent electric propulsion was lost on him.
I saw a nature show once about gorillas in the wild. They would shake every tree they passed and make lots of noise and commotion to make themselves seem bigger and more threatening to possible competitors. That's sort of how I feel about people who ride loud motorcycles.
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Old 11-19-08, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by uke
Far better advocacy groups.
Bwahaha. Yeah right. Most motorcyclists can't even pronounce the word advocacy.
Sorry they bother you, but I I've learned to appreciate those annoying loud bikes. Thanks to them, all of my bikes have been equipped with free stealth technology. It's true! I regularly fly past speed-traps at 15 over the posted speed limit and the officers sometimes even wave at me.
They've been utterly conditioned to equate speed with noise and I therefore don't appear to be speeding to them.
I used to get annoyed at those loud bikes "ruining public perceptions of my pasttime", but now I thank those buffoons for eating all my tickets. If we were all gazelles running around on the Serengeti Plains, this would be the equivalent of the majority of the herd wearing belled collars to announce to the lion that dinner is on the way.
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Old 11-19-08, 11:14 AM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by apricissimus
I saw a nature show once about gorillas in the wild. They would shake every tree they passed and make lots of noise and commotion to make themselves seem bigger and more threatening to possible competitors. That's sort of how I feel about people who ride loud motorcycles.


As a cyclist and motorcyclist I have to agree with this sentiment. I am sympathetic with the argument that 'loud pipes save lives'....but most loud pipes I hear are at intesections as moto guys gun their bikes to impress themselves. Alot of moto guys have contempt for cyclists also, because we wear helmets, driving a stake thru their 'helmet laws zuck' campaigns.

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Old 11-19-08, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by apricissimus
I saw a nature show once about gorillas in the wild. They would shake every tree they passed and make lots of noise and commotion to make themselves seem bigger and more threatening to possible competitors. That's sort of how I feel about people who ride loud motorcycles.
Its also that Hardley Ableson riders never outgrew a juvenile fascination with flatulence. Remember in Junior High how all you did was fart, make fart noises and tell fart jokes, well Harley riders are still never matured past that level.

As they ride by with their loud, backfiring bikes they are saying "hear and smell my fart."
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