cryptid01

There is no excuse for the pet owner who doesn't obey the law and act responsibly.
I agree with you completely on that matter.

What concerns me is the people who blame the animal and propose to willfully (and perhaps unneccessarily) hurt it, essentially holding the animal responsible for the negligence of the owner. For whatever reason, whether fear, ignorance, or bad childhood experiences, some people just hate dogs, and I officially give up on trying to understand that.

I have no reservations about taking necessary means to protect myself (or my pets)from any animal, be it wild, domestic, or human.

Yes, my facetious scenario was out of line...sorry about that. I let emotions get the better of me.

~Brent
(responsible pet owner with a rescue mutt residing happily in my fenced in yard)

s2sxiii

I don't think its out of line at all, what with everyone requesting bowie knives and such...

and Diggy -- all cause some dog bit you when you were 15? You're what, 17 now? Who uses a bowie knife, i mean really. Go get 'em crocidile dundee...

Spunko -- I want to quote you, but there's just too much juicy stuff there, and i'd have to read it another 3 or so times to understand whatever it is you're saying. Sorry someone got killed by a dog that ran out (though it really could have been any animal whatsoever) Sorry that people sometimes get mauled by dogs, and sometimes killed (the high profile cases you referred to). But what do specific examples that represent .00000000000000001% of all canine-human encounters lend to the discussion? I'm not saying dogs should be valued more than human life, but i don't think its too much to ask that you show them a little respect, recognize that they're animals and sometimes react instinctually, and don't take a proactive stance on hunting them out and abusing them, as has been suggested by some posters on this forum. It's just like dealing with a bully -- you should take every step you can to avoid a problem, and resort to violence only when the dog has you cornered...

And yes you can outrun a dog. I challenge any dog out there listening to race me on my fixie. I know I can take them, and I've only got one gear. Get off your cushy, gel-laden, spring loaded seat, and pedal, if you're really that scared. As for dangerously diverting your attention, i can't even respond. Everyone in Advocacy and safety seems to think that if your eyes aren't always straight ahead, you're gonna die. I commute across the OSU campus, and that's a lot of girls to stare at as they pass on the sidewalks, in high traffic, and i haven't had an accident yet. I don't think a dog is distracting enough to send you careening into parked cars or a 4 lane highway or something. If that's the case, I'd stick to a trainer if i were you.

bac

I challenge you not crash when I jump directly in front of your wheel as you descend the hill that runs beside my house @ 45mph. I challenge you to even walk away from such an incident. I will take you down, and if you're lucky, you'll wake up in the ER later that evening. Moreover, my owner, and dear pal, will not be charged for letting me run free.


... Fido

Diggy18

"just like dealing with a bully"

I make stews out of bullies, too.

s2sxiii

lmao .. can we compromise on like 32-36 mph?? I spin out about there... And maybe i'm a big softie, but the first thing I'd do would be to ask how the dog was, wherever i woke up. Mayhaps its just my experience, but dogs don't routinely, purposefully, run under the wheels of moving things. Yeah, they get hit by cars, but usually they just run alongside my bike till i yell.

Seriously -- what could anyone possibly do to stop that? It has nothing to do with outrunning the dog if they jump out in front of you -- and then we're back to the "it could be any animal" debate. I'm all for owners being held responsible, just like i'm all for avoiding these accidents -- What I'm not for, is people abusing dogs when a simple yell would have scared the dog off. Or mace, or something short of a bowie knife or gang beating.

s2sxiii

I'll bully you, and you can eat me.

Abuse of animals at a young age is a tell-tale sign of later, extreme, anti-social behavior my friend.

Paul L.

Rabbits and Deer usually run away from me when they see me. Dogs on the other hand do not unless I scare them and intimidate them (which is usually effective but sometimes is not). Mountain lions that chase people (and then usually try to eat them if they bother to chase) are hunted down and eliminated when they frequent areas near people (and I realize lions that hunt people are extremely rare and yes dogs don't eat people but can be just as dangerous when chasing or in packs, I mean after you are dead or maimed does it matter if the animal intended to eat hunt or play?). I think Dogs are closer to this category than deer and rabbits as one is a herbivore and dogs last I checked are carnivorous (hunters). I don't advocate undo violence towards dogs, but the owner should not be upset if due to their negligence their fido gets seriously hurt because someone felt they were in danger and dealt with the situation best they could. Besides, how am I to know your dog is domestic or a stray(responsible dog owners tag their dogs but with a loose dog we are not usually talking about a responsible dog owner now are we?)?

Loose dogs are just as dangerouse as people who don't give 3ft passing room in my book (except they don't flip you off when you yell at them).

cryptid01

See if you can follow my logic:

If dogs are to be held at fault, then they must first bear some burden of responsibility.

If that burden of responsibility is a foregone conclusion, then it follows that they are also entitled to certain rights, just like humans.

If dogs' rights = human rights, then I guess you're advocating euthanization of homeless people after two weeks in the shelter.

Ebbtide

Lets suppose a two year old (human) wanders ten feet from the picnic table and on to the bike path. As a result of a near collision a rider hits his head on a branch and dies. Should the parents be sued or should we lock up the kid for murder (maybe just kick his teeth in)? According to Merton's and Spunko's logic, both.

Sometimes accidents happen, thats why we call them accidents.

ehenz

jfmckenna

Now lets suppose that the deceased was your girlfriend or wife. Bring it home a little and think about it. Sure you hear a story that some one died you don't know that person so it's not as big an issue. No the infant is obviously not to blame but the pathetially irresponsible parents are.

According to mertons logic yes I agree with you but I think spunco is spot on. The LAW clearly states and for obviously good reasons that dogs are to be leached. I cannot stand dog owners who think there dog is, " the greatest dog in the whole world, comes when he’s called, sits, stays, he doesn’t need a leash hell never hurt anyone" well guess what I got bit by one of those very same god damn dogs.

And yes I have almost been thrown off my road bike as I bunny hopped a little sh1t dog that ran out as I was the last in a pace line and the stupid animal misjudged his attack.

Furthermore are dogs to blame? Of course not they have brains the size of a golf ball there freaking simple animals. The owner should be held 100% liable for any ANY kind of trouble their dog causes.

spunko

Now if the biker hit and killed the child would they or would they not face charges? I would suspect it would be dependent on the circumstances. Say that it was a foot path closed to cyclists, then the cyclist both broke the law , and without doubt would be charged with manslaugther, justly so. It was no "accident" that she was riding on a closed path.
Again you misunderstood what I said, I never advocated undue phyiscal force, mace yes, necessary physical restraint until police arrived yes. Big difference.

I am not talking about an "accidental" release of a dog. Nor was I talking about a human being. I had one of them step in front of me last week and I crashed. He stepped off the curb into my path, I got hurt avoiding hitting them, he did not. Did I sue no. I told the stupid jerk that if I had been a car he would be dead, he was jaywalking and I guess he thought I could or would stop. He did aplogize, and I was just scraped up a bit. I was very upset, and I had my say of a few choice words, could have maced him and ridden away (joke) Yes accidents do happen.

Suppose I had a pet tiger and I let her romp through the park and it killed someone, would you hold me responsible?
What is the difference if I let a dog run free.
Point one there are leash laws. Yes you are right the dog did not break the law the owner did.
Point two if I bear spray a dog it is highly unlikely it will chase another biker, remember pavlov's dog (learned behavior.) I will wait for the owner and the police to arrive, and if injured in the event would press charges and sue.
Point three again it is not a right to own a dog, it is a privilege that is abused by many.
Point four riding a bike is not a right, it is a privilge granted to me by the state. I do not have the right to ride on certain roads, or trails, I do not abuse the privilege of riding, any more the that of driving a motor vehicle.
Final point a human being is worth more than a dog, you do not seem to think this. If you truly think a dog is worth a human life, well your are without doubt hopeless.

mrdoright0405

Agreed "Any dog can be aggressive, even a Husky". I get chased everyday by a darn Husky and a little ScrewTail Bulldog. Buy yourself the pepperspray for bears. The dogs will never chase you again. If they do. Then they really are rabid or crazy.

Oxymoron

I know whenever I'm riding in the park and a small child runs out in front of me I nail them with my mace - they never do that again! Go run home to mommy you baby. "My eyes burn!" Oh, wah wah!

Ebbtide

Thanks for the lengthy reply, but I agree with you...except the privilege/rights stuff, but thats OT.

phoolish

In February I was out on a road ride in the Georgia countryside when a couple of dogs came barking out of the woods at my girlfriend and me. One hit my wheel while we were doing a little better than 25 mph, and both of us went down hard. I had serious road rash covering my shoulder, my right calf, both my knees, and my lower back. I cracked my helmet. I broke a spoke, wrenched my bars out of alignment, and shredded my hands.

I'm considering finding a way to mount a samurai sword in my top tube. Then, when a dog jumps for me, there'll be a quick bright flash of silver and crimson, a falling cherry blossom. The dog will stand still, looking confused, then, all at once, slide in half. I'll resheath my blade in the top tube and ride into the west.

Or, more likely, I'll just have forgotten my pepper spray again and get jumped.