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Rolling drivers at intersections & driveways - what are they thinking?

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Rolling drivers at intersections & driveways - what are they thinking?

Old 10-16-09, 07:30 AM
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lineinthewater
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Rolling drivers at intersections & driveways - what are they thinking?

What is the deal with drivers who keep on rolling after coming to a "stop" at traffic lights, stop signs, intersecting roads, etc? It is annoying (if not irritating) as a driver trying to anticipate their next move. As a biker, it is downright maddening - as the potential consequences are likely even worse.

The other day, this lady is rolling out of a parking lot into the road, and into my bike lane. This is not a case of not seeing me. I was running a strobe light on the front of my bike on a cloudless day - and she was looking right at me. Even after she saw me coming (at about 18mph), she was still trying to edge herself out into traffic, which was moving AT the speed limit. I had to swerve around her front end. I see this crap all the time. What the heck are they thinking? Those extra inches are going to get them faster to their "life critical" destination?

I searched for a thread on this topic - nothing devoted to it that I could find.
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Old 10-16-09, 07:43 AM
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Yes, it is no doubt annoying. As a driver, I can relate though to the temptation to stick the car out a bit further in order to see further down the road. Of course, blocking the BL is wrong.

When the OP first saw the car inching out, did the OP have an opportunity to slow to avoid a crash? Slowing or even stopping is IMHO better than swerving if it were an option in terms of crash avoidance.
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Old 10-16-09, 07:43 AM
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Most drivers are stupid, careless and arrogant.. They demonstrate it every time they get behind the wheel.
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Old 10-16-09, 07:49 AM
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Drivers rolling past stop lines is extremely frustrating to pedestrians, whom some drivers expect to wait for them, and makes it especially dangerous to operate a bike as a "rolling pedestrian."

When I approach a junction of any kind with traffic present ahead on the right, I merge left into the center of the travel lane. This makes me more visible and puts me in the area of the road that the intersecting driver knows not to encroach upon for fear of colliding with through motor traffic.
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Old 10-16-09, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Ngchen View Post
When the OP first saw the car inching out, did the OP have an opportunity to slow to avoid a crash? Slowing or even stopping is IMHO better than swerving if it were an option in terms of crash avoidance.
I didn't know how far she was going to roll until I got pretty close - I could have *possibly* slammed on my brakes if absolutely required - but I knew (from my trusty mirror) that there was no one coming from behind in the 1st lane (two lane road each way) so I felt safe swerving.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:02 AM
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Oooooh you hit a pet peeve of mine you did. I like to just keep coming at those types, forcing them to stop. They know exactly what they are doing, relying on weight and ppl's fear of a possible crash to impose themselves on everyone else on the road. Bullies one and all, be they macho types or the "helpless" gee-I'm-so-sorry types who rely on the good will of others to allow them to drive like this over and over again. I've even embarrassed a few publicly to back up where they belong, and to try again like the rest of us.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:04 AM
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Had a lady do this to me last night at the grocery store... I'm WALKING my bike down the sidewalk with my cateye headlight and my taillight on (so I'm still lit up!) and she pulls our right in front of me... Fired up the new MagicShine headlight on high right in her eyes. She tries to shield her eyes from the light (THAT THING IS BRIGHT! Especially up close and right in your eyes... I was less than 5 feet away) and I just tilted the bike again so it was in her eyes. She got the hint and backed off the sidewalk.

Mean, I know, but it got the point across. Usually I just kick them if they do that so close to me.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by TRaffic Jammer View Post
I've even embarrassed a few publicly to back up where they belong, and to try again like the rest of us.
As I passed the front of the car, I put out my "what's the deal?" hand (as I do every time this happens). Basically giving the look (to the driver) "what the he-- are you doing coming out like that?". When she finally pulled out, and passed me, she actually yelled out the window at me ... can you believe this? I have no idea what she said.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by xerocoma View Post
Most cyclists are stupid, careless and arrogant.. They demonstrate it every time they post on BF.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:14 AM
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Oh it's always the same blah blah blah, how dare you speak to a motorists that way , you ride a bike what do you know about driving yada yada.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:28 AM
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Originally Posted by lineinthewater View Post
What is the deal with drivers who keep on rolling after coming to a "stop" at traffic lights, stop signs, intersecting roads, etc? It is annoying (if not irritating) as a driver trying to anticipate their next move. .......

Exactly how is this different from cyclists who feel they can come to rolling stops at red lights, stop signs, and filter thru traffic that is stopped at an intersection? There is no middle ground here...either we agree to come to a complete stop at such places, or we do not.


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Old 10-16-09, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Roughstuff View Post
Exactly how is this different from cyclists who feel they can come to rolling stops at red lights, stop signs, and filter thru traffic that is stopped at an intersection? There is no middle ground here...either we agree to come to a complete stop at such places, or we do not.


roughstuff
I'm sorry. Did I say something about supporting reckless bikers in my original post? Let's see ... nope. Not there. You must be posting in the wrong thread.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:42 AM
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Oh just about a minimum of a ton of kinetic energy with which to kill, a wide difference between the two. You can bet if a ped or cyclist could alter the laws of physics and destroy the front of a car upon impact they'd not be driving like that. The potential for causing harm is a very important factor. I fail to see how me rolling through an intersection, not involving anyone else, is even remotely connected to , using size and weight as an instrument to impose your will by forcing others to alter their paths to accommodate the vehicular bulling.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by TRaffic Jammer View Post
Oh just about a minimum of a ton of kinetic energy with which to kill, a wide difference between the two. You can bet if a ped or cyclist could alter the laws of physics and destroy the front of a car upon impact they'd not be driving like that. The potential for causing harm is a very important factor.
You are getting baited into this discussion; a decoy to act as a counter-argument to the original discussion. Your argument is obvious (and valid), but expect to get slammed for supporting reckless biker behavior. Good deflection tactic.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by TRaffic Jammer View Post
Oh just about a minimum of a ton of kinetic energy with which to kill, a wide difference between the two. You can bet if a ped or cyclist could alter the laws of physics and destroy the front of a car upon impact they'd not be driving like that. The potential for causing harm is a very important factor.
But the bike can also cause harm. A driver screeches to a halt to avoid hitting you...the guy behind him slams into the back of him, the guy a couple of cars back tries to swerve to avoid the mess and hits some ped or some kid's pet....the ped/kid's dad shoots the driver for hitting his kid/pet, then goes to prison for 20 years, leaving his family in financial trouble, so they go on welfare and live on MY tax dollars!

The law of unintended consequences doesn't care if you are in a car, on a bike, or fishing for pike, TJ.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Roughstuff View Post
Exactly how is this different from cyclists who feel they can come to rolling stops at red lights, stop signs, and filter thru traffic that is stopped at an intersection?
+1, saved me the trouble of typing it.

When people complain about cyclists rolling stop signs, I respond that not all of us do, I don't, but perhaps they should pull up a lawn chair at a stop sign with a notepad sometime and track how many cars actually stop there if there's no cross traffic? I bet it's not 1 in 100. I actually do stop at stop signs, and I frequently see the car behind me obviously having to slam on his brakes because he doesn't expect me to actually stop.

Now, I always stop when in my car, but I do roll stop signs on my bike, though when I say 'roll' I mean that my wheel is technically turning but I'm as close to a trackstand as I can come without actually being able to do one. No momentum at all, and I'm ready to clip out.
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Old 10-16-09, 08:57 AM
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The problem is that most of the stop signs shouldn't be there. Most of the rest of the world doesn't even have 4-way stops. They were just easy for local authorities to put up - usually in violation of traffic control guidelines. The cops know the stop signs shouldn't be there and are reluctant to cite people. I have seen police reports that state "....There were several stops of the continuous rolling stop variety...."

The answer is to get rid of all four way stops and other unnecessary stop signs.
Because of the inconvenience to cyclists they are in any case considerably discriminatory to the two wheeled public..

It's time to replace all the 4-way stops with mini-roundabouts and change unnecessary stop signs to yield signs. Stop signs erected to slow traffic should be changed to priority uphill chicanes with cycle pass-throughs.
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Old 10-16-09, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by chipcom View Post
But the bike can also cause harm. A driver screeches to a halt to avoid hitting you...the guy behind him slams into the back of him, the guy a couple of cars back tries to swerve to avoid the mess and hits some ped or some kid's pet....the ped/kid's dad shoots the driver for hitting his kid/pet, then goes to prison for 20 years, leaving his family in financial trouble, so they go on welfare and live on MY tax dollars!

The law of unintended consequences doesn't care if you are in a car, on a bike, or fishing for pike, TJ.
Except I've already made sure I can cross safely without anyone needing to slam on their brakes, which renders your argument moot. Give me SOME credit Chip, I'm not going to toss myself into harms' way, been at it waaay too long for that action. I can't remember the last time I heard screeching tires because of my riding. Otherwise I totally agree with you ,in your worst case scenario, cyclists tossing themselves in front of motor travel with no regard for others can indeed cause much damage. However a smart, well thought out strategy for riding in the core, can facilitate getting everyone moving along nicely. ...and there's the magic phrase isn't it.... "regard for others".. that's how Europe drives/rides ... it can look insanely congested and lawlessly busy but most folks do travel with a mindset of how their actions potentially affect others rather than our selfish modus operandi here in North America. Sorry but toe-the-line/letter-of-law arguments have completely fallen flat.
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Old 10-16-09, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by TRaffic Jammer View Post
Except I've already made sure I can cross safely without anyone needing to slam on their brakes, which renders your argument moot. Give me SOME credit Chip, I'm not going to toss myself into harms' way, been at it waaay too long for that action. I can't remember the last time I heard screeching tires because of my riding. Otherwise I totally agree with you ,in your worst case scenario, cyclists tossing themselves in front of motor travel with no regard for others can indeed cause much damage. However a smart, well thought out strategy for riding in the core, can facilitate getting everyone moving along nicely. ...and there's the magic phrase isn't it.... "regard for others".. that's how Europe drives/rides ... it can look insanely congested and lawlessly busy but most folks do travel with a mindset of how their actions potentially affect others rather than our selfish modus operandi here in North America. Sorry but toe-the-line/letter-of-law arguments have completely fallen flat.
I take it that you missed the smiley, TJ. Go for a ride old pal, you seem to be kinda stressed today.
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Old 10-16-09, 09:29 AM
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Sorry for the chip Chippy, my irony filter is broken.... sleepy today.
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Old 10-16-09, 09:52 AM
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The driver sees you, but then forgets you are there while looking beyond your current posiion towards cars further away approaching at higher speed. There's propbably some word for this in a shrinks manual but that's my explanation.
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Old 10-16-09, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by TRaffic Jammer View Post
..... Sorry but toe-the-line/letter-of-law arguments have completely fallen flat.

Haven't fallen complete flat at all. I can live with tow the line, or flexibility. But what is good for the goose is good for the gander.....so if bicycles can use rolling stops, snake thru stopped traffic, stay in a group at a red light to protect their vaunted pace-lines, ad nauseum, then cars, trucks and motorcycles can do the same. So the answer to :

What is the deal with drivers who keep on rolling after coming to a "stop" at traffic lights, stop signs, intersecting roads, etc? It is annoying (if not irritating)...



is:

look in the mirror. I would be tempted to say, in your helmet mounted rear view mirror...but eek!


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Old 10-16-09, 10:00 AM
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Like TRJ, I like to slow down just enuf to force them to come to a complete halt, then look right in their eye as I go by.
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Old 10-16-09, 10:01 AM
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^^if it were just me I'd say ok^^
I see them doing this to other cars, to peds, it's like watching a little kid push their way through a crowd.
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Old 10-16-09, 10:18 AM
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Geese and Ganders are the same beast, motorists and cyclists are not, just like motorists and peds are not. Once a jurisdiction comes to that rather obvious realization then some good things can happen in regards to moving folks around more safely.
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