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Does anyone carry a gun?

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Does anyone carry a gun?

Old 08-18-04, 11:45 AM
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If you can legally carry concealed, and wish to do so on your bike:

1. Get a gun suited to your needs (as a rule, the most powerful gun you can safely/accurately operate and can handle carrying would work). Also, spend the bucks to get a quality holster or fanny pack. A fanny pack works for me. Get good training in shooting/legal aspects of self-defense.

2. Know under what circumstances it's legal to use deadly force. Almost universally this means that you/others are under IMMINENT THREAT OF DEATH OR GREAT BODILY HARM...but you might want to check your specific state statutes, as some jurisdictions may have more to it than that.

Packing carries with it a lot of responsibility. Be safe, always! Always remember...a gun is simply a tool...and it's almost always better to have a tool you don't need than to need a tool you don't have.
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Old 08-18-04, 12:24 PM
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One of the main things of having a gun is being able to exercise self-control. A gun is not simply a tool. Carrying a gun takes more than just one little defense course. Cops and, Army ect. are always undergoing training with their weapon. If you want to carry a tool on your bike carry tire levers and a pump, you might actully need those.
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Old 08-18-04, 01:13 PM
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I always carry when it is legal to do so, as does my wife. We have for years and have never come close to needing to even brandish a firearm and I sincerely hope we never do.

I now tow my little girls in a trailer and in this part of the country dogs are common. There was a jogger killed by a couple of Rotweillers not far from here a few years ago. If a dog were to attack when I have the kids in the trailer I don't want to have to count on my foot or bike pump to repel them.

I carry a S&W Airweight in 38+P with a shrouded hammer. Handlebar bag carries it well.
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Old 08-18-04, 01:19 PM
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Darn, Ryan and I are never going to agree on anything.


One of the main things of having a gun is being able to exercise self-control
Ah thats just projection, only someone w/o self control would say that.

But yes, one needs self control to own and carry a firearm. That being said, licenced CCW holders do not shoot people in anger. In the last ten years or so most every State has added a CCW provision w/o increases in gun related crimes.

CCW is a personal choice, just like a helmet. Chances are you will never need it, but if you do, you'll be glad you had it.

And yes, a gun is universally recognized as a tool.

Last edited by ehenz; 08-18-04 at 01:55 PM.
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Old 08-18-04, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Ryan
You can't carry concealed without a license in any state.
Except Vermont and States that offer the an affirmative defense provision.
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Old 08-18-04, 01:54 PM
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We already cleared that up awhile ago, read the whole topic..
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Old 08-18-04, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Ryan
Alaska and Vermont, Vermont surprises me. There's no one to conceal your weapon from in Alaska so guess it doesn't matter..

STATE LAWS ON CARRYING CONCEALED HANDGUNS: CCW LAWS

5 states prohibit the carrying of concealed handguns. 11 states provide law enforcement with discretion to issue or deny CCW permits based. 34 states force police to allow people to carry concealed handguns. Since many larger states have strict limits on CCW permits, nearly half of all Americans live in states that do not force police to let people carry hidden handguns.

States that PROHIBIT the Carrying of Concealed Weapons - There is no CCW permit process.

5 states prohibit the carrying of concealed handguns in public. They do not issue CCW permits. These states are: Illinois, Kansas, Nebraska, Ohio, and Wisconsin.

States with LIMITED CCW Laws - Police have authority to reject or approve applicants based on public safety.

11 states have limited CCW laws. These limited laws are called "discretionary" or "may issue" CCW laws. Law enforcement is not required to issue CCW permits but have discretion to approve or deny CCW permits based on whether letting the applicant carry a concealed handgun is in the interest of public safety. In most cases, the applicant must demonstrate a specific need (i.e., applicant works as a security guard) and pass extensive safety training. The CCW permit may be limited to specific firearms and carrying at specific times or in specific places. Most states with "discretionary" CCW permits do not issue many permits, particularly not in larger urban areas. These states are: Alabama, California, Connecticut, Delaware, Hawaii, Iowa, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, and Rhode Island. (NOTE: The NRA sometimes classifies Alabama and Connecticut as "right to carry" states, because NRA claims that police in Alabama and Connecticut "do not abuse" their discretion, but the important fact is that police in Alabama and Connecticut do have discretion to issue or deny CCW permits, unlike the mandatory "shall issue" laws that NRA proposes.)

States with MANDATORY CCW Laws - Police are forced to issue CCW permits to almost any non-felon applicant.

34 states force police to allow people to carry concealed handguns in public.

In 32 of the 34 mandatory states, police are forced to allow practically all non-felons to carry concealed handguns in public. These lenient laws, called "non-discretionary" or "shall issue" CCW laws, force law enforcement to issue concealed handgun permits to virtually anyone who does not have a felony conviction. The applicant does not have to show any need for carrying a hidden handgun and law enforcement has no discretion to deny permits even if they think public safety may be endangered, absent a prohibiting offense. Some of these states do not even require safety training and force police to issue permits to people as young as 18. The states are: Arizona, Arkansas, Colorado, Florida, Georgia, Idaho, Indiana, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Carolina, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Virginia, Washington, West Virginia, and Wyoming.

In 2 of the 34 mandatory states, no permit is even needed to carry a concealed handgun in public. Anyone who can legally possess a gun can carry it concealed in public. These states are: Alaska and Vermont.
You only read what you want to read obviously don't know how you can miss this one.
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Old 08-18-04, 09:00 PM
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I am very causious of where I bike, a few months ago someone from the area got shot while biking, unfortuanlity he was already dead by the time the ambulance had arrived. Guns are not the answer for a small mistake. I have to agree with an eariler post, this is the dumest thread I have seen, for those Americans, yes we do have our 2nd amendment rights, but when someone cuts me off or nearly kills me I just fly the middle finger and they get the picture.
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Old 08-19-04, 03:44 AM
  #84  
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Originally Posted by Dchiefransom
"To safely keep a handgun in a home with children, the gun needs to be stored unloaded and locked away. If someone enters my home, it is unlikely I will have time to find the key which is also hidden away from my kids, unlock the container, find the ammunition, load the gun and then prepare for the intruder to enter my line of sight such that I can identify them as a stranger that is intending to do harm. I think the situations where all this can occur are so unlikely, that no protection can be offered by a handgun in my home."

You have too many preconceived negative conditions placed on using a firearm to defend yourself. If you're that worried about your children getting their hands on a loaded firearm, are you actually going to let them drive a car when they're older? Don't let the fear mongers on either side get to you.
I don't have children, but if I did, I'd be worried about them getting their hands on a loaded firearm! If they don't make it past < insert number here > years old, how are they going to live to be old enough to drive a car? Once they were old enough, some training in how to safely use a firearm would be ok, but I don't see how leaving a loaded firearm around children is anything but a bad idea.

I don't own a firearm. Someday I'll get motivated and get a crossbow or paintgun for the dumb motorists.
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Old 08-19-04, 08:25 AM
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Carrying a gun while riding your bike is dumb and will only get you in trouble with the law one day. You may even get killed faster by someone else with your own gun. Riding with a gun is just asking for trouble. Only those who live in FEAR will carry a gun with them while bike riding.

I ride my bike at night all the time with no FEAR and no gun, and I live in Brooklyn, NY.

People who bike ride with guns are no different than a gang member or thug. The only difference is you're a legal thug who waits for trouble to happen just so you could shoot people. This guns carrying mess is too extreme, dumb, and only adds more wood to the fire.

The only thing I'll be shooting while riding my bike is film. My camera setup is the best weapon to use for shooting people, cause it won't kill them.


Peace.

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Old 08-19-04, 09:08 AM
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I carry a handgun whenever it is legal to do so including on the bike. Have never had to use it and hope I never do.

A properly configured handlebar bag works very well for this. Something like an Uncle Mike's paddle holster can be mounted inside the bag to hold the handgun securely and keep it in proper position. I really like the S&W Airweight snubnose revolers. Mine is a .38+P with a shrouded hammer, great little gun.

I am properly trained and responsible so there is no danger to my children from my firearms. My parents also owned firearms and I survived. Many people today don't seem to be comfortable with responsibilities. If you're not responsible please don't do anything that requires you to be, such as owning a firearm, having kids, or voting.
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Old 08-19-04, 10:11 AM
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So, legally carrying a gun makes one no better than a thug or gangbanger? So, legally carrying a gun means you live in fear and are simply waiting to shoot somebody? So, the answer to somebody cutting you off is either flipping them off or shooting them? I realize arguing about guns is no different than debating religion or abortion...it's just beating a dead horse. But, allow me to flog that beast.

I happen to be a cop, so I can legally carry concealed almost anywhere. I often do. I don't live in fear, but I also realize that there are a lot of evil people out there and the cops are not always going to be there when you need them. I happen to live and work in a state where just about anybody with a pulse can get a CCW permit...the streets are not running with blood. Legal, responsible gun owners are not your enemy. Guns are not the problem, bad people are. If you ride your bike with a gun and shoot somebody without legal justification, you're a criminal and should be put away or be executed. Perhaps just ignoring somebody who cuts you off might be better than having a stupid situation escalate into tragedy?

It's a relatively free society we live in. If guns scare you and make you fearful, so be it. Hopefully you'll never need one. If you do, I hope you won't poop your pants wishing you'd had one. If guns work for you, God bless you...be responsible and safe, always. Chances are you'll never have to deal with a situation so messed up (no, I don't mean a mean dog, getting cut off by jerks, or even being robbed) that you'd need a gun to save your life. But, if you ever become prey to a monster...as the savage prepares to ****, kill and dump your lifeless meaty corpse...you might just wish you'd had that "tool". But, then again, horrible things only happen to other people...nothing like that ever happens in my community...the chances are so remote, I'd likely just hurt myself carrying a gun...you never know...
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Old 08-19-04, 10:23 AM
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I propose let's let the Police Officer have the Last Word on this thread, OK ?
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Old 08-19-04, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by davefarb
So, legally carrying a gun makes one no better than a thug or gangbanger? So, legally carrying a gun means you live in fear and are simply waiting to shoot somebody? So, the answer to somebody cutting you off is either flipping them off or shooting them? I realize arguing about guns is no different than debating religion or abortion...it's just beating a dead horse. But, allow me to flog that beast.

I happen to be a cop, so I can legally carry concealed almost anywhere. I often do. I don't live in fear, but I also realize that there are a lot of evil people out there and the cops are not always going to be there when you need them. I happen to live and work in a state where just about anybody with a pulse can get a CCW permit...the streets are not running with blood. Legal, responsible gun owners are not your enemy. Guns are not the problem, bad people are. If you ride your bike with a gun and shoot somebody without legal justification, you're a criminal and should be put away or be executed. Perhaps just ignoring somebody who cuts you off might be better than having a stupid situation escalate into tragedy?

It's a relatively free society we live in. If guns scare you and make you fearful, so be it. Hopefully you'll never need one. If you do, I hope you won't poop your pants wishing you'd had one. If guns work for you, God bless you...be responsible and safe, always. Chances are you'll never have to deal with a situation so messed up (no, I don't mean a mean dog, getting cut off by jerks, or even being robbed) that you'd need a gun to save your life. But, if you ever become prey to a monster...as the savage prepares to ****, kill and dump your lifeless meaty corpse...you might just wish you'd had that "tool". But, then again, horrible things only happen to other people...nothing like that ever happens in my community...the chances are so remote, I'd likely just hurt myself carrying a gun...you never know...
You have to remember Ringo lives in New York City where handgun ownership is all but illegal (unless you are a celebrity). With no guns on the streets there are no gun crimes, thus little reason to carry one in such a friendly town.
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Old 08-19-04, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by kf5nd
I propose let's let the Police Officer have the Last Word on this thread, OK ?
I did not see that before I posted....oh well?
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Old 08-19-04, 11:07 AM
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Ok...I hope all of Ringo's rides are safe ones! But, if nobody minds too much...I'll continue being a legally thuggish gangster . Sorry about beating the dead horse, but sometimes you just gotta give it a few extra whacks!
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Old 08-19-04, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by davefarb
If you can legally carry concealed, and wish to do so on your bike:

1. Get a gun suited to your needs (as a rule, the most powerful gun you can safely/accurately operate and can handle carrying would work). Also, spend the bucks to get a quality holster or fanny pack. A fanny pack works for me. Get good training in shooting/legal aspects of self-defense.

2. Know under what circumstances it's legal to use deadly force. Almost universally this means that you/others are under IMMINENT THREAT OF DEATH OR GREAT BODILY HARM...but you might want to check your specific state statutes, as some jurisdictions may have more to it than that.

Packing carries with it a lot of responsibility. Be safe, always! Always remember...a gun is simply a tool...and it's almost always better to have a tool you don't need than to need a tool you don't have.
Exactly! Bravo!
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Old 08-19-04, 12:31 PM
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My firearms and I have killed fewer people than Ted Kennedy has with his vehicles.

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Old 08-19-04, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by bunabayashi
My firearms and I have killed fewer people than Ted Kennedy has with his vehicles.

Dave
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Old 08-19-04, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Dchiefransom
You have too many preconceived negative conditions placed on using a firearm to defend yourself. If you're that worried about your children getting their hands on a loaded firearm, are you actually going to let them drive a car when they're older? Don't let the fear mongers on either side get to you. You can buy gunsafes that use a combination to open that would give you access to a loaded handgun in less than 5 seconds. It might be better to just get some good security screen doors and keep the deadbolts locked. They are pretty hard to get through.
My notions are not pre-conceived. When I was a kid, my older brother (12 at the time) broke into the locked gun-safe where my dad kept his 357 and another locked cabinet where he kept the ammunition. I was upstairs. My brother then loaded and fired the weapon towards the floor. The bullet ricocheted off the floor and through the ceiling, and then through to the attic before getting lodged on the underside of the roof of the house. The distance between where the bullet came through the floor and where I was sitting at the time was about 2 ft. So even with the gun stored UNLOADED with ammuntion locked in a different location there was still a huge danger to myself and my brother due to the handgun being in the home. After that my father kept the gun, but got rid of all the ammunition, and I learned that no matter how safe you are trying to be with firearms, some danger always remains. I choose not to expose my family to that danger.
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Old 08-19-04, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by DogBoy
My notions are not pre-conceived. When I was a kid, my older brother (12 at the time) broke into the locked gun-safe where my dad kept his 357 and another locked cabinet where he kept the ammunition. I was upstairs. My brother then loaded and fired the weapon towards the floor. The bullet ricocheted off the floor and through the ceiling, and then through to the attic before getting lodged on the underside of the roof of the house. The distance between where the bullet came through the floor and where I was sitting at the time was about 2 ft. So even with the gun stored UNLOADED with ammuntion locked in a different location there was still a huge danger to myself and my brother due to the handgun being in the home. After that my father kept the gun, but got rid of all the ammunition, and I learned that no matter how safe you are trying to be with firearms, some danger always remains. I choose not to expose my family to that danger.
The danger was not the gun but in the actions of your father. Had your brother killed you, your Dad could have been charged (in most cases) for being negligent. I'd question the manner in which you were raised and your Father's ability to safely lock and store firearms before I make blanket statments about gun safety.

Personification of inanimate objects skirts the issue. Its easier to blame the gun, but it really was your Dad's irresponsibility.

That being said, parents these days have a whole new host of social concerns/factors that only come to light when disaster strikes, i.e. your story. I know I won't be able to say "don't touch the guns" and expect any kids to listen the way I did when I was young.
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Old 08-19-04, 04:19 PM
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Carrying a gun while riding your bike is the stupidist thing I ever heard.

I didn't spend 4 grand on a titanium bike to load it down with a gun. maybe water and power bars.

I'm 50 and have ridden 5000 miles a year for the past 30 years.

Never needed it.
NO FEAR BABY.

You gun nuts are SICK.
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Old 08-19-04, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by davefarb
I'll continue being a legally thuggish gangster

C.O.P.S: Criminals On Public Streets.

Not all, but most cops in NYC play the role of gangsters and thugs. Most of these C.O.P.S are trigger happy and shouldn't even be a cop.

Has anyone read the news papers or watched the news of the number of young people (mainly black men) who were killed by the hand guns of C.O.P.S in NYC alone?

Most of these young people who was killed didn't have a weapon on them, and didn't do anything wrong. Guns are the problem, not good or bad people.

I rest my case.

Peace.

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Old 08-19-04, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by davefarb
Ok...I hope all of Ringo's rides are safe ones!
Too late!
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Old 08-19-04, 06:00 PM
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Scarry,

The revolver I usually carry actually has an aluminum alloy frame and a titanium cylinder and doesn't weigh very much at all (less than a Brooks saddle), even with the laser grip. I don't consider myself a gun nut but a responsible citizen. I would only ever consider using this firearm in defense of my or someone elses life when there is no other reasonable option. I wish the world was truly so safe that there was no chance that a firearm would ever have to be used in self defense. Unfortunately, the crimes committed every day prove otherwise.
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