Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Advocacy & Safety
Reload this Page >

Anti-bicycle rant by Dowd Muska. Is Big-Bicycle a growing threat to America?

Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

Anti-bicycle rant by Dowd Muska. Is Big-Bicycle a growing threat to America?

Old 06-10-10, 01:18 PM
  #26  
ItsJustMe
Señior Member
 
ItsJustMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 13,776

Bikes: Windsor Fens, Giant Seek 0 (2014, Alfine 8 + discs)

Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 441 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by crhilton View Post
I don't think I know anybody that rides for the environment.
I ride primarily for the environment, but I don't preach to anyone about it, so what does anyone care? I've thought about printing on the back of the shirt an image of an oil spill and the words "I'm not buying from them" but decided not to. I'll talk about it if someone asks but I'm doing it for my reasons, and other people will have to come to their own decisions.

I have the same feelings about actual religion; I go to church but I am NOT in favor of evangelism.
__________________
Work: the 8 hours that separates bike rides.
ItsJustMe is offline  
Old 06-10-10, 01:51 PM
  #27  
serra
Some guy with a bike
 
serra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: California
Posts: 276
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
Yes yes, you're the third person to point this out, I get it, bicycles are capable of killing people (that's not a happy for killing smile, more of a "Ok I've been enlightened face")

Originally Posted by crhilton View Post
There's a big luck factor. People get killed in pathetic bar brawls because they stumble and hit their head on something. Even a runner could do the damage (although it's less likely, because they're going slower and have more control).
Incidentally, this provides excellent reason to avoid a fist fight. You could be the unlucky one that kills the other guy or the unlucky one killed. Even if both of you have no idea how to fight.
Very true, freak accidents can happen just about anywhere with anything.
serra is offline  
Old 06-10-10, 03:02 PM
  #28  
crhilton
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Posts: 4,568

Bikes: '07 Trek 1500, '08 Surly Cross Check, '09 Masi Speciale Sprint custom build

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by ItsJustMe View Post
I ride primarily for the environment, but I don't preach to anyone about it, so what does anyone care? I've thought about printing on the back of the shirt an image of an oil spill and the words "I'm not buying from them" but decided not to. I'll talk about it if someone asks but I'm doing it for my reasons, and other people will have to come to their own decisions.

I have the same feelings about actual religion; I go to church but I am NOT in favor of evangelism.
I know one now .
crhilton is offline  
Old 06-10-10, 08:52 PM
  #29  
GraysonPeddie
Senior Member
 
GraysonPeddie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Tallahassee, FL 32304, USA
Posts: 353

Bikes: Trek Pure Trike (recently bought)

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I've been buzzed by cyclists in N. Chickasaw Trail without a warning. My left shoulder got hit by the cyclist's left shoulder and it hurt. The cyclist who bumped into my left shoulder so hard did not give me a warning from afar.

I'd like to ride my bicycle in the road to the grocery store instead of walking or taking a bus but I couldn't, even though I saw two cyclists riding 2-abreast in the road that surprised me. My mom told me that because I'm blind in my left eye, she told me that I should not take the risk on riding in the road, as motorists does not like bicyclists. But if I do take the risk, my mom told me that I might lose my vision in my right eye, on which I'll be completely blind. Unfortunately, I have to either take a bus or walk to any destination that is about 1+ mile away.

Either way, walking or taking a bus is just too inefficient for me and unfortunately, I've been way too obsessive with transportation issues.

So, I could probably understand Dowd Muska's view when it comes to bikes being a threat to Americans. I'm sorry, but I think I'm beginning to have some trouble siding with cyclists in this thread.

Last edited by GraysonPeddie; 06-10-10 at 09:06 PM.
GraysonPeddie is offline  
Old 06-10-10, 09:33 PM
  #30  
ab30494
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 32
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Cars are threats to biker pedestrians and more, we should all start a anti-car campaign.
ab30494 is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 07:57 AM
  #31  
bosoxmrkn
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Stratham, New Hampshire
Posts: 192
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Did anyone bother to read his BIO?

Single and child-free by choice, there’s no way he’s going to miss out on the formative years of Aidan Joseph O’Brien, his beautiful (and off-the-scale-IQ) nephew.
Single by choice? This guy is probably so awkward and out of touch with reality no one except his own family will put up with being around him. I wouldn't take anything he says too seriously.
bosoxmrkn is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 08:10 AM
  #32  
bizzz111
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 519
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Anti-cycling rants are the new Big Media troll. That is, post anti-cycling rant (especially in a cycling friendly area), sell more papers, get more page hits, get more comments. No different than an SUV rant (or a sub-compact rant depending on what part of the country you are from) back when gas was $4 a gallon, anti-(or pro) environmentalist rant, etc. etc. etc.

Nothing sells papers like pissing off a certain demographic.
bizzz111 is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 08:49 AM
  #33  
rydabent
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Lincoln Ne
Posts: 7,539

Bikes: RANS Stratus TerraTrike Tour II

Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1323 Post(s)
Liked 19 Times in 16 Posts
Aw gee maybe this poor misguided jerk was tramatized by a bicycle at a young age. Or maybe he is one of the few people in the world that cant ride a bike. So he is trying to get even.

Maybe truck drivers should rant against him being in the way with his SUV.
rydabent is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 10:39 AM
  #34  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 19,071
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7974 Post(s)
Liked 184 Times in 121 Posts
Originally Posted by serra View Post
Yes yes, you're the third person to point this out, I get it, bicycles are capable of killing people (that's not a happy for killing smile, more of a "Ok I've been enlightened face")
Ok, sorry to nag you. This one happened in my back yard, on a trail I've been on before, and the authorities are starting to come up with some very restrictive rules as a result of it. So, for me, it's very salient. They're talking about an enforced 10 mph limit as well as dismount-and-walk zones...
Seattle Forrest is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 11:03 AM
  #35  
Pippin
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 137

Bikes: Cannondale Six13, Noble F4, Ridley Supercross, GT Xizang, GT Edge CX. Fat Tire cruiser bike

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I find it interesting when so-called conservatives chastise the bicycle. For a group that believes in rugged individualism, self reliance and doing more with less the bicycle seems to be the natural choice. Why insist on the auto as the only viable transportation method as it day keeps nations flush with dollars for oil who don't particularly like us or the foundations to our freedoms.
Pippin is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 11:13 AM
  #36  
electrik
Single-serving poster
 
electrik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 5,098
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Perhaps his misunderstanding stems from seeing something like this...



The devil is coming from Europe with his big bicycle to corrupt us!
electrik is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 11:14 AM
  #37  
sggoodri
Senior Member
 
sggoodri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Cary, NC
Posts: 3,073

Bikes: 1983 Trek, 2001 Lemond, 2000 Gary Fisher

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Pippin View Post
I find it interesting when so-called conservatives chastise the bicycle. For a group that believes in rugged individualism, self reliance and doing more with less the bicycle seems to be the natural choice. Why insist on the auto as the only viable transportation method as it day keeps nations flush with dollars for oil who don't particularly like us or the foundations to our freedoms.
I believe it is mostly backlash to efforts to use government power to discourage motoring in favor of bicycling, and to increase spending on bicycling projects at the espense of motoring, as well as a response to anti-car rhetoric by pro-urbanists and environmentalists. Note that I'm not passing judgement on the desirability of those goals; I'm just saying that the response of conservatives is predictable.

In areas where bicycling is not perceived to have an anti-car motivation, there is particularly strong support for bicycling among conservatives. Since I live in a highly conservative area, I avoid bashing cars when promoting the benefits of cycling, mostly for the individual who exercises his right to choose it.
sggoodri is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 11:28 AM
  #38  
skye
Senior Member
 
skye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 892
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 25 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Further reading of his CV would seem to indicate that he's been unemployed since 2007.

So here's the run-down from an analysis of his CV:

Barely graduated college, held a couple of slacker jobs at no-name think tanks, got fired, slunk back home to mooch off the folks and pretend he's a writer by verbally puking on the internet.


You rock, big boy!
skye is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 12:11 PM
  #39  
Digital_Cowboy
Senior Member
 
Digital_Cowboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
Posts: 9,355

Bikes: Specialized Hardrock Mountain (Stolen); Giant Seek 2 (Stolen); Diamondback Ascent mid 1980 - 1997

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by GraysonPeddie View Post
I've been buzzed by cyclists in N. Chickasaw Trail without a warning. My left shoulder got hit by the cyclist's left shoulder and it hurt. The cyclist who bumped into my left shoulder so hard did not give me a warning from afar.
Uh, unless the cyclist was headed towards you how did they brush your left shoulder with their left shoulder?

Originally Posted by GraysonPeddie View Post
I'd like to ride my bicycle in the road to the grocery store instead of walking or taking a bus but I couldn't, even though I saw two cyclists riding 2-abreast in the road that surprised me. My mom told me that because I'm blind in my left eye, she told me that I should not take the risk on riding in the road, as motorists does not like bicyclists. But if I do take the risk, my mom told me that I might lose my vision in my right eye, on which I'll be completely blind. Unfortunately, I have to either take a bus or walk to any destination that is about 1+ mile away.
It's not that motorists don't like bikes per se, most probably couldn't care one way or the other. And even those that don't us they really don't want to hit us, even if they use the common get out of jail free card of "I didn't see him." It's still going to be a hassle and cause them more delay than to just harass us.

And I am sorry about your vision problem but I don't see how riding a bike more than a mile could cause you to lose the vision in your other eye. As I am sure as in any city and neighborhood that there are streets between you and your destination that see very little traffic and that would be safe for you to ride on.

Originally Posted by GraysonPeddie View Post
Either way, walking or taking a bus is just too inefficient for me and unfortunately, I've been way too obsessive with transportation issues.

So, I could probably understand Dowd Muska's view when it comes to bikes being a threat to Americans. I'm sorry, but I think I'm beginning to have some trouble siding with cyclists in this thread.
Digital_Cowboy is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 12:25 PM
  #40  
Digital_Cowboy
Senior Member
 
Digital_Cowboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
Posts: 9,355

Bikes: Specialized Hardrock Mountain (Stolen); Giant Seek 2 (Stolen); Diamondback Ascent mid 1980 - 1997

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
Ok, sorry to nag you. This one happened in my back yard, on a trail I've been on before, and the authorities are starting to come up with some very restrictive rules as a result of it. So, for me, it's very salient. They're talking about an enforced 10 mph limit as well as dismount-and-walk zones...
Do they plan on purchasing and handing out bike computers/speedometers to everyone so that they know how fast that they're going? If there are any hills, or bridges on your trail cyclists are going to have to ride their brakes in order to obey the speed limit of 10MPH. Where and how long are these purposed dismount-and-walk zones?

I think that it safe to say that most of us here are able to ride at 15+MPH on either a multi-speed of even a single speed bike with very little effort. A more reasonable speed limit would be like on the Pinellas Trail of 20MPH.

Even with that speed limit, it is still very easy to go over the speed limit when coasting down any of the bridges that are on the trail.
Digital_Cowboy is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 01:07 PM
  #41  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 19,071
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7974 Post(s)
Liked 184 Times in 121 Posts
Originally Posted by Digital_Cowboy View Post
Do they plan on purchasing and handing out bike computers/speedometers to everyone so that they know how fast that they're going? If there are any hills, or bridges on your trail cyclists are going to have to ride their brakes in order to obey the speed limit of 10MPH. Where and how long are these purposed dismount-and-walk zones?
As far as I know, cyclists aren't going to be getting freebie speedometers. In fact, I think the goals is to show that elected people are doing something about the bicycle menace, and not to, you know, make things safer. So that would pretty much rule speedometers out. ( As an aside, a bike computer has always been the first thing I've got for every bike I've owned, and it's always been set up before I'd ride the bike home from the shop. I always felt it was a safety issue, in some vague, undefined way. Here's what we'd call an "edge case" in the software industry, to validate my opinion... )

I'm sure they'll take the line that a condition of riding on public trials is to do so according to a set of rules, and that anybody who can't or won't do that, can't use the trails. Much like driving. In theory I have no problem with that ... but I think it's a bit draconian in this case.

About 15 miles north is the Burke Gilman Trail, another urban MUP. A several mile section that gets a lot of use ( from beloved Gas Works Park out to the University Bridge ) is divided into two trails, clearly labeled for bike and for pedestrian use. I'm not sure I've ever seen a cyclist on the walking trail, but the last time I was on this MUP I saw a group of joggers stop at the fork for a moment, and then continue their run along the bike trail. It's very clearly marked which is which, but ours is a little bit wider ( to allow for passing ), and so pedestrians ( especially four abreast ) are the biggest obstacle on this trail.

My point is that if elected folks were more interested in improving public safety and less interested in pandering to get votes, they might also require pedestrians to use ped-specific sections of trail, where these are available. And, if city designers want cyclists to use MUPs and stay out of traffic ... hobbling our speed isn't going to help any.
Seattle Forrest is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 01:29 PM
  #42  
Digital_Cowboy
Senior Member
 
Digital_Cowboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
Posts: 9,355

Bikes: Specialized Hardrock Mountain (Stolen); Giant Seek 2 (Stolen); Diamondback Ascent mid 1980 - 1997

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
As far as I know, cyclists aren't going to be getting freebie speedometers. In fact, I think the goals is to show that elected people are doing something about the bicycle menace, and not to, you know, make things safer. So that would pretty much rule speedometers out. ( As an aside, a bike computer has always been the first thing I've got for every bike I've owned, and it's always been set up before I'd ride the bike home from the shop. I always felt it was a safety issue, in some vague, undefined way. Here's what we'd call an "edge case" in the software industry, to validate my opinion... )
You're probably right about that. But MUPs are suppose to be the place where cyclists can be cyclists. I agree with you that a bike computer/speedometer is something that everyone who buys a bike should purchase at the same time and have installed before leaving the bike shop.

Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
I'm sure they'll take the line that a condition of riding on public trials is to do so according to a set of rules, and that anybody who can't or won't do that, can't use the trails. Much like driving. In theory I have no problem with that ... but I think it's a bit draconian in this case.
I agree with you that there should be rules in place for using public trails, but those rules should make sense. A speed limit of 10MPH doesn't make any kind of sense, will joggers also be required to maintain a speed of no faster than 10MPH?

Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
About 15 miles north is the Burke Gilman Trail, another urban MUP. A several mile section that gets a lot of use ( from beloved Gas Works Park out to the University Bridge ) is divided into two trails, clearly labeled for bike and for pedestrian use. I'm not sure I've ever seen a cyclist on the walking trail, but the last time I was on this MUP I saw a group of joggers stop at the fork for a moment, and then continue their run along the bike trail. It's very clearly marked which is which, but ours is a little bit wider ( to allow for passing ), and so pedestrians ( especially four abreast ) are the biggest obstacle on this trail.
It would be nice if those joggers were reported to law enforcement to be dealt with. And if they are on the bike side of the trail and get hit then it should be pointed out to them that they more than the cyclist is the one who is at fault. And I know what you mean about pedestrians using the bicycle side of MUPs. The few times every couple of months that I go out to the VA and ride the Pinellas Trial I've seen more pedestrians on the bike side of the trail than I have bikes on the pedestrian side of the trail.

I have also seen cyclists riding two abreast and when encountering a cyclist coming at them from the opposite direction staying two abreast "forcing" them into the pedestrian side of the trail. Doesn't common sense, and courtesy dictate that they go single file when encountering another cyclist so that they don't have to go into the pedestrian side of the trail?

Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
My point is that if elected folks were more interested in improving public safety and less interested in pandering to get votes, they might also require pedestrians to use ped-specific sections of trail, where these are available. And, if city designers want cyclists to use MUPs and stay out of traffic ... hobbling our speed isn't going to help any.
You are correct, and sadly more likely than not that isn't going to change anytime soon.
Digital_Cowboy is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 01:53 PM
  #43  
gcottay
Senior Member
 
gcottay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Green Valley AZ
Posts: 3,770

Bikes: Trice Q; Volae Century; TT 3.4

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Aside from providing child care for his nephew he is a self-employed fighter against collectivism. Since bikes do tend to bring people together, it's only natural he would see them as a menace.
gcottay is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 04:07 PM
  #44  
kuan
Twincities MN
 
kuan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Salsa, Cannondale, Surly.
Posts: 2,528
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Bicycle industry sales 5.6 Billion dollars a year.

Gasoline sales. 30 Billion dollars... PER MONTH! <-- doesn't include auto sales.

Big bicycle? Really?
__________________
www.marrow.org
kuan is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 04:44 PM
  #45  
trackhub
Senior Member
 
trackhub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Watching all of you on O.B.I.T.
Posts: 2,013

Bikes: Gunnar Street Dog

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
As we have all noticed before, it happens every year at this time: De-evolved cretins taking to the internet, newspapers, (dwindling in numbers) and of course, the airwaves, to transmit their anti-bicycle diatribes. And they're always the same, suggesting that these columns and radio shows are pre-assembled, and they just fill in some blanks.

They blow in, they blow out, sort of like bad weather.

Just glancing over some more of this jerk's material though, and it would seem as though he has some serious issues. Bad potty training maybe? Who can say?
trackhub is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 07:05 PM
  #46  
DX-MAN
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,788
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Just because I could, I e-mailed this assclown, and politely (yes!) let him know what I thought of his verbal diarrhea. Don't really expect a response.

I was always taught that you had to learn something about a subject before forming an opinion about it, so you have some BASIS for that opinion. I also learned at a pretty young age that opinion without basis is the DEFINITION of prejudice.

I guess that's why they're calling it "racism", or "hate crime" these days, cuz it sure seems lie it's okay to have PREJUDICES!
DX-MAN is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 07:34 PM
  #47  
mondaycurse
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 857
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Funny how he singles out bicycle lobbyists without a peep about Big-oil, big-car, big-highway, etc etc lobbies. A two-lane highway was just converted to 4-lane highway not too long ago, even though something like 85% of the people nearby were opposed. Total cost: $267 billion.
BTW, these "writers" do have an influence on a certain sect of society. I've been called a socialist three times in my Tea-Party-loving town just for riding my bike; no political slogans on my helmet or anything.

Last edited by mondaycurse; 06-11-10 at 07:38 PM.
mondaycurse is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 08:19 PM
  #48  
Dchiefransom
Senior Member
 
Dchiefransom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Newark, CA. San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 6,244
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by Digital_Cowboy View Post
Do they plan on purchasing and handing out bike computers/speedometers to everyone so that they know how fast that they're going? If there are any hills, or bridges on your trail cyclists are going to have to ride their brakes in order to obey the speed limit of 10MPH. Where and how long are these purposed dismount-and-walk zones?

I think that it safe to say that most of us here are able to ride at 15+MPH on either a multi-speed of even a single speed bike with very little effort. A more reasonable speed limit would be like on the Pinellas Trail of 20MPH.

Even with that speed limit, it is still very easy to go over the speed limit when coasting down any of the bridges that are on the trail.
Yes, cyclists will have to ride their brakes to go slow, just like motor vehicles have to do while staying behind cyclists at times. Cyclists have to use their brakes to obey the rules or wait behind slower cyclists to safely pass. If any other cyclists want to go faster they can ride in the road.
Dchiefransom is offline  
Old 06-11-10, 11:46 PM
  #49  
noisebeam
Al
 
noisebeam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: AZ
Posts: 14,612

Bikes: Cannondale SuperSix, Lemond Poprad. Retired: Jamis Sputnik, Centurion LeMans Fixed, Diamond Back ascent ex

Mentioned: 49 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3328 Post(s)
Liked 31 Times in 22 Posts
Uniform speed limits for MUPs are wrong. If well done speed limits change with sight lines, terrain, path design, etc. Post 10mph on short sight lines curves, etc, but 20mph for straight wide sections with long sightlines.

The other consideration is if cyclists will get the 11mph buffer given to motorists?

"
Why are speeders allowed an 11 mph buffer? The margin is intended to address language in the Arizona Revised Statutes related to speed offenses that defines, "...reasonable and prudent..." speed. It also provides a reasonable margin of error/grace for inaccurate vehicle speedometers and short-term lapses of attention by otherwise law-abiding and generally cautious drivers."
noisebeam is offline  
Old 06-12-10, 03:08 AM
  #50  
Digital_Cowboy
Senior Member
 
Digital_Cowboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
Posts: 9,355

Bikes: Specialized Hardrock Mountain (Stolen); Giant Seek 2 (Stolen); Diamondback Ascent mid 1980 - 1997

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
Uniform speed limits for MUPs are wrong. If well done speed limits change with sight lines, terrain, path design, etc. Post 10mph on short sight lines curves, etc, but 20mph for straight wide sections with long sightlines.

The other consideration is if cyclists will get the 11mph buffer given to motorists?

"
Why are speeders allowed an 11 mph buffer? The margin is intended to address language in the Arizona Revised Statutes related to speed offenses that defines, "...reasonable and prudent..." speed. It also provides a reasonable margin of error/grace for inaccurate vehicle speedometers and short-term lapses of attention by otherwise law-abiding and generally cautious drivers."
True, but given that a lot (if not most) trails are former railroad tracks with gentle sweeping curves. So good sight lines shouldn't be a problem. And as such higher speeds should be permitted.
Digital_Cowboy is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.