Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Advocacy & Safety
Reload this Page >

Bicycle May Use Full Lane: Bike Mounted Sign

Notices
Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

Bicycle May Use Full Lane: Bike Mounted Sign

Old 09-20-10, 03:53 PM
  #1  
thehum
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
thehum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Bicycle May Use Full Lane: Bike Mounted Sign

Hey everyone,

I finally got around to making a waterproof laminated "Bicycle May Use Full Lane" Sign to stick on the back of my bike to let drivers know I have a right to the road. Hopefully it'll come in handy riding around here in Boston.


I posted details and a PDF of the image for anyone to download and print one that cites Massachusetts traffic law on my blog.
thehum is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 04:04 PM
  #2  
noisebeam
Arizona Dessert
 
noisebeam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: AZ
Posts: 14,861

Bikes: Cannondale SuperSix, Lemond Poprad. Retired: Jamis Sputnik, Centurion LeMans Fixed, Diamond Back ascent ex

Mentioned: 63 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4230 Post(s)
Liked 843 Times in 472 Posts
How do you block out the bottom section of the sign when choosing to share a lane?
noisebeam is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 04:07 PM
  #3  
Doohickie 
You gonna eat that?
 
Doohickie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Fort Worth, Texas Church of Hopeful Uncertainty
Posts: 14,682

Bikes: 1966 Raleigh DL-1 Tourist, 1973 Schwinn Varsity, 1983 Raleigh Marathon, 1994 Nishiki Sport XRS

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Heh. Let me know how that works out for you.
__________________
I stop for people / whose right of way I honor / but not for no one.


Originally Posted by bragi "However, it's never a good idea to overgeneralize."
Doohickie is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 04:16 PM
  #4  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 11,675
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2198 Post(s)
Liked 212 Times in 149 Posts
Originally Posted by thehum View Post
the image for anyone to download and print one that cites Massachusetts traffic law
EDIT: the following is the law for CA not MA. Still, MA doesn't require vehicles passing cyclists to move into the other lane. As far as I know, no state does.

https://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21202.htm

V C Section 21202 Operation on Roadway

Operation on Roadway

21202. (a) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at that time shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway except under any of the following situations:

(1) When overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle proceeding in the same direction.

(2) When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.

(3) When reasonably necessary to avoid conditions (including, but not limited to, fixed or moving objects, vehicles, bicycles, pedestrians, animals, surface hazards, or substandard width lanes) that make it unsafe to continue along the right-hand curb or edge, subject to the provisions of Section 21656. For purposes of this section, a "substandard width lane" is a lane that is too narrow for a bicycle and a vehicle to travel safely side by side within the lane.

(4) When approaching a place where a right turn is authorized.

(b) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway of a highway, which highway carries traffic in one direction only and has two or more marked traffic lanes, may ride as near the left-hand curb or edge of that roadway as practicable.

Amended Sec. 4, Ch. 674, Stats. 1996. Effective January 1, 1997.
It looks like you are making up the "Change Lanes to Pass" part (it's not part of the law as you are trying to imply).

Last edited by njkayaker; 09-21-10 at 11:12 AM. Reason: Clarifying that the cited law was for CA not MA.
njkayaker is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 04:24 PM
  #5  
squirtdad
Senior Member
 
squirtdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: San Jose (Willow Glen) Ca
Posts: 7,037

Bikes: 85 team Miyata (modern 5800 105) , '84 Team Miyata,(dura ace old school) '82 nishiski,

Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1169 Post(s)
Liked 368 Times in 283 Posts
Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
https://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21202.htm



It looks like you are making up the "Change Lanes to Pass" part (it's not part of the law as you are trying to imply).
er.....that is the CA not MA vehicle code you have quoted. OP noted that he is cycling in Boston......
__________________
Looking for more time to ride what I have
squirtdad is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 04:48 PM
  #6  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 11,675
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2198 Post(s)
Liked 212 Times in 149 Posts
Originally Posted by squirtdad View Post
er.....that is the CA not MA vehicle code you have quoted. OP noted that he is cycling in Boston......
Yes, wrong state. I looked up the "CVC 21202" reference on the t-shirt on his blog.

You are missing the point.

It's still not part of the MA law!

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge...r85/Section11b

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge...ter89/Section2

Section 2. Except as herein otherwise provided, the driver of a vehicle passing another vehicle traveling in the same direction shall drive a safe distance to the left of such other vehicle and shall not return to the right until safely clear of the overtaken vehicle; and, if the way is of sufficient width for the two vehicles to pass, the driver of the leading one shall not unnecessarily obstruct the other. If it is not possible to overtake a bicycle or other vehicle at a safe distance in the same lane, the overtaking vehicle shall use all or part of an adjacent lane if it is safe to do so or wait for a safe opportunity to overtake. Except when overtaking and passing on the right is permitted, the driver of an overtaken vehicle shall give way to the right in favor of the overtaking vehicle on visible signal and shall not increase the speed of his vehicle until completely passed by the overtaking vehicle.
He's making up laws!

Last edited by njkayaker; 09-21-10 at 10:34 AM.
njkayaker is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 04:51 PM
  #7  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 21,227
Mentioned: 67 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12059 Post(s)
Liked 3,414 Times in 1,903 Posts
Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
It looks like you are making up the "Change Lanes to Pass" part (it's not part of the law as you are trying to imply).
Wait. Are you saying that somebody on the street is bluffing?

SOMEBODY STOP THE PRESSES!
Seattle Forrest is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:14 PM
  #8  
thehum
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
thehum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
Yes, wrong state. I looked up the "CVC 21202" reference on the t-shirt on his blog.

You are missing the point.

It's still not part of the MA law!

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge...r85/Section11b

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge.../SearchResults



He's making up laws!
There's a reason why the law citation is only on the upper portion. The Change Lanes to Pass part it not part of the law and is intended as additional instruction for drivers on what to do when they see an unexpected cyclist in the lane other than getting angry and riding up on my tail/running me off the road. I used the graphic from BAUFL.org as a reference, which doesnt cite any laws and includes the Change Lanes to Pass part at the bottom.

Last edited by thehum; 09-20-10 at 05:17 PM.
thehum is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:22 PM
  #9  
thehum
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
thehum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
How do you block out the bottom section of the sign when choosing to share a lane?
I don't. If I'm sharing a lane drivers probably won't see the sign or change lanes anyway.
thehum is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:23 PM
  #10  
squirtdad
Senior Member
 
squirtdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: San Jose (Willow Glen) Ca
Posts: 7,037

Bikes: 85 team Miyata (modern 5800 105) , '84 Team Miyata,(dura ace old school) '82 nishiski,

Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1169 Post(s)
Liked 368 Times in 283 Posts
Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
Yes, wrong state. I looked up the "CVC 21202" reference on the t-shirt on his blog.

You are missing the point.

It's still not part of the MA law!

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge...r85/Section11b

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge.../SearchResults



He's making up laws!
Gotcha!
__________________
Looking for more time to ride what I have
squirtdad is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:26 PM
  #11  
mikeybikes
Senior Member
 
mikeybikes's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Edgewater, CO
Posts: 3,214

Bikes: Tons

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Ironic that the name of your blog is "theHumble cyclist"...
mikeybikes is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:28 PM
  #12  
CommuterRun
Conservative Hippie
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Wakulla Co. FL
Posts: 4,271
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Now, if the cyclist is entitled by law to the full use of the lane; and is using the full width of the lane; then how would a car pass without changing lanes? What's the driver supposed to do; jump over him? Let's try using a little bit of logic here. No, the law doesn't say it in so many words, but in finding himself behind a cyclist a driver would have three options; stay behind the cyclist, turn and take an alternate route, execute a legal pass by changing lanes. Sounds easy enough.

And besides, I don't see any reference in the sign that changing lanes to pass is required by law. The only legal reference I see is that the cyclist may use the full lane.
CommuterRun is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:28 PM
  #13  
noisebeam
Arizona Dessert
 
noisebeam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: AZ
Posts: 14,861

Bikes: Cannondale SuperSix, Lemond Poprad. Retired: Jamis Sputnik, Centurion LeMans Fixed, Diamond Back ascent ex

Mentioned: 63 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4230 Post(s)
Liked 843 Times in 472 Posts
Originally Posted by thehum View Post
I don't. If I'm sharing a lane drivers probably won't see the sign or change lanes anyway.
I hope motorists to see you (and then likely the sign) if sharing a lane. Isn't having a sign that says to change lanes when it is not necessary legally or for your safety a bit obnoxious?
noisebeam is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:29 PM
  #14  
noisebeam
Arizona Dessert
 
noisebeam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: AZ
Posts: 14,861

Bikes: Cannondale SuperSix, Lemond Poprad. Retired: Jamis Sputnik, Centurion LeMans Fixed, Diamond Back ascent ex

Mentioned: 63 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4230 Post(s)
Liked 843 Times in 472 Posts
Originally Posted by CommuterRun View Post
Now, if the cyclist is entitled by law to the full use of the lane; and is using the full width of the lane; then how would a car pass without changing lanes?.
I thought cyclists are not 'entitled' to use full lane if the lane is wide enough to share and there are no other reasons to not use the full lane.
noisebeam is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:30 PM
  #15  
CommuterRun
Conservative Hippie
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Wakulla Co. FL
Posts: 4,271
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
I hope motorists to see you (and then likely the sign) if sharing a lane. Isn't having a sign that says to change lanes when it is not necessary legally or for your safety a bit obnoxious?
I don't think so. I think the simple act of driving a motor vehicle is much more obnoxious than that sign could ever be.
CommuterRun is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:31 PM
  #16  
dahut
Ridin' South Cackalacky
 
dahut's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,918
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Youll probably be accosted now for angering the Boston woman who was threatened by a cyclist with a knife.

I do applaud you efforts to be pro-active. Im sure you'll feel good with that back there.
Im also pretty sure that most motorists who would crowd you out of the lane could care two cents about the law. Either they will deliberately avoid hitting you or they don't give a rats @ss about you. Few of the latter will be thankful for being told how they are supposed to behave, especially by some know-it-all on a bike.

You might want to reconsider something a bit more productive. Maybe a sign that says "Throw Money" would at least get drivers involved.
dahut is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 05:36 PM
  #17  
CommuterRun
Conservative Hippie
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Wakulla Co. FL
Posts: 4,271
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by dahut View Post
Maybe a sign that says "Throw Money" would at least wake drivers up.
Nah, some wise-ass will be shooting at him with silver dollars from a slingshot.

Replace the sign with an ad the same size for a local strip club.
CommuterRun is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 06:00 PM
  #18  
thehum
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
thehum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
Yes, wrong state. I looked up the "CVC 21202" reference on the t-shirt on his blog.

You are missing the point.

It's still not part of the MA law!

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge...r85/Section11b

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge.../SearchResults



He's making up laws!
So I just looked up the Massbike Coalition site, and here's what they have to say about 89.2, the law you cited, except in plain english:

5. Don’t Squeeze Bicyclists in Narrow Lanes : If the lane is too narrow for a motorist to pass a bicycle (or any other vehicle) at a safe distance while staying in the lane, the motorist must use another lane to pass, or, if that is also unsafe, the motorist must wait until it is safe to pass.
once again, here's the law:
Section 2. Except as herein otherwise provided, the driver of a vehicle passing another vehicle traveling in the same direction shall drive a safe distance to the left of such other vehicle and shall not return to the right until safely clear of the overtaken vehicle; and, if the way is of sufficient width for the two vehicles to pass, the driver of the leading one shall not unnecessarily obstruct the other. If it is not possible to overtake a bicycle or other vehicle at a safe distance in the same lane, the overtaking vehicle shall use all or part of an adjacent lane if it is safe to do so or wait for a safe opportunity to overtake. Except when overtaking and passing on the right is permitted, the driver of an overtaken vehicle shall give way to the right in favor of the overtaking vehicle on visible signal and shall not increase the speed of his vehicle until completely passed by the overtaking vehicle.

The driver of a vehicle may, if the roadway is free from obstruction and of sufficient width for two or more lines of moving vehicles, overtake and pass upon the right of another vehicle when the vehicle overtaken is (a) making or about to make a left turn, (b) upon a one-way street, or (c) upon any roadway on which traffic is restricted to one direction of movement.

In Boston, where a good 80% of the time I am cycling in lanes with a door zone, taking the lane is a very reasonable and common action to take and it does make the lane too narrow to squeeze. Since this is the case, drivers must change lanes by law. MassBike Coalition drafted these laws, so I trust their interpretation. Did I miss something? What am I making up? Again, I wasn't citing a law on that part of the sign, but perhaps now I will.

Please keep in mind that this is an experiment. I really do appreciate all your feedback. I was thinking of taking the Changle Lanes to Pass part, but I'll see how leaving it on goes first.

Last edited by thehum; 09-20-10 at 06:18 PM.
thehum is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 06:00 PM
  #19  
ItsJustMe
Seńior Member
 
ItsJustMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 13,749

Bikes: Windsor Fens, Giant Seek 0 (2014, Alfine 8 + discs)

Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
He's making up laws!
No he's not. The law is in the top part. His request to change lanes to pass is clearly a separate part.
__________________
Work: the 8 hours that separates bike rides.
ItsJustMe is offline  
Old 09-20-10, 06:05 PM
  #20  
dahut
Ridin' South Cackalacky
 
dahut's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,918
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by CommuterRun View Post
Nah, some wise-ass will be shooting at him with silver dollars from a slingshot.

Replace the sign with an ad the same size for a local strip club.
You're probably right. Great idea!

Now you know I have to try them both...
dahut is offline  
Old 09-21-10, 09:42 AM
  #21  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 11,675
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2198 Post(s)
Liked 212 Times in 149 Posts
Originally Posted by thehum View Post
In Boston, where a good 80% of the time I am cycling in lanes with a door zone, taking the lane is a very reasonable and common action to take and it does make the lane too narrow to squeeze.
I don't have any objection to the top part of the sign. The "may use full lane" is an acceptable interpretation of the MA law. It's the "change lane to pass" that isn't correct.

Originally Posted by thehum View Post
In Boston, where a good 80% of the time I am cycling in lanes with a door zone, taking the lane is a very reasonable and common action to take and it does make the lane too narrow to squeeze. Since this is the case, drivers must change lanes by law.
The law only requires a "safe distance". This might, in certain circumstances, require using the other lane. But your sign implies that "changing lanes" is always required, which is clearly false.

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge...r85/Section11b

https://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge.../SearchResults

Section 2. Except as herein otherwise provided, the driver of a vehicle passing another vehicle traveling in the same direction shall drive a safe distance to the left of such other vehicle and shall not return to the right until safely clear of the overtaken vehicle; and, if the way is of sufficient width for the two vehicles to pass, the driver of the leading one shall not unnecessarily obstruct the other. If it is not possible to overtake a bicycle or other vehicle at a safe distance in the same lane, the overtaking vehicle shall use all or part of an adjacent lane if it is safe to do so or wait for a safe opportunity to overtake. Except when overtaking and passing on the right is permitted, the driver of an overtaken vehicle shall give way to the right in favor of the overtaking vehicle on visible signal and shall not increase the speed of his vehicle until completely passed by the overtaking vehicle.
Originally Posted by thehum View Post
MassBike Coalition drafted these laws, so I trust their interpretation. Did I miss something? What am I making up?
Somebody is making things up. You got your sign from the "MassBike Coalition" and they want to give the impression that "change lane to pass" is part of the law (but it isn't).

Originally Posted by thehum View Post
Again, I wasn't citing a law on that part of the sign, but perhaps now I will.
Your sign has "MGL 85.11B on it". That's the reference to the law (the one I quoted).

===============

Originally Posted by ItsJustMe View Post
No he's not. The law is in the top part. His request to change lanes to pass is clearly a separate part.
My, aren't we naive! The reference to the law is too small for drivers to read. The sign intends to give the impression that the "change lanes" stuff is part of the law. It's not at-all phrased as a "request".

Some people do have low standards for honesty!

Last edited by njkayaker; 09-21-10 at 10:01 AM.
njkayaker is offline  
Old 09-21-10, 09:51 AM
  #22  
unterhausen
Randomhead
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
Posts: 19,892
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked 421 Times in 323 Posts
seems like nitpicking. If the sign gives any motorist the idea that they might someday choose to change lanes to pass a cyclist, it's a good thing. I'm sure a significant number of the motorists that pass me when I'm on a bike have never considered the idea of slowing down, much less changing lanes.
unterhausen is offline  
Old 09-21-10, 09:52 AM
  #23  
Bekologist
totally louche
 
Bekologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: A land that time forgot
Posts: 18,025

Bikes: the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
wow, if this bike sign arouses such acrimony in here, i cannot expect it to be well received by the motoring public.

imagine if NJKAYKER were behind the bicyclist!
Bekologist is offline  
Old 09-21-10, 10:05 AM
  #24  
Dodgensince74
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Phoenix, Az
Posts: 161

Bikes: "10" Trek 7.3, early 90's Raliegh Dash, late 80's Takara 12spd Road Bike

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
maybe he should have used a caution yellow colored paper for back ground on the " change lanes to pass " portion of the sign, that would have seperated it from the rest of the sign
Dodgensince74 is offline  
Old 09-21-10, 10:16 AM
  #25  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 21,227
Mentioned: 67 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12059 Post(s)
Liked 3,414 Times in 1,903 Posts
Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
I thought cyclists are not 'entitled' to use full lane if the lane is wide enough to share and there are no other reasons to not use the full lane.
I'm glad to see that you don't believe in "same road same rules."
Seattle Forrest is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.