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Making Cycling Criminal

Old 11-17-04, 11:16 AM
  #51  
catatonic
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Originally Posted by Daily Commute
Part of the reason is CM's stubborn refusal to define itself and the fear of the anti-globalization nut cases. CMer's have repeatedly bragged about how different riders join for different reasons. Given CM's refusal to police itself, the real police should have been concerned about the same kind of riots caused by anti-globalists in other cities.

Until CM is willing to define itself and kick out people with other goals, it will continue to have problems.

Now, back to the topic of the thread--the real problem with bicycle registration is that different cities have different rules. In Ohio, many cities have require bikes to display their registration. Fortunately, the rules aren't enforced, but a touring cyclist (or even one that wanted to ride across several suburbs) would need to display tags from each locality. This is a recipe for arbitrary enforcement.
and this is why it should be struck down....either make it a state decision, or dont do it at all.
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Old 11-17-04, 11:52 AM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by Dchiefransom
If those plates are actually big enough to see, then how much drag are they going to produce? Where will it be mounted on the bike? Behind the seat blocks my rear flasher if I want to ride at night.
If licensing those that use public areas for getting around is okay, then when will we have to wear identifying numbers on the backs of our clothes, since the sidewalk is also public?
According to http://webdocs.nyccouncil.info/textf...TOKEN=35582037 Intro 497 would require

b.* Every person over the age of sixteen who owns a bicycle shall register such bicycle with the commissioner and provide for the identification of such bicycle by affixing to the bicycle or bicycle seat, in clear view, a metal, plastic or other sign issued by the commissioner, bearing the identification number assigned by the commissioner which identifies the bicycle and the registered owner in lettering and/or numerals so as to be plainly readable at a distance of not less than ten feet and shall maintain such sign in good condition.* The department may charge a fee for such sign and identification number not to be more than twenty-five dollars per registration.
My hybrid barely has room for a rear blinkie, which winds up partially blocked by the rear wheel. Mounting any sort of plate on the seat post isn't going to be "clearly" visible from 10 feet..

Considering the "quality" of current NYS plates I'd think having any raw metal edges could cause additional injuries in an accident.

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Old 11-17-04, 11:57 AM
  #53  
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just sent in the email\fax. i'll write up another email to send her directly later this afternoon. for those that haven't done this already...just follow the link provided by the original poster of this thread. it takes about 30 seconds to do.
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Old 11-17-04, 12:30 PM
  #54  
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Look I don't think this is all that terrible an idea... except the 15 day in jail bit... that is totally bogus.

But I do recall when I was growing up that we had to register bicycles at the local Fire Station. We paid some token amount... and the SN was registered and we got a numbered metalized sticker on the bike.

BFD, what is wrong with registering a bike? Seems to me that this was somethat that was done, and now has simply been forgotten.
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Old 11-17-04, 12:42 PM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by vincenzosi
We're talking about registration violations, not reckless driving.
Yes in CA they do tow the car for registration violations... I have seen it happen, it is considered part of the state tax code.

Now as far as putting someone in jail for 15 days for such a violation, that is BS!
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Old 11-17-04, 12:43 PM
  #56  
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Dumb idea because it won't be uniformly enforced (just look at the way the bike lanes are enforced in NYC), and won't be practical. It also will kill Jersey cyclists who come to New York City on the weekends to ride.

Soon we're going to be at the point where you'll have to register your garbage cans because, well hey, it's a good idea!
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Old 11-17-04, 12:47 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by Daily Commute
In Ohio, many cities require bikes to display their registration. Fortunately, the rules aren't enforced, but a touring cyclist (or even one that wanted to ride across several suburbs) would need to display tags from each locality. This is a recipe for arbitrary enforcement.
Why? As I drive across country, my auto tags do not require updating to each locality...

Look I am not a huge fan of this, but I do remember doing this as a kid, and it simply meant that if a bike was stolen, there was a record of the SN and it had a tag on it.

Now on the other hand, the punishment DOES not even come close to fitting the crime... perhaps a simple fine might be in line, but 15 days... sheesh, someone is on a power trip.
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Old 11-17-04, 12:54 PM
  #58  
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it's always a dangerous proposition to go in favor of more regulation in my opinion. seems to me that once you lose some freedom it's almost impossible to get it back. inch by inch you lose things everyday that cannot be regained. What was the last law that passed that gave you more freedom? I canít think of one. i just want to live my life as simple as possible....i (and many people here) don't want to fill out paper work for every little tiny thing. i'm getting sick of this police state that we're moving toward. i can't imagine what it will be like in 20 years if things continue as they are.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:01 PM
  #59  
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I didn't read everyone's replies.

Charleston, SC already has such a law inplace. It has nothing to do with crimalizing cycling, but raising revenue.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:03 PM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by genec
Why? As I drive across country, my auto tags do not require updating to each locality...
Why? Because your car has identification from a corresponding state. In order for this to work the same way, every state would have to start registering bikes so that you could go across state with local registration.

Then what's next? Canada? If a Canadian wants to cycle here, they'll need Canada plates...

And so on... And so on...

Originally Posted by genec
Look I am not a huge fan of this, but I do remember doing this as a kid, and it simply meant that if a bike was stolen, there was a record of the SN and it had a tag on it.
Wonderful, and if you choose to do that, that's your prerogative. However, to fine people and arrest them and impound their bikes for not doing it? That's just idiotic.

Originally Posted by genec
Now on the other hand, the punishment DOES not even come close to fitting the crime... perhaps a simple fine might be in line, but 15 days... sheesh, someone is on a power trip.
That is correct. But bear in mind that this law is most likely designed to give law enforcement an excuse to throw people in the slammer. Doesn't anyone find it odd that after two rather rowdy CM's with police confronting riders (according to reports) without provocation, that a law like this slips into consideration?

I absolutely do not believe this is a coincidence.

Look, as a conservative / libertarian, I'm much more likely to side with law enforcement than anything else. It's a bias I have, and I'm aware of it. HOWEVER, this smacks of authoritarianistic harassment, and needs to be addressed before someone latches onto it as a good idea.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:22 PM
  #61  
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Originally Posted by vincenzosi
Why? Because your car has identification from a corresponding state.
Then what's next? Canada? If a Canadian wants to cycle here, they'll need Canada plates...

And so on... And so on...


Blah blah blah, whine whine whine. As if these problems don't occur with other sorts of licenses, such as for fishing. It could easily be solved by providing temporary passes for those who have the somewhat bizarre desire to cycle in an urban miasma such as NY, LA or whatever. One visit to a local pig-pen, ya fill out a form and you are on your way.

I'd go one step futher and suggest that those who are using their bicycles for a commercial purpose (for example, those ever loving delivery boys who mow down pedestrians in crosswalks) should have to get a COMMERCIAL license plate, entailing them with additional responsibilities and harsher penalties, just as other commercial vehicles do.

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Old 11-17-04, 01:28 PM
  #62  
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Like many of you, I am very uncomfortable whent he governmnet wishes to extend its tentacles even further into my life. So, let's examine the logic of this proposal and weigh its merits accordingly.

Some are claiming that this is a good law because it will give police and others a way to identify the numerous bicycle riding criminals currently escaping justice. Fair enough. However, an examination of any crime statistics will show that the vast majority of crimes are commited by people on foot. Further, most crimes go unpunished because the perpetrator flees or escapes. Therefore, I think the good cousellor should propose mandatory tatooing of numbers on the back of everybodies' necks, in a size visible from not less than ten feet, not obscurted by collars, necklaces, or hair. Fifteen days in prison for noncompliance is a must, obviously. We must stop the criminals!

Any mamby pamby liberal snivelling that most peds dont' commit crimes must be countered by pointing out the actions of the Red Sox fans after they won the World Series. Further, this measure will be a great way to catch those imbedded cells of terrorists! Hey.... with tatoos, we won't need those expensive plates on the bikes, we could just look at the two wheelin' anarchist pinkos' necks!!!
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Old 11-17-04, 01:29 PM
  #63  
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Thanks for taking a shot at my hometown. I appreciate it. Just so you know, some of us don't have a hell of a lot of choices where we ride. So far you've not only endorsed an over-reaching law, you've created an extra level of bureaucracy, and enhanced it so that it reaches further.

That's great if you go for that sort of thing. I for one don't.

And as I said earlier:

Doesn't anyone find it odd that after two rather rowdy CM's with police confronting riders (according to reports) without provocation, that a law like this slips into consideration?
Does nobody have a problem with this?
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Old 11-17-04, 01:30 PM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by genec
Look I don't think this is all that terrible an idea... except the 15 day in jail bit... that is totally bogus.

But I do recall when I was growing up that we had to register bicycles at the local Fire Station. We paid some token amount... and the SN was registered and we got a numbered metalized sticker on the bike.

BFD, what is wrong with registering a bike? Seems to me that this was somethat that was done, and now has simply been forgotten.
I did that as a kid also, but the sticker was put somewhere it usually didn't show, and the cops could check if they wanted. NYC is talking about hanging a license plate somewhere on the back of the bike.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:33 PM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by genec
Why? As I drive across country, my auto tags do not require updating to each locality...

Look I am not a huge fan of this, but I do remember doing this as a kid, and it simply meant that if a bike was stolen, there was a record of the SN and it had a tag on it.

Now on the other hand, the punishment DOES not even come close to fitting the crime... perhaps a simple fine might be in line, but 15 days... sheesh, someone is on a power trip.
Bike registration in my town is not mandatory. If I went somewhere it was, I'd have to stop, find the right place, nad register it. I technically couldn't come into town for a Sunday ride, and comply because the offices are usually a Mon-Fri deal. Of course, this is where the other thread about a National Bike Registry could come into play.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:36 PM
  #66  
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Cops need to start dragging motorists out of their cars, throwing them on the pavement, handcuffing them and dragging them off to jail for blocking intersections, and running red lights.

Only then will the City see how utterly preposterous the whole thing is. When motorists are "treated unfairly", you'll see some serious change.


when I was growing up in Michigan, there was the option of registering your bike for $5 per year, with a sticker on your frame that was about the size of a business card. It was for recovering your bike if it was stolen, not to track you to throw you in jail.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:37 PM
  #67  
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As someone who has visited NYC EXPRESSLY for the purpose of cycling, I am troubled by the burden this would cause visitor cyclists. I would probably not want to go to manhattan if it involved applying weeks in advance for a license, paying for it (what, $50), and then having to install the damn thing on my seatstay. It is expensive enough to visit NYC without having more crap to deal with-- and you know the red-tape involved with getting a license is going to be a real pain in the ass.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:40 PM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by coney
Cops need to start dragging motorists out of their cars, throwing them on the pavement, handcuffing them and dragging them off to jail for blocking intersections, and running red lights.

Only then will the City see how utterly preposterous the whole thing is. When motorists are "treated unfairly", you'll see some serious change.
I'll tell you what. I'll hold my breath waiting for Santa, and you hold your breath waiting for this.

Let's see who turns blue first. I have a feeling you'll be blue longer.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:44 PM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by Dchiefransom
15 days imprisonment???????? Do the car drivers face that for not registering their cars?

yes they could plus a heavy fine
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Old 11-17-04, 01:50 PM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by DieselDan
I didn't read everyone's replies.

Charleston, SC already has such a law inplace. It has nothing to do with crimalizing cycling, but raising revenue.
Do they actually require you to put a license plate on your $10,000 Colnago, or is it a sticker ?
Not that you have one of those, but if I hit the Super Lotto, be ready for a trip to the LBS back there with VSW.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:50 PM
  #71  
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Originally Posted by timmhaan
i'm getting sick of this police state that we're moving toward. i can't imagine what it will be like in 20 years if things continue as they are.
Thanks to politicians, Osama Bin Laden won.
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Old 11-17-04, 01:58 PM
  #72  
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Somehow I get the feeling that if this is implimented, the following will happen at the following Critical Mass:

"Why am I being arrested officer?"
"You don't have a rear light."
"But I do have a rear light. This gigantic license plate is blocking it."
*slips on plastic cuffs* "Get in the van!"
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Old 11-17-04, 02:03 PM
  #73  
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why don't we just give up and let them put exploding neck collars on all of us? we all know that's coming up next. that way if we get out of line, we can be taken care of quickly and efficiently. less paper work to fill out too. i think they look rather nice. something like this perhaps?:
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Old 11-17-04, 02:16 PM
  #74  
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I like that the light on the collar is red. It goes nicely with the red/white/black/silver color scheme of my bike and gear...
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Old 11-17-04, 02:24 PM
  #75  
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I heard about that bill through Adventure Cycling. Man, what the hell is going on these days? I wish I lived in New York just so I could have an adress and fax the powers that be. My step brother lives in New York, maybe I could send him the link and see if he'd be down for helping me out. Good luck fellow cyclists, these days it seems you'll need it.
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