Educating local cyclists of their faults
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Educating local cyclists of their faults
How does one bring up a few really bad habits that cyclists may have? I mentioned one instance where a driver was clipped by a cyclist who ran a stop sign and have been told to basically **** off. While as a cyclist I agree that many laws are stupid and not the safest for us on two wheels, but some are not. Sometimes cyclists do stupid things, sometimes they are not visible enough when riding against traffic (no lights at all), and sometimes it is better to mention something to people so they might not get hurt.
Is there a way to do so?
ETA: When I mentioned it I posted it on a local message board which I am most certain a few of the riders who are running stop signs frequent. The general consensus was that they didn't care.
Is there a way to do so?
ETA: When I mentioned it I posted it on a local message board which I am most certain a few of the riders who are running stop signs frequent. The general consensus was that they didn't care.
Last edited by orionz06; 11-20-11 at 11:30 PM.
#2
Senior Member
How does one bring up a few really bad habits that cyclists may have? I mentioned one instance where a driver was clipped by a cyclist who ran a stop sign and have been told to basically **** off. While as a cyclist I agree that many laws are stupid and not the safest for us on two wheels, but some are not. Sometimes cyclists do stupid things, sometimes they are not visible enough when riding against traffic (no lights at all), and sometimes it is better to mention something to people so they might not get hurt.
Is there a way to do so?
Is there a way to do so?
#3
Gone.
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 509
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
There is no percentage in giving unsolicited advice to strangers about their "faults".
Mind your own business and enjoy your ride. You'll be better off for it.
Mind your own business and enjoy your ride. You'll be better off for it.
Last edited by corvuscorvax; 11-12-11 at 01:38 PM.
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I guess you're right, they already clipped a car and cannot be that oblivious to their close calls as it is. I will just hope that they don't get hit or that I am not a witness.
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Chicago, the leafy NW side
Posts: 2,654
Bikes: 1974 Motobecane Grand Record, 1987 Miyata Pro, 1988 Bob Jackson Lady Mixte (wife's), others in the family
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 123 Post(s)
Liked 150 Times
in
74 Posts
Suggest you start by observing that their mothers wear army boots. That should get things off on the right foot.
__________________
I never think I have hit hard, unless it rebounds.
- Dr Samuel Johnson
I never think I have hit hard, unless it rebounds.
- Dr Samuel Johnson
#7
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,788
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
When the average person reaches a certain age (usually about 13), they decide who they will & won't listen to in life. If you're not in a recognized position of authority, even the best won't listen to your unsolicited advice.
Just give 'em a quick editorial ("Nice move, stupid..." is popular with me, both for drivers and riders), and roll on. But, yeah -- unless you mentally cocoon yourself, make sure the fists work.
Just give 'em a quick editorial ("Nice move, stupid..." is popular with me, both for drivers and riders), and roll on. But, yeah -- unless you mentally cocoon yourself, make sure the fists work.
#8
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
When the average person reaches a certain age (usually about 13), they decide who they will & won't listen to in life. If you're not in a recognized position of authority, even the best won't listen to your unsolicited advice.
Just give 'em a quick editorial ("Nice move, stupid..." is popular with me, both for drivers and riders), and roll on. But, yeah -- unless you mentally cocoon yourself, make sure the fists work.
Just give 'em a quick editorial ("Nice move, stupid..." is popular with me, both for drivers and riders), and roll on. But, yeah -- unless you mentally cocoon yourself, make sure the fists work.
It is unfortunate that this behavior, from cyclists, will eventually lead to someone getting hurt badly and then the cycling community erroneously blaming the driver. That is not to ignore that most issues come from the those riding in a cage.
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,951
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 13 Times
in
12 Posts
Pointing out something obvious or that is a matter of opinion will do no good. In the case of the cyclist running a stop sign, he was almost certainly aware that there was some risk involved and was of the opinion it was worth taking. Experience might modify his opinion, but you won't. Same thing goes for wearing protective gear etc. In some cases you might be able to educate somebody about something they weren't aware of, but opportunities to do that productively are rare.
#10
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Yeah. I wasn't thinking too rationally earlier. I was approached by multiple co-workers on the matter. Posted on the local message board but I might suggest that the co-workers report it to the city.
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 270
Bikes: '06 Titus mtb, 2004 Trek T2000 tandem, '88 Merckx 753, '18 Emonda, '91 Cannondale mtb, '19 Trance 29er
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Ha ha, I ride tandem a lot with my wife. I learned quickly not to say anything. There's just no "winning" there. I mean, I can get away with complaining about her driving a car well before I can get away with complaining of her biking.
Yet, she seemed to accept some pointers from the guy with good hair from the bike shop during a recent group-ride... even while on the back of our tandem. I don't even care... if she'll actually accept some pointers, I'll pay the young bike-shop-guy-with-good-hair to give her some useful pointers.
Yet, she seemed to accept some pointers from the guy with good hair from the bike shop during a recent group-ride... even while on the back of our tandem. I don't even care... if she'll actually accept some pointers, I'll pay the young bike-shop-guy-with-good-hair to give her some useful pointers.
#12
Single-serving poster
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 5,098
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
Point is, you're not in a position of authority and eventually your nitpicking out in the streets is gonna earn you a screwdriver(not the kind made of OJ) from somebody at the end of their rope.
#13
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
It might not be me getting the screwdriver, could be someone who just hit a new BMW with their fixxie who gets it.
#15
24-Speed Machine
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Wash. Grove, MD
Posts: 6,058
Bikes: 2003 Specialized Allez 24-Speed Road Bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
That kind of response only breeds hostility in the OP. Try something more positive.
Again, The OP asked an honest question. There is no need for a hostile answer. It is a matter of how the OP gives their advice.
Hmmm......
While said cyclist was aware of the risk s/he was taking, there is no problem in saying something to them.
I am proud of the OP for wanting to reach out to cyclists' who seem to care nothing about the responsibility involved in riding a bike.
Pointing out something obvious or that is a matter of opinion will do no good. In the case of the cyclist running a stop sign, he was almost certainly aware that there was some risk involved and was of the opinion it was worth taking. Experience might modify his opinion, but you won't. Same thing goes for wearing protective gear etc. In some cases you might be able to educate somebody about something they weren't aware of, but opportunities to do that productively are rare.
I am proud of the OP for wanting to reach out to cyclists' who seem to care nothing about the responsibility involved in riding a bike.
#16
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Thanks. FWIW the general response elsewhere was "you own a car, you are bad, we ignore the notion that we could actually be putting ourselves into harms way needlessly."
#17
Half way there
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 1,110
Bikes: 69 Hercules, 73 Raleigh Sports, 74 Raliegh Competition, 78 Nishiki Professional, 79 Nishiki International, 83 Colnago Super, 83 Viner Junior
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
I pondered about what I would do if another cyclist pointed out something that I was doing wrong. First, if they were way off base, say telling me that I should ride on the sidewalk or something like that (no - bad example, they would never catch up to me that way). Ok, say I encountered a salmon rider who started to lecture me about needing to ride facing traffic. I would probably be irritated because, first, this guy almost took me out riding the wrong way, and second because he implied that I was wrong. Well, I think I would get over the irritation and then direct him politely to the State DMV Driver's handbook that spells out rules for cycling. Then I would go about my way.
But say, instead, that I really did something wrong, and I knew it. If another rider saw and pointed it out, I think I would say something about not knowing where my head was, and thank him or her. I may be a bit embarrassed about being busted, but I'm ok with others trying to help me with my shortcomings.
The last permutation is that I did something wrong and did not realize it. I think I would appreciate another cyclist pointing it out as long as a good explanation of the whys and wherefores was provided. I like to learn from others and especially like to discuss the specifics.
I think it all boils down to not starting the conversation with "Hey, bonehead ..."
-G
But say, instead, that I really did something wrong, and I knew it. If another rider saw and pointed it out, I think I would say something about not knowing where my head was, and thank him or her. I may be a bit embarrassed about being busted, but I'm ok with others trying to help me with my shortcomings.
The last permutation is that I did something wrong and did not realize it. I think I would appreciate another cyclist pointing it out as long as a good explanation of the whys and wherefores was provided. I like to learn from others and especially like to discuss the specifics.
I think it all boils down to not starting the conversation with "Hey, bonehead ..."
-G
#18
Banned
I'd consider it a waste of my time, one inattentive motorist can communicate more info in an instant than a thousand words from me.
#20
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Pasadena CA
Posts: 74
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Orionz- Good on ya mate for pointing it out. That said...
The whole badge thing drives me straight up the wall! "You wouldn't be so tough if you didn't have that badge!"... Look bud he's got a stick, a gun, and a radio to call more guys and girls with sticks and guns to beat/shoot you so the badge is probably the *LEAST* and *LAST* thing you want to pointing out when it comes to "being tough"!
As to polite ways of handling it Orion... There really isn't one. But sometimes it just has to be said. Personally I will point out politely that an upcoming action being contemplated is not such a smart one but only once and usually very very politely. After that its on the guy/girl depriving a village somewhere of their idiot to either take it or do the stupid thing.
The whole badge thing drives me straight up the wall! "You wouldn't be so tough if you didn't have that badge!"... Look bud he's got a stick, a gun, and a radio to call more guys and girls with sticks and guns to beat/shoot you so the badge is probably the *LEAST* and *LAST* thing you want to pointing out when it comes to "being tough"!
As to polite ways of handling it Orion... There really isn't one. But sometimes it just has to be said. Personally I will point out politely that an upcoming action being contemplated is not such a smart one but only once and usually very very politely. After that its on the guy/girl depriving a village somewhere of their idiot to either take it or do the stupid thing.
#22
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
Posts: 9,352
Bikes: Specialized Hardrock Mountain (Stolen); Giant Seek 2 (Stolen); Diamondback Ascent mid 1980 - 1997
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
3 Posts
How does one bring up a few really bad habits that cyclists may have? I mentioned one instance where a driver was clipped by a cyclist who ran a stop sign and have been told to basically **** off. While as a cyclist I agree that many laws are stupid and not the safest for us on two wheels, but some are not. Sometimes cyclists do stupid things, sometimes they are not visible enough when riding against traffic (no lights at all), and sometimes it is better to mention something to people so they might not get hurt.
Is there a way to do so?
Is there a way to do so?
Such as not too long ago when I was coming home from the VA I encountered a cyclist who had a red blinkie mounted to the front of his bike. And pointed out that red goes in the back and white in the front. He thanked me and said that he only had the one light. About (I guess) two or so months before that I encountered a different cyclist on the newly widened sidewalk on 1st St. N. who had a white white light hanging from his backpack. I was able to easily catch up with him as we were both traveling in the same direction. I told him while he was at least trying, that he really needed the white light up front, and a red light in the rear. About a month ago I encountered another cyclist without lights. I told in a friendly manner that he needed lights and the cops could ticket him for not having them. He was surprised to learn that he could be ticketed for not having lights.
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 720
Bikes: 2012 Cinelli Mystic Rat, Nashbar CX
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
If you really want to express road etiquette to other cyclists, the best place to do that is within the community of cyclists. If you know of a LBS that is big on advocacy, then you can try to get the word out through those channels.
We have to change mentality by example, and outreach that convinces cyclists in general that bad behavior has a negative impact on us all. Make people change because they know that it is unpopular among their peers. Approaching group ride leaders is another way to get message out.
I do know that cops here will ticket cyclists for traffic violations. Probably more so than they would ticket someone in a vehicle.
I heard tell of a group ride recently here in Atlanta, where several people were ticketed for running stop signs.
We have to change mentality by example, and outreach that convinces cyclists in general that bad behavior has a negative impact on us all. Make people change because they know that it is unpopular among their peers. Approaching group ride leaders is another way to get message out.
I do know that cops here will ticket cyclists for traffic violations. Probably more so than they would ticket someone in a vehicle.
I heard tell of a group ride recently here in Atlanta, where several people were ticketed for running stop signs.
#25
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
What they fail to see is while I cannot tell every driver that they are doing ****ty things I can exercise the contact with a bulk of the local cyclists and perhaps make a small difference. Their attitude about that is quite depressing though.