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"Turn your ********** light off!"

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"Turn your ********** light off!"

Old 09-18-14, 01:51 PM
  #76  
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Originally Posted by wphamilton View Post
61-8-102 (9) Only a police vehicle or an authorized emergency vehicle may be equipped with the means to flash or alternate its headlamps or its backup lights.

Crazier things have happened in cyclist/motorist disputes - cyclist gets cited for something picky, motorist gets let off.
Yes could happen to a whiny/needy cyclist creating a drama scene at the police station over the so-called "threat" emanating from this street side conversation with a motorist.
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Old 09-18-14, 01:55 PM
  #77  
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Despite all the heat and noise, this seems to be pretty simple.

Being seen by motorists in poor light is critical to the safety of cyclists.

Lights that change in intensity or position are a lot easier to see than lights with similar power consumption that are constantly on.

Bright fast flashing lights are very irritating to most people including other cyclists.

Some bright rapidly flashing lights can trigger epileptic seizures in some people. (According to Photosensitivity and Seizures | Epilepsy Foundation "The frequency or speed of flashing light that is most likely to cause seizures varies from person to person. Generally, flashing lights most likely to trigger seizures are between the frequency of 5 to 30 flashes per second (Hertz)."

It is now easy and inexpensive to get tail lights which can modulate light position and intensity in an irregular pattern that is extremely easy to see. e.g. Amazon.com : Portland Design Works Danger Zone Tail Light : Bike Taillights : Sports & Outdoors This appears to enable cyclists to easily avoid the the high frequency pattern that is so troublesome without compromising their safety.

I assume that similar patterns are available for headlights but if not, the light I use http://www.amazon.com/Portland-Desig...ic+dreadnought appears to flash at about 2 hz which seems to be OK.
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Old 09-18-14, 02:08 PM
  #78  
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Speaking of blinky lights, I was out riding once and saw a cyclist going the other way. He had a light that did a very slow blink, It took a few seconds for a single blink - almost like a navigation buoy or lighthouse. Anyone have any recommendations of lights to get with that blink frequency?

As to visibility, there is a reason why navigation buoys, lighthouses, and emergency vehicles all have flashing lights - it gets attention! Personally, in twilight or dark, I would run a solid headlight, a solid backlight and a blinky backlight. In daytime, foggy, or overly cloudy conditions, I am strobing up front. I'm usually nice and put my hand over the light if stopped and directly behind someone. We don't have StVZO here, and those lights are expensive. If I didn't mind things that are expensive, I wouldn't mind the fuel pump as much as I do
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Old 09-18-14, 02:12 PM
  #79  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
Yes could happen to a whiny/needy cyclist creating a drama scene at the police station over the so-called "threat" emanating from this street side conversation with a motorist.
Could happen to any cyclist making a complaint if the police felt it was trivial. If the cyclist truly felt threatened, that the driver is going to follow through with the threat, then there isn't anything wrong with going to the police IMO. I wouldn't risk it though, if it was just a motorist losing it over something that I could technically be cited for.
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Old 09-18-14, 02:16 PM
  #80  
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Originally Posted by bmthom.gis View Post
Speaking of blinky lights, I was out riding once and saw a cyclist going the other way. He had a light that did a very slow blink, It took a few seconds for a single blink - almost like a navigation buoy or lighthouse. Anyone have any recommendations of lights to get with that blink frequency?
None. Last Winter I saw this guy lit up like a UFO. Honestly it was paranormal almost. Once my eyes adjusted, it was just a freindly waving commuter.

But this begs the question: How much is too much when it comes to lights?
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Old 09-18-14, 02:28 PM
  #81  
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Originally Posted by Motolegs View Post

But this begs the question: How much is too much when it comes to lights?
When it interferes with the ability of others to observe their environment effectively, or distract them from other potential hazards to themselves or others.

The how is more important than the what.
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Old 09-18-14, 02:36 PM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by gregjones View Post
All I ever get is compliments from people when at the stores.
I get either compliments or inquiries as to where I got my lights or what lights I'm using. With the occasional person mentioning how they wish other bicyclists were as easy to see.
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Old 09-18-14, 02:52 PM
  #83  
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There's absolutely no reason for a flashing light above 200 lumens (peak lumens). You blind the drivers who are closest to you. Flashes are very good at getting noticed but they make judging distance challenging. This is especially true for lights with a narrow beam pattern that have an insane hot-spot.

The reason flashers more noticable is that your peripheral vision is designed to detect motion, so the flash shows up as motion.

Light and Motion has a mode that's closer to a sine wave output. So rather that a sharp flash, you get a smoother variation. It helps reduce blinding while providing some modulation to help your eyes notice it.

As for the brighter is better, once you get beyond a certain brightness its not making you safer. It makes little difference if you can be seen from 2 mi away vs 1/4 mi, you're just generating road rage. You want to be visible enough that drivers have plenty of reaction time. At 60 mph, a 1/4 mi visibility is 15 sec, that's plenty. In most circumstances, sight lines will be significantly less than 1/4 mi.

Not long ago, it was simply impossible to have a bike light that would be remotely comparable to car headlight. Modern LED lights will have hotspots that can significantly exceed car lights (due to shaped beams). Cars have headlights and it doesn't stop them from colliding. You don't see the safety people advocating that cars should always drive around with their high beams on. A super bright light in blink mode is no different than driving around flashing your brights at everyone. Sure, you're more visible, but you're also an anti-social <insert censored word>.
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Old 09-18-14, 02:57 PM
  #84  
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Only about 3 percent of people who have epilepsy have any photoelectric triggers. The commonist frequently is 16 to 25 htz.
Its often presumed that it affects all epiletic suffers.
I doubt there has been a single trigger comfired as being caused by a bike light in this manner. Its too dim and the wrong frequency.
But its a laudable concern.
Just expressed badly.
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Old 09-18-14, 03:04 PM
  #85  
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This is an interesting thread. I always thought that cyclists who used flashing lights didn't realize that they were annoying other people. I'm surprised to learn that you just don't care.
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Old 09-18-14, 03:11 PM
  #86  
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As others have said, I have from time to time been complimented on my lights. I've had people ask me where to get a light like I have.

Never has anyone before today told me I annoyed them or distracted them or caused them a seizure.

My objective is to not get killed on my bicycle. I have no interest in causing problems for anyone else.

Some of the reasonable posters have led me to believe I should look at a second, lower lumen light for using as a flash. If I get one and still get yelled at, I'll let you know.
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Old 09-18-14, 03:22 PM
  #87  
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Originally Posted by scroca View Post
(6) Every bicycle is encouraged to be equipped with a flag clearly visible from the rear and suspended not less than 6 feet above the roadway when the bicycle is standing upright. The flag shall be fluorescent orange in color.
I assume bicyclists in your state need more encouragement.
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Old 09-18-14, 03:44 PM
  #88  
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I try to use Nite-Ize TwistLit LED flashing lights. They don't blind the drivers, pedestrians, or other bikers. I use a bike light or flashlight strapped to my handlebars aimed down in front of my bike to see - and I never have it flash (too annoying to others). I do want to be seen, and I want to see, but I don't want to be a nuisance about it.
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Old 09-18-14, 03:48 PM
  #89  
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Originally Posted by bmthom.gis View Post
Speaking of blinky lights, I was out riding once and saw a cyclist going the other way. He had a light that did a very slow blink, It took a few seconds for a single blink - almost like a navigation buoy or lighthouse. Anyone have any recommendations of lights to get with that blink frequency?

As to visibility, there is a reason why navigation buoys, lighthouses, and emergency vehicles all have flashing lights - it gets attention! Personally, in twilight or dark, I would run a solid headlight, a solid backlight and a blinky backlight. In daytime, foggy, or overly cloudy conditions, I am strobing up front. I'm usually nice and put my hand over the light if stopped and directly behind someone. We don't have StVZO here, and those lights are expensive. If I didn't mind things that are expensive, I wouldn't mind the fuel pump as much as I do


Busch & Müller Ixon IQ = $60.00

Busch & Müller Ixon Core= $96.00
Not more than some of the lights mentioned in this thread!
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Old 09-18-14, 04:00 PM
  #90  
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Originally Posted by scroca View Post
...... Now that I am at work, I looked up the flashing light/seizure thing on Wikipedia and find that there is something called Photosensitive epilepsy (PSE), which is a form of epilepsy in which seizures are triggered by visual stimuli that form patterns in time or space, such as flashing lights, bold, regular patterns, or regular moving patterns.

Sorry if you have PSE but I'm still using my flashing light.
Well it's nice to know where your priorities are at. But think about it for a minute. If you trigger a seizure with an on coming motorist... does that make YOU safer? The strobes may be a hazard. The bad thing is that the general public are such sheeple they won't act rationally unless rational behavior is enforced by law.
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Old 09-18-14, 04:20 PM
  #91  
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Originally Posted by Bike Hermit View Post


Busch & Müller Ixon IQ = $60.00

Busch & Müller Ixon Core= $96.00
Not more than some of the lights mentioned in this thread!
Thanks! That is actually very reasonable. The ones i looked at must have been dynamo.
My front light isn't super bright, and the flash on it sucks (way too fast). I'm looking for replacements, and will look for one with a slow flash (those have to be less annoying while still getting the job done) and another good one for the dark winter months. I might have to look at one of those. Now to see if my shop can order them (i refuse to pay full price!)
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Old 09-18-14, 04:21 PM
  #92  
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Originally Posted by gsa103 View Post
Not long ago, it was simply impossible to have a bike light that would be remotely comparable to car headlight. Modern LED lights will have hotspots that can significantly exceed car lights (due to shaped beams). Cars have headlights and it doesn't stop them from colliding. You don't see the safety people advocating that cars should always drive around with their high beams on. A super bright light in blink mode is no different than driving around flashing your brights at everyone. Sure, you're more visible, but you're also an anti-social <insert censored word>.
+1
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Old 09-18-14, 04:22 PM
  #93  
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^i should say i am looking to replace i because i dont like it, not due to feeling i need something ridiculously bright. Something reasonable. I still believe in lights that blink, but am open to carrying more than 1
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Old 09-18-14, 04:27 PM
  #94  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
For intentionally being an obnoxious jerk (or exceptionally dimwitted) when interacting with other users of streets?
Since when is that illegal? Have you been to a DMV lately?
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Old 09-18-14, 04:27 PM
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She proceeded to tell me that my "strobe" light was distracting and that it could trigger an epileptic seizure...Obviously I got her attention with my flashing light. Mission accomplished.
There you go.

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Old 09-18-14, 05:16 PM
  #96  
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Please keep things civil.
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Old 09-18-14, 05:39 PM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by wphamilton View Post
Could happen to any cyclist making a complaint if the police felt it was trivial. If the cyclist truly felt threatened, that the driver is going to follow through with the threat, then there isn't anything wrong with going to the police IMO. I wouldn't risk it though, if it was just a motorist losing it over something that I could technically be cited for.
Sound about right to me.
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Old 09-18-14, 05:41 PM
  #98  
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Originally Posted by Bike Hermit View Post


Busch & Müller Ixon IQ = $60.00

Busch & Müller Ixon Core= $96.00
Not more than some of the lights mentioned in this thread!
My Ixon IQ Premium was like $104 including shipping. It's definitely in the same league as car headlights. The trick is to buy directly from German retailers. Even with air shipping halfway around the world it's a lot cheaper than what you can find here.

Here's where I got mine. Took a week to ship to California. Their website is kinda confusing. http://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/i...ium-led-139357

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Old 09-18-14, 05:42 PM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by kingston View Post
This is an interesting thread. I always thought that cyclists who used flashing lights didn't realize that they were annoying other people. I'm surprised to learn that you just don't care.
I'm not surprised, but I've been reading BF posts on this list and A&S for quite awhile.
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Old 09-18-14, 05:48 PM
  #100  
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Originally Posted by scroca View Post

My objective is to not get killed on my bicycle. I have no interest in causing problems for anyone else.

Some of the reasonable posters have led me to believe I should look at a second, lower lumen light for using as a flash. If I get one and still get yelled at, I'll let you know.
I use a flashing tail light on my commuter, but don't use a flasher up front, preferring a steady light. From my personal observations, the fact that a light is flashing is what attracts attention, not its intensity, no need to overwhelm others.
I realize some people "don't care" but it only takes a little effort to have effective lighting without any negative impact on others.

I think its commendable you're taking the time to give it some though.
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