"Turn your ********** light off!"
09-20-14, 06:31 AM
#201
commuter and barbarian
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Potomac, MT, USA
Posts: 2,494
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I think Kanye West said it best:
As you recall, you know I love to show off
But you never thought that I would take it this far
What do you know? Flashing lights, lights
What do you know? Flashing lights, lights
Flashing lights, lights
Flashing lights, lights
Lights, lights, lights, lights...
As you recall, you know I love to show off
But you never thought that I would take it this far
What do you know? Flashing lights, lights
What do you know? Flashing lights, lights
Flashing lights, lights
Flashing lights, lights
Lights, lights, lights, lights...
09-20-14, 06:33 AM
#202
commuter and barbarian
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Potomac, MT, USA
Posts: 2,494
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
09-20-14, 08:24 AM
#203
Señior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 13,749
Bikes: Windsor Fens, Giant Seek 0 (2014, Alfine 8 + discs)
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times
in
7 Posts
It may not seem as bright as one of the 700+ lumen flashlights everyone seems to have, but it will be perfectly adequate, and you will have the peace and tranquility that comes with knowing that you are not annoying the rest of the world around you with an obnoxious headlight.
__________________
Work: the 8 hours that separates bike rides.
Work: the 8 hours that separates bike rides.
09-20-14, 09:04 AM
#204
Unlisted member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 6,193
Bikes: Specialized Hardrock
Mentioned: 29 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1376 Post(s)
Liked 432 Times
in
297 Posts
09-20-14, 09:13 AM
#205
Jedi Master
My daughter had childhood absence epilepsy when she was younger and flashing lights could and did trigger seizures. She got in the habit of closing her eyes whenever there were flashing lights around, including police lights etc. Thankfully she has grown out of it like most kids with the condition do.
09-20-14, 09:28 AM
#206
Jedi Master
Funny thing happened to me this morning. I left the house this morning at about 4:30 to go for a longish leisurely Saturday morning ride on a mix of residential streets, highways, paved paths, gravel paths, etc. I had my Ixon IQ mounted to the fork crown, which for the reasons that have already been mentioned, I consider to be just about the least offensive headlight one can use. Sunrise was officially 6:36 today. Around 6:45 I passed an older gentleman going the other way on the bike path, I would guess in his 70’s, out for an early morning ride. He was wearing those huge sunglasses that go over your regular glasses, you know the ones I’m talking about. Remember, this is 6:45, sunrise was less than 10 minutes ago. As the guy rides past, he stretches out his arm with his palm out to my headlight, grimaced and groaned as though the light from a thousand suns were being focused directly into his cornea. With my keen powers of observation, I deduced that he was annoyed by my headlight, so I promptly reached down and switched it off. Something I will remember to do 10 minutes earlier next time.
09-20-14, 02:17 PM
#207
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: D'uh... I am a Cutter
Posts: 6,159
Bikes: '17 Access Old Turnpike Gravel bike, '14 Trek 1.1, '13 Cannondale CAAD 10, '98 CAD 2, R300
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1571 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times
in
9 Posts
I think Kanye West said it best:
As you recall, you know I love to show off
But you never thought that I would take it this far
What do you know? Flashing lights, lights
What do you know? Flashing lights, lights
Flashing lights, lights
Flashing lights, lights
Lights, lights, lights, lights...
As you recall, you know I love to show off
But you never thought that I would take it this far
What do you know? Flashing lights, lights
What do you know? Flashing lights, lights
Flashing lights, lights
Flashing lights, lights
Lights, lights, lights, lights...
Last edited by Dave Cutter; 09-20-14 at 02:23 PM.
09-20-14, 02:22 PM
#208
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: SW Michigan
Posts: 30
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
First, I'd like to point out that a bike headlight with a 1-1 1/2" reflector can be much more uncomfortable to oncoming traffic than car headlights putting out four or five times as much light from two 5 x 7" reflectors.
Second, there are probably a lot more drivers with pse than you might think. Just because a person has been seizure free long enough to get a licence doesn't mean that they are home free as far as seizures are concerned. Many have, like kingston's daughter, learned to avoid their triggers. For instance, if there is an emergency vehicle, IMMEDIATELY look at the curb and pull over. Many of those feel they are not a danger to others even though the chance of a seizure is not zero because the law was written with those in mind who lose consciousness like turning off a light switch but many can tell when they are going to have a seizure with more than enough time to get off the road and call someone. In that case if the worst should happen only they are in danger.
I'm not sure we can have lights that grab attention and not at the same time be a danger to those people. I suspect all the things designed to reach into our brains and grab our attention are just the things that trigger seizures. In my late teens when it was at its worst even hi-viz colors would do it. We can get glasses to mute the most offensive colors but what can we do about flashing lights but hope people will only use them when absolutely necessary. It's a question of how much are we willing to put ourselves out to accommodate a small minority's use of the street vs. our right to look out for ourselves. Does that sound familiar?
Second, there are probably a lot more drivers with pse than you might think. Just because a person has been seizure free long enough to get a licence doesn't mean that they are home free as far as seizures are concerned. Many have, like kingston's daughter, learned to avoid their triggers. For instance, if there is an emergency vehicle, IMMEDIATELY look at the curb and pull over. Many of those feel they are not a danger to others even though the chance of a seizure is not zero because the law was written with those in mind who lose consciousness like turning off a light switch but many can tell when they are going to have a seizure with more than enough time to get off the road and call someone. In that case if the worst should happen only they are in danger.
I'm not sure we can have lights that grab attention and not at the same time be a danger to those people. I suspect all the things designed to reach into our brains and grab our attention are just the things that trigger seizures. In my late teens when it was at its worst even hi-viz colors would do it. We can get glasses to mute the most offensive colors but what can we do about flashing lights but hope people will only use them when absolutely necessary. It's a question of how much are we willing to put ourselves out to accommodate a small minority's use of the street vs. our right to look out for ourselves. Does that sound familiar?
Last edited by dwbstr; 09-20-14 at 06:22 PM.
09-20-14, 02:55 PM
#210
Galveston County Texas
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: In The Wind
Posts: 33,150
Bikes: 02 GTO, 2011 Magnum
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1329 Post(s)
Liked 1,198 Times
in
596 Posts
If you aren't trolling, that is unnecessary overkill that is painful to everyone except you. I'd bet virtually everyone you encountered would have complained if given the opportunity or asked.My light usage has evolved over the past four years quite a bit. At first, when I first got back into commuting (after a several year hiatus) I never encountered another cyclist that had too bright of a light, so when we'd have these threads here I'd be agreeing with the people that said "the brighter the better", and "aim them right at the drivers", because the brightest lights that most people could afford weren't too bright. In the past few years though, there has been a massive proliferation of not only very expensive bright lights, but also inexpensive bright lights and it seems like a very high percentage of cyclists are riding around with light that go beyond rude and painful to other cyclists and pedestrians, but also dangerous to everyone because they are blinding drivers (as well as everyone else).Do everyone a favor and have a medium powered blinking light.I can almost understand all the road rage car drivers have when I too am constantly blinded by people who had to spend the most money on the most lumens and are rolling down even the MUP with one or more high powered lights on flashing.My array;forward facing lights:* Weak-ish/medium powered white light flashing (Cateye Reflex) mounted in front of my head tube* Powerful (Cree T6) flashlight mounted on the handlebars. Set to steady on, except for when I get frustrated by people with too bright lights on the MUP and I turn it on flashing for them, and then turn it back off after they pass. Aimed at the ground about 25 feet in front of me, and off when I'm on the MUP* helmet mounted .5 watt white light, set to steady.rearward mounted lights:* Mars 4.0 set to solid on, mounted my saddlebag * Helmet mounted PB 3-H set to flashing. Goldilocks on this one, not too bright, not too weak. * Seatstay mounted flashing light. Right now this is a PB Super Flash, but I think that is too aggressive, and I'm looking for something not quite so bright/spastic. Unfortunately the Super Flashes solid mode seems very directional and not very good outside of that very narrow band, so it's not good as a solid-on light either. This one will be going to the swap meet with me next time. I've mounted quite it low on the seat stay to try and mitigate how bright this one is. Hopefully it's only bright when someone is pretty far away and as they get close they are off-axis and it isn't affecting them. I actually just added this light and may just pull it off, as I fear it is too much. I want a second fixed (not helmet mounted) rear light, but haven't decided on which one yet...With a medium or even weak-ish flashing light, I feel like I still get the benefit of catching people's attention, but since I have a brighter solid light as well, I figure vehicles will still be able to judge my distance. Voila'! Best of both worlds people..
Any idea how fast these riders are moving?
Thanks
__________________
Fred "The Real Fred"
Fred "The Real Fred"
09-20-14, 03:52 PM
#212
Banned
Most electronics are world-wide (100-240V) but I don't have experience with battery-powered B&M stuff, never seen it IRL as it kind of defeats the purpose.
09-20-14, 04:04 PM
#213
Jedi Master
I'm not sure what you're talking about acidfast7, but I own the light, and the charger, and the adapter, so I see it working in real life every day. You can also take the batteries out and put them in a normal battery charger as you indicated. Maybe you're confused because Bike Hermit said converter when what he meant was adapter.
09-20-14, 04:51 PM
#214
Banned
I'm not sure what you're talking about acidfast7, but I own the light, and the charger, and the adapter, so I see it working in real life every day. You can also take the batteries out and put them in a normal battery charger as you indicated. Maybe you're confused because Bike Hermit said converter when what he meant was adapter.
09-20-14, 05:45 PM
#216
Jedi Master
I suppose you're right, but good luck convincing Americans to spend close to $1,000 on a dynamo lighting set-up when they can get a lumina 700 for about $100. We're having a hard enough time trying to convince people to get a light with a proper cutoff and you can get those for $60.
09-20-14, 05:51 PM
#217
Banned
I suppose you're right, but good luck convincing Americans to spend close to $1,000 on a dynamo lighting set-up when they can get a lumina 700 for about $100. We're having a hard enough time trying to convince people to get a light with a proper cutoff and you can get those for $60.
09-20-14, 07:58 PM
#219
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 121
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
She proceeded to tell me that my "strobe" light was distracting and that it could trigger an epileptic seizure. My light flashes, it's not a strobe, but that's neither hear nor there and wasn't worth bringing up. I think the seizure thing is an old wives tale, and discounted that. Obviously I got her attention with my flashing light. Mission accomplished.----------------------------------------------------------
------------Now that I am at work, I looked up the flashing light/seizure thing on Wikipedia and find that there is something called Photosensitive epilepsy (PSE), which is a form of epilepsy in which seizures are triggered by visual stimuli that form patterns in time or space, such as flashing lights, bold, regular patterns, or regular moving patterns.
.
road was in good condition.He was in perfect health and not known as a fast driver or one who took risks behind the wheel.An investigation failed to find any reason he should have crashed his car and it was deemed an accident without any provable cause.
Ten or so years later another person was killed on the same road with the same basic conditions and the investigation could not pinpoint any possilbe cause for the accident. Years after someone who was investigating the second accident noticed the date and time of day was the same for both accidents.A little experiment showed that a car driving down that stretch of road at the same day of year and at the same time of day when the sun was just above the horizon caused rapid flashs through the trees .Although not fully provable it was deemed possible both people were both prone to such seizure but didn't know it.
So if anything that flashes is a threat to someone on the road now, I guess we'll have to outlaw turn signals,police and ambulance lights,flashing lights on road construction,the red warning lights at rail crossings,and my god think how many folks are going to have seizures because the local T&A bar has a flashing sign on it's roof.(I know I do everytime I pass it,but at my age I have a excuse)
I somehow don't think useing a flashing light or a strobe on a bike, is going to endanger anyone ,piss them off maybe but as the OP says "it's there to get attention"
09-21-14, 05:49 AM
#220
Senior Member
Just to add abit of odd ball info and stir the pot,there is a story about in the late 1920's of business man in France who was killed in the late afternoon on a narrow stretch of road when he crashed into a tree. He drove the same road twice every work day for almost 15 years.It was a country lane Lined with trees on both sides and completely straight as a arrow.The weather was dry and the
road was in good condition.He was in perfect health and not known as a fast driver or one who took risks behind the wheel.An investigation failed to find any reason he should have crashed his car and it was deemed an accident without any provable cause.
Ten or so years later another person was killed on the same road with the same basic conditions and the investigation could not pinpoint any possilbe cause for the accident. Years after someone who was investigating the second accident noticed the date and time of day was the same for both accidents.A little experiment showed that a car driving down that stretch of road at the same day of year and at the same time of day when the sun was just above the horizon caused rapid flashs through the trees .Although not fully provable it was deemed possible both people were both prone to such seizure but didn't know it.
So if anything that flashes is a threat to someone on the road now, I guess we'll have to outlaw turn signals,police and ambulance lights,flashing lights on road construction,the red warning lights at rail crossings,and my god think how many folks are going to have seizures because the local T&A bar has a flashing sign on it's roof.(I know I do everytime I pass it,but at my age I have a excuse)
I somehow don't think useing a flashing light or a strobe on a bike, is going to endanger anyone ,piss them off maybe but as the OP says "it's there to get attention"
road was in good condition.He was in perfect health and not known as a fast driver or one who took risks behind the wheel.An investigation failed to find any reason he should have crashed his car and it was deemed an accident without any provable cause.
Ten or so years later another person was killed on the same road with the same basic conditions and the investigation could not pinpoint any possilbe cause for the accident. Years after someone who was investigating the second accident noticed the date and time of day was the same for both accidents.A little experiment showed that a car driving down that stretch of road at the same day of year and at the same time of day when the sun was just above the horizon caused rapid flashs through the trees .Although not fully provable it was deemed possible both people were both prone to such seizure but didn't know it.
So if anything that flashes is a threat to someone on the road now, I guess we'll have to outlaw turn signals,police and ambulance lights,flashing lights on road construction,the red warning lights at rail crossings,and my god think how many folks are going to have seizures because the local T&A bar has a flashing sign on it's roof.(I know I do everytime I pass it,but at my age I have a excuse)
I somehow don't think useing a flashing light or a strobe on a bike, is going to endanger anyone ,piss them off maybe but as the OP says "it's there to get attention"
09-21-14, 08:53 AM
#221
Jedi Master
I was out for a ride this morning and saw probably 20 cyclists, maybe more, with blinking headlights well after sunrise on both bike paths and on the road. It got me to thinking about what it is exactly that the blinking lights are trying to prevent. As people in this thread have commented, they want to be seen by oncoming cars. OK, but I can also see the oncoming cars, they have headlights. The idea of a car crossing over into my lane of traffic and crashing into me head-on without me being able to get out of the way seems utterly preposterous to me. I just can’t imagine it ever happening. Then I started thinking about my own experiences with crashing into cars. As far as I can remember, I have had four collisions with automobiles over the years, which I expect is above average. Every single one happened in daylight, at an intersection, when I was in my 20’s commuting in Chicago on a track bike. Every single one could have been avoided if I wasn’t riding like a jackass in my 20’s on a track bike in Chicago. Anecdotal I know. Just something to think about.
09-21-14, 09:02 AM
#222
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 6,432
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 539 Post(s)
Liked 43 Times
in
37 Posts
Just to add abit of odd ball info and stir the pot,there is a story about in the late 1920's of business man in France who was killed in the late afternoon on a narrow stretch of road when he crashed into a tree. He drove the same road twice every work day for almost 15 years.It was a country lane Lined with trees on both sides and completely straight as a arrow.The weather was dry and the
road was in good condition.He was in perfect health and not known as a fast driver or one who took risks behind the wheel.An investigation failed to find any reason he should have crashed his car and it was deemed an accident without any provable cause.
Ten or so years later another person was killed on the same road with the same basic conditions and the investigation could not pinpoint any possilbe cause for the accident. Years after someone who was investigating the second accident noticed the date and time of day was the same for both accidents.A little experiment showed that a car driving down that stretch of road at the same day of year and at the same time of day when the sun was just above the horizon caused rapid flashs through the trees .Although not fully provable it was deemed possible both people were both prone to such seizure but didn't know it.
So if anything that flashes is a threat to someone on the road now, I guess we'll have to outlaw turn signals,police and ambulance lights,flashing lights on road construction,the red warning lights at rail crossings,and my god think how many folks are going to have seizures because the local T&A bar has a flashing sign on it's roof.(I know I do everytime I pass it,but at my age I have a excuse)
I somehow don't think useing a flashing light or a strobe on a bike, is going to endanger anyone ,piss them off maybe but as the OP says "it's there to get attention"
road was in good condition.He was in perfect health and not known as a fast driver or one who took risks behind the wheel.An investigation failed to find any reason he should have crashed his car and it was deemed an accident without any provable cause.
Ten or so years later another person was killed on the same road with the same basic conditions and the investigation could not pinpoint any possilbe cause for the accident. Years after someone who was investigating the second accident noticed the date and time of day was the same for both accidents.A little experiment showed that a car driving down that stretch of road at the same day of year and at the same time of day when the sun was just above the horizon caused rapid flashs through the trees .Although not fully provable it was deemed possible both people were both prone to such seizure but didn't know it.
So if anything that flashes is a threat to someone on the road now, I guess we'll have to outlaw turn signals,police and ambulance lights,flashing lights on road construction,the red warning lights at rail crossings,and my god think how many folks are going to have seizures because the local T&A bar has a flashing sign on it's roof.(I know I do everytime I pass it,but at my age I have a excuse)
I somehow don't think useing a flashing light or a strobe on a bike, is going to endanger anyone ,piss them off maybe but as the OP says "it's there to get attention"
Uh...ok.
09-21-14, 10:00 AM
#223
commuter and barbarian
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Potomac, MT, USA
Posts: 2,494
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
... what it is exactly that the blinking lights are trying to prevent. As people in this thread have commented, they want to be seen by oncoming cars. OK, but I can also see the oncoming cars, they have headlights. The idea of a car crossing over into my lane of traffic and crashing into me head-on without me being able to get out of the way seems utterly preposterous to me. I just can’t imagine it ever happening...
Also, cars have 2 headlights, they are a lot bigger, and they are what all the other drivers are looking for. Not enough drivers are looking for us and we are much smaller than most motorized vehicles, thus harder to see.
09-21-14, 10:07 AM
#224
Jedi Master
What about cars pulling out from a side street in front of you, or left hooks?
Also, cars have 2 headlights, they are a lot bigger, and they are what all the other drivers are looking for. Not enough drivers are looking for us and we are much smaller than most motorized vehicles, thus harder to see.
Also, cars have 2 headlights, they are a lot bigger, and they are what all the other drivers are looking for. Not enough drivers are looking for us and we are much smaller than most motorized vehicles, thus harder to see.
09-21-14, 10:42 AM
#225
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Kent Wa.
Posts: 5,332
Bikes: 2005 Gazelle Golfo, 1935 Raleigh Sport, 1970 Robin Hood sport, 1974 Schwinn Continental, 1984 Ross MTB/porteur, 2013 Flying Piegon path racer, 2014 Gazelle Toer Populair T8
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 396 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times
in
7 Posts
There is no guarantee everyone will see us no matter how bright and obnoxious our lights are, and most importantly, we have no way to be sure who sees us and who doesn't.
Appropriate lighting and contrasting colors help communicate our presence to others who are being reasonably attentive, but it won't compensate for a lack of skill, confidence, attention, or judgment.
Appropriate lighting and contrasting colors help communicate our presence to others who are being reasonably attentive, but it won't compensate for a lack of skill, confidence, attention, or judgment.
