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Fault: Pedestrian or Cyclist or both?

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Fault: Pedestrian or Cyclist or both?

Old 10-07-14, 12:06 AM
  #1  
keyven
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Fault: Pedestrian or Cyclist or both?

Cyclist's camera captures moment pedestrian sends him flying over handlebars* | Daily Mail Online

In my mind both are at fault, but the cyclist a little more. He was simply reckless - if not a pedestrian, perhaps a door opening. Or car/motorcycle changing lane. He was arguably one of the most vulnerable road-users in a crowded roadway yet did not act like such.

He was lucky it was 'just' a pedestrian.
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Old 10-07-14, 12:34 AM
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Give me a break. He was engaging in standard lane splitting. The pedestrian was illegally crossing mid-block.

Also, cyclists aren't terribly vulnerable when the multi-ton vehicles are at a stand-still. That velocity portion of momentum transfer does have meaning.

Just because he wasn't cowering in the gutter or sitting in line breathing deeply of the toxic fumes of the folks who were creating the congestion does not make him aggressive or at fault when someone jay-walks.
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Old 10-07-14, 01:13 AM
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Going a little fast for the conditions, but I split lanes like that often. The vehicles aren't moving and its safer to be in front of them.
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Old 10-07-14, 01:15 AM
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Ped had it comin
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Old 10-07-14, 02:28 AM
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Originally Posted by B. Carfree View Post
Give me a break. He was engaging in standard lane splitting. The pedestrian was illegally crossing mid-block.

Also, cyclists aren't terribly vulnerable when the multi-ton vehicles are at a stand-still. That velocity portion of momentum transfer does have meaning.

Just because he wasn't cowering in the gutter or sitting in line breathing deeply of the toxic fumes of the folks who were creating the congestion does not make him aggressive or at fault when someone jay-walks.
There was no need to be doing the speed he was on.

Your argument that he needed to be 'cowering' is facetious. Going slower does not make him a coward in any sense.
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Old 10-07-14, 02:36 AM
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Originally Posted by keyven View Post
There was no need to be doing the speed he was on.
What does speed have to do with a pedestrian appearing from a blind spot in the middle of the street? The article states that the indicident happened in Chile where there were no available bike lanes or other cycling specific infrastructure for him to ride on, so the "crowded roadway" arguement is bogus since he had nowhere else to go.
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Old 10-07-14, 03:29 AM
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Cyclists are exactly like car people in that they are always looking for a reason to say it's not their fault when they hit someone.
Riding like a jackass--way faster than all surrounding traffic-- through a hi-density urban environment is not smart. To NOT expect a ped to appear is a common sense issue that had painful consequences.
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Old 10-07-14, 04:24 AM
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Sorry, I can't agree with the view that the cyclist is blameless. The pedestrian obviously shouldn't have crossed in front of the bus but any cycling or motorcycling course I've been on has stressed the need for hazard awareness and adjusting your riding or driving accordingly.

If you are splitting lanes (filtering we call it over here) then you have to be prepared for the hazards- a car allowing another across it's path, a pedestrian crossing between stationary traffic, opening doors, even other bikes.

It's not a blind spot. He can see a stationary bus so should be looking for feet under the front and anticipating that someone could step round it. That means covering the brakes and feathering the speed. Oh, and in case you are wondering what my experience is, I have commuted for years in Edinburgh and London, where peds can present a bit of a hazard.

You chould also note the tone of the article. The Daily Mail is NOT a reliable unbiased journal, it tends to be reactionary and right wing. Hates cyclists, particularly if they also happen to be immigrants on benefits!!
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Old 10-07-14, 05:35 AM
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It was avoidable through proper risk management on the part of the cyclist. If assigning fault is important, both the pedestrian and the rider share the blame.
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Old 10-07-14, 06:14 AM
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If you want to watch the complete clip. (Hardly viral btw.)

"I used to ride my bike in the city like an a...." Can't say I disagree.

(And FWIW, there are bikelanes and even cycle tracks in Santiago. He even rides in some of them - like an a.... Even when he rides with critical mass, he rides like an a....)


But if you don't ride through the canyon of death like this you're a gutter bunny? IDNKT.


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Old 10-07-14, 06:50 AM
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I'll split lanes but that bus passage is nuts. Not doing it!
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Old 10-07-14, 07:01 AM
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hard to say. no laws means the walkers weren't "wrong". But that passing the large object that makes for a blind spot without slowing, that's on him.

I think both parties will change their strategies. Glad it wasn't worse for either.

Last edited by intransit1217; 10-07-14 at 07:02 AM. Reason: added a line
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Old 10-07-14, 07:17 AM
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Cyclist fault. First reason, he had enough time to avoid the pedestrian, if he was skilled enough to ride that speed in those conditions. Second reason, you don't buzz close to something like that bus when pedestrians are possible. Bad judgement.

Both reasons go for the pedestrian also. She was also at fault.
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Old 10-07-14, 07:27 AM
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We have no way of ever knowing, but I will go all VC radical here and conjecture that there is a whole corner full of people who now have a very negative opinion of bike riders. They will go tell the people they work with what they saw . . .
Now you can understand why hatred of us is so broad. Now add radical "F-u, we are right" antagonism into that equation, and here we are.
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Old 10-07-14, 07:32 AM
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Cyclist was overtaking without a clear line of sight, clearly going too fast for conditions -- the emerging threat happened to be a pedestrian, but he really had no clue what might suddenly appear between any of the vehicles he was passing, especially when passing what appears to be the passenger door of a transit bus to his immediate left, just before the impact.

Pedestrian was also negligent, but was crossing through stopped traffic where nobody could legally hit her, she clearly wasn't expecting any vehicles snaking through stopped traffic at high speed.
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Old 10-07-14, 07:43 AM
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It is clear he is some sort of daredevil the way he is cutting through and around cars, buses, peds. He is an idiot.
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Old 10-07-14, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by modelmartin View Post
It is clear he is some sort of daredevil the way he is cutting through and around cars, buses, peds. He is an idiot.
He clearly assesses risk and responsibility differently than you. I don't think that makes either him you to be an idiot.
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Old 10-07-14, 08:12 AM
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Cyclist is definitely at fault, going too fast for the traffic conditions he was in, and I always expecting someone to step out around the front of a stopped vehicle.
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Old 10-07-14, 08:19 AM
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Riding at speed through congested urban conditions like that is thoughtless and irresponsible as it clearly leaves no margin for error.

A "coward" is someone who behaves in a selfish manner that exposes others to increased risk, We don't have sole determination as to how we may assess what's appropriate risk.
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Old 10-07-14, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Looigi View Post
He clearly assesses risk and responsibility differently than you. I don't think that makes either him you to be an idiot.
I disagree. The way he was tearing around and riding through peds in the crosswalk. His riding style is reckless, discourteous, and dangerous for himself and others. He gives cyclists a bad name. Assessing risk and responsibility differently? Hah!
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Old 10-07-14, 09:38 AM
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Wide angle lens stretches perspective and makes it look like he's going faster than he actually is. But still, both needed to approach the blind corner with caution.
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Old 10-07-14, 10:26 AM
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Cyclist has probably seen any pedestrians crossing through stopped traffic like that before. He should have anticipated it here instead of riding like a self-absorbed idiot.
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Old 10-07-14, 10:38 AM
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100% the fault of the cyclist. Slow the F down!
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Old 10-07-14, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by neg View Post
Wide angle lens stretches perspective and makes it look like he's going faster than he actually is. .
This. All the people saying his 10 mph (or less) was too fast need to go out and buy a camera and take a few riding videos. If he went any slower he'd be walking.
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Old 10-07-14, 11:16 AM
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He is not going very fast. Throughout the video, it takes him about 1-2 sec for him to move one car length. He hits the pedestrian as he passes the front of a bus. It takes him about three full seconds to pass alongside the bus. Let's say the bus is 30 feet long, he's traveling 10 ft/s = 6.8 mph. If the bus is 45 feet long, he's going 15 ft/s, which is 10 mph. Not exactly a speed demon. I would say his speed is clearly under 10 mph.
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