Green Light + Don't Walk. Do you go (MUP)?
 

If you are riding along a MUP and come to an intersection where adjacent traffic has a green light (and left turn has a red) and the MUP has a Don't Walk, do you continue through or press the button? Is it legal in your state for you to continue through?

Press the button.

Is it legal in South Korea? No idea. I just go.

If the way is clear (including any traffic wanting to turn across my path), I proceed. I don't generally see MUPs immediately next to the street at intersections, though, only sidewalks.

Are you on a bike or walking? If you are walking you might care, but on a bike it poses an interesting question. As far as I know, they are not regulatory, but informational. For example, if they flash don't walk it really means don't start across if you haven't left the curb. If it is solid I would say you can still go, as long as you are out of the intersection before the light changes.

I've had motorists yell at me for walking when is was a solid don't walk or flashing (I ignore them, as they shouldn't be navigating an intersection and deciding whether or not to violate my right away via the walk signal). Regardless, I have the right away. The signals follow all kinds of weird sequences so I go off the traffic signal (if it's green I go). I've seen one side of the street with white walk and the other solid don't walk. Talked to the traffic engineer and he had an explanation, but it didn't make any sense. Just confusing to the per. No wonder why people don't walk much.

Proceed with caution.

we have a local mup that has walk signals and stop signs for the mup. I stop for the stop signs and then proceed no matter what the lights say. I'm not walking. What makes this easier in this case is the stop signs, and the fact that there is actually no walk cycle, there are always cars that can go through the crosswalk. In fact, the "walk cycle" is short and coincides with the left turn cycle for the cars that cross the crosswalk. So I'd rather pick my way through when no cars are present.

I do everything I can do to present a law abiding appearance and go out of my way to be courteous to drivers these days. Ultimately the interactions between myself and the cars on the routes I frequent (which have a few MUPs as you have described) seem to have become fairly cordial, at least in comparison to what they can be in this town. I press the beg button and wait. It's only a few minutes, and I leave early enough to account for it. No need to make already bad relations worse here in oil town.

We have a spot where a bike path (I don't think the term "MUP" has any legal standing nor is it used here) is brought to join the sidewalk at a signaled intersection. The MV code specifically states that "pedestrian control signals" apply to pedestrians (defined as "persons afoot"). The section on bicycles on sidewalk specifically reference "driving" of bicycle on sidewalk, so I don't interpret that as being "afoot", and further there is a section on U-turn by bicycle against a sign, in which case bicycle must be walked (and hence not driven but instead "afoot"). So there is no legal requirement to obey a "pedestrian control signal" unless you are afoot (walking your bike) but regardless I never follow ped signals and wouldn't in any case, law or no law. Here they have "countdown" timers on the ped signals and it is illegal for a ped to leave the curb once the countdown begins. 30 bikes could easily cross in the time it takes a countdown to run down. Of course right hook is always a real possibility in these situations, but that's true with or without a ped walk light.

scott s.
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Cranky One,

Yes, if I come to an intersection, it doesn’t matter if it is a MUP or a sidewalk and I’m walking if the crosswalk light is red I do not cross. I push the button and wait for the light to change.

The only exception to that is if after I’ve pushed the button that the walk light doesn’t change. After a cycle or two, I’ll cross and then call in the light.

:thumb:

Are you on the sidewalk or MUP for which the walk/don't walk applies, or in the road regulated by the main traffic signal?

Like with real estate, it's about location, location and location.

Mostly I do the lawful thing, but there's a few exceptions. One in particular is a road that's about 100' long and dead ends, a couple times a year I'll see someone parked there. Another is where the signal is only for a MUT crossing and is on user activation, they stay red far longer than is to needed to cross safely, sometimes it actually takes longer to not use the signal as the light changes as soon as the button is hit, but I feel guilty making folks sit at a red light long after I'm gone. Sometimes I punk out, and run them if no one is around.

You have traffic lights where the MUP crosses the road? We usually have a sign or nothing at all.

The green light applies to people using the road (it doesn't magically apply to completely different ways/roads). The "Don't Walk" light applies to all users of the MUP.

Legally, you have to do what walkers/runners/skippers/skateboarders are required to do. It's bizarre that you seem to think otherwise.

Bizarre. You are legally required to follow the traffic controls. You are violating their right of way.

This is wrong.

You are required to follow the "pedestrian" controls unless an explicit exception has been made for bicyclists. There may be additional requirements/restrictions for bicyclists but the existance of those restrictions doesn't magically remove the requirement for bicyclists to stop at stop signs/lights.

The "driving" reference refers what you also have to do when riding (rather than walking) your bike.

Depends on the amount of traffic. It it is light, I will go through. If it is busy, like in the morning with school traffic, I wait and press the button.
I use the stop as a chance to wipe my brow and get a drink. ;)

Yes, very common.

I cross one location where the bike path/trail is marked with a sign that says "bicycles obey pedestrian signal." It is appropriate because if you don't you will be run down by drivers turning across the path that have a green left turn light and cars proceeding straight ahead have a green light that is not for bikes on the path but could be construed to be by some folks.

Without question, you're supposed to follow the pedestrian signal. That said, I never bother actually pushing the button unless I need to stop for a red anyways.

The only place I think of that is sort of like that is the Orange Line Bike path.

I'd be very careful there as the light for the street may have a right turn arrow and heading out with a don't walk is asking for trouble.

If one is a salmon relative to the road traffic always depend on the pedestrian signal, a quick left arrow and potential death may be in your future otherwise.

Yes. Here's an example:

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=412367

This image is looking due north. The MUP runs alongside the 2-lane 45 mph county road. The road coming from the SW and curving in to the junction carries less than 1,000 vehicles per day. The road heading off to the NE is the entrance to a middle school. Probably 99% of the time when riding along the MUP there is no cross or turn traffic at this junction and vehicles on the main county road have green. MUP has 'Don't Walk'. There are five similar junctions along this 2 mile section of road. Stopping and waiting at each (IOW, 10 or 20 or 30 times each day depending on the number of trips) is not very appealing.

Well, you'll have to take it up with the legislature. I didn't write the law. The law says "pedestrians" and also defines "pedestrians". You argue a ridden bicycle is a pedestrian. I see no support for your position in the law, but then I didn't look for any case law on it so you might be right, but I would have to see the specific court decisions.

scott s.
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Maybe I did not explain it properly. I am walking in a crosswalk the same direction (parallel) as the auto traveling through the intersection. A auto turning left in front of me (crossing my path) or right in front of me (crossing my path) is violating my right away, regardless of what the pedestrian signal indicates. If I were crossing in front of them when they have a green that would be a different story - and you'd be correct.

My original point was more towards this:

"Pedestrian signal indications apply to pedestrians,not drivers." (Florida Law)

Here in Washington, a cyclist using a pedestrian facility must obey the same rules as a pedestrian.

RCW 46.61.755

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(1) Every person riding a bicycle upon a roadway shall be granted all of the rights and shall be subject to all of the duties applicable to the driver of a vehicle by this chapter, except as to special regulations in RCW 46.61.750 through 46.61.780 and except as to those provisions of this chapter which by their nature can have no application.

(2) Every person riding a bicycle upon a sidewalk or crosswalk must be granted all of the rights and is subject to all of the duties applicable to a pedestrian by this chapter.



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Wrong.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

If you're riding your bike through an intersection via a crosswalk, you're a PEDESTRIAN and are supposed to follow the directions of the walk/don't walk signals.