Raleigh Super Course headset issue?
 

so i just finished servicing this early 70's super course i just picked up. everything went pretty well, no stuck post/stem. the frame is in decent shape considering its age. it looked like it had been ridden a lot but taken care of. when i received the bike, the headset was really tight, i could barely move the handle bars. the first thing i did was remove the bars and take the headset apart. i cleaned the races/bearings and re lubed and repacked. they were loose bearings so i made sure to fill up the races then remove one to accommodate for movement. when i put the headset back together, i get a slight grinding feeling(probably bearings that need to be replaced, i usually just reuse the old ones unless they are visually bad) but the odd thing is, the bike favors turning to the left, if you slightly nudge the bike it falls the left side, i kept playing with the adjustment on the headset but i wasn't able to make any noticeable difference.

i checked the dropouts and fork alignment after the headset adjustments, and everything seemed good there, the only thing i can think of is, the bearings are bunching up on one side and not flowing freely thus the bike is favoring one side over the other, its also possible that some of the bottom bearings got mixed in with the top, i try to keep them seperate but sometimes there a few stragglers that get stuck in the cup or pushed up into the head tube, then fall out later on. my current plan is to over haul the headset again and get brand new bearings to see if that clears up the issue.

anybody have any thoughts?
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=443662http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=443663

The classic (sorry forget the manufacturer's name) Raleigh headsets are VERY sensitive to a few aspects of assembly. First is that they are almost a pure axial contact design. With a small angular contact angle they are more dependent on the rolling surfaces being parallel. As these are stamped (or formed by pressure) uneven manufacturing is common. Second is that the fork and frame faces/seats need to be well cut and parallel, a job not always done well by the various factories Raleigh had back then. Third is the ball count. the top used one ball less then the bottom count and both needed a ball+ of loose space. IIRC 22 top and 23 bottom were the counts. The adjustment is a bit more picky too with the lack of angular contact angles. Locking the front brake and rocking the bike to feel looseness was a must. Start with a loose setting as that's easy to feel compared to a too tight adjustment, them work to the no slop but still spins middle ground. Andy.

So I disassembled the headset last night and started troubleshooting the issue. I noticed that when the it was tightened down, the headset would get bind up when it turned to the right, but it would move freely when it turned to the left.
i took the cups out and inspected them, making sure there weren't any dents or ovalness that would cause that. i didn't see anything on the cups, and the fork races looked good too. I even had a spare raleigh threaded headset cup to test and the same thing resulted.

the only thing i can think is the top crown race is ovalized some how. or there is a dent i can't spot. i inspected each of the bearings and they all looked fine.

i even took the top bearings out , just to see how the bottom ones were. the forks moved freely although tightening it down wasn't the same.

any ideas?

The head tube surfaces may not be parallel to each other, causing the races not to be parallel. The fork crown race may not be mounted perpendicular to the rotational axis.

It's highly unlikely that anything could damage the headset in that way without causing obvious damage to the frame at the same time. The most likely explanation is that the head tube/fork crown race seat need to be milled properly. If that doesn't fix it, the problem may be due to manufacturing flaws in the headset itself, in which case a new headset would be appropriate. The Super Course steer tube should use standard 1" x 24tpi thread, but check first to be sure, as some Raleighs used 1" x 26tpi thread steer tubes.

its not standard thread.. its 26tpi, ill guess ill have to start looking at the coop...

And that this Super course is a 26TPI is why one can't trust what's claimed in these forums. Only a few weeks ago it was said that Super Courses were all 24TPI. My understanding is that Raleigh moved the production on the fringe models (the Grand Prix and the Super Course being on either side of the Carlton/Nottingham factory source) back and forth as needed during the 1974 bike boom.

If you're not restoring the bike consider a non Raleigh lower stack. Andy.

You may not have to replace the screw-on race.

good point tom, if can find a top race that plays nice with the screw on race, that would work around the issue. thanks for the suggestion

Unlikely (other then another Raleigh style top race) because of the previously mentioned unique Raleigh headset design. That's why I suggested the lower stack be replaced. I have done this partial replacement a few times and had very good results. Andy.

what do you mean by lower stack ? sorry i haven't heard of that term used in relation to a headset.

The "lower stack" refers to the crown race and lower pressed race:

http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/headset.jpg
Source: Sutherland's 4th Edition

It may not be a headset problem. My 72 SC had a tracking issue that was caused by a minor fork alignment problem. A 3mm adjustment to both blades solved it. I am still using the original headset on this bike, which happens to be my daily commuter.

Also, check that the hub axle is bottomed out in the fork ends.

think you may be on to something, i flipped the bike over tonight and as i screwed on the top screw on race, i noticed that as i tightened it down, it pulled the steer tube forward, visually you could see that the headset wasn't aligned properly, there was a bigger gap between the crown race and screw race in the back, than in the front. and when i turned it to the right, it tightened it down more, which caused the binding.

so my thought is, it can only be in a few spots, the fork crown, the bottom pressed race or the fork.

i put in a spare fork that sorta of fit, i couldn't replicate the problem with them, but i can't rule out that they were properly seated..

visually the lower races look fine, there are not any gaps or obvious bumps that would cause them to be causing this. my next step is to pop out the lower pressed cup and inspect the inside of the tube. maybe a reseating of it can do the trick?

I suspect you'll need to get the head tube and fork crown race seat milled in order to fix this issue.

Just ride it?

i wish i could just ride it, but steering isn't functional at all,

Ah. Then yeah don't ride it :)

is there anyway to check to see if my head tube needs to be re milled? is there a visual inspection that can determine it?

i'm hoping that if i pop out the lower pressed cup and either replace it or re seat i may be able to fix the issue. when i got the bike the headset was really tight and i couldn't even turn the handlebars. so i wonder if there is some prior damage here. i've inspected for crash damage and i don't see a single bit of evidence to suggest that..

One can remove the head tube cups and place a square on the head tube face with the blade running along the head tube. By placing the square in a few orientations about the face and looking at it's blade (the blade should run parallel to the head tube sides) one can tell if there is a obvious need to face the HT. The steerer's straightness can be checked with a straight edge placed along it's length, the square's blade works well for this.

A few posts ago some one asked about checking for the cups being fully seated in the HT. By having a light behind the cup/HT and looking for the sliver of light between the face and the cup's shoulder one can see obvious miss installation of the cup. The crown race can be checked with the same method. When pressing or slide hammering in place the cups and crown race one can feel/hear the seating become complete. Tapping with a hammer and a drift punch (positioned to not touch the ball track) around the cup/race edges also helps insure full engagement. Andy.

i replaced the bottom pressed cup, and put it all back together, the forks are still pulled out of alignment when it gets screwed down, i ended up backing the screw nut off half a turn to clear it from binding. i now have a very slight knock/wobble in the headset but it rides nice, i can ride with no hands and i can take corners without having the steering stay locked up. so i guess its a trade off? i'm sure i'll have issues down the road, but with the weather turning ill probably just shut up and ride like shoota said.

one thing i definitely need is new brake pads, those old crusty dia compe pads are shot. i usually can bring old ones back to life with a little bit of sand paper but these were worn way down. i ended up colliding into the back of my car because i couldn't top in time...i had my hand on the rear brake but couldn't reach the front in time.. haha.. no damage to either vehicle, just my pride.. as every one of my neighbors was outside and i'm sure they saw me.. lol

Yes it is embarressing when your audience claps:) Andy

So i decided to take the bike up to my LBS to see if they could identify the issue. I haven't heard back yet, but i'm concerned because, I was talking to the shop owner about how I don't want to replace the headset because of the Raleigh threading. He looked at me like i had 4 heads.. "Raleigh threading?!?" i say, "Yeah, the fork is 26tpi, and not the standard 24tpi.." he laughs and says that he has never heard of that.. goes on to say i must of cross threaded the headset lock nut.... i say, actually Raleigh did this with a lot of their models, the super course is a hodge podge of different standards, in my case, the bottom bracket is standard threading.. but headset is not. i wish i had a vintage shop in my town.. too many carbon performance shops to deal with.. when he was confirming my information, he goes ..ok Mr. XXXXX with the Raleigh Record... i wanted to punch him..

If you end up having to replace the headset to solve the problem, the only non-standard 26tpi pieces are the upper threaded race and the locknut. So you could replace just the lower stack (crown race and lower pressed race), which is what carries the load anyway, and keep the upper stack (upper pressed race and threaded race) and locknut from your old headset, since the upper bearing merely holds the fork in alignment, not carrying any of the load.

good point, just cannibalize a new one.. i may go that route, ill know more once i hear back from my lbs