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Question: How much weight does adding various parts weigh?

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Question: How much weight does adding various parts weigh?

Old 08-31-15, 11:09 PM
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Question: How much weight does adding various parts weigh?

I've looked through all the forums and not sure where to post. This seem like the most likely forum.

I'm exploring a number of alternatives to getting my wife a bike. It has to be lightweight and smaller in size. There are a myriad of options but some require modifications.

A few questions if I may:

1. Generally (and I know that weights vary wildly depending on what one is willing to spend), if one were to add a front derailleur system consistent of the shifter, derailleur and cables, how much weight does that add?

2. Going from single chainring to double or trip in the front crankset?

3. Same question with adding a rear derailleur system.

4. Finally, what is the narrowest rear hub spacing that one must have to be able to add chainrings and derailleurs?

Thanks!
UL
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Old 08-31-15, 11:58 PM
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Before anyone can give you a good answer, we need to know what kind of bike (and how light/expensive) we are talking about. These numbers will be higher for a low end bike than a high end bike. I usually figure that a fix gear (ie one ring up front, no cassette or freewheel and just one cog in back and no derailleurs, cables or shifters will be a full pound lighter for a quality bike with down tube shifters. Brifters and cables add around a pound unless you spend big money. Front derailleurs are from 4 oz to probably 7 oz. Rear derailleurs from 6 oz to 1 1/2 pounds (guess). Cassettes - I'll guess 6 oz to 2o oz. Freewheels 1 to 2 1/2 pounds. Adding chainrings is probably 6 to 14 oz since you will need longer bolts and probably a longer bottom bracket, maybe some chain and a front derailleur or one with a longer cage and perhaps a bigger rear derailleur.

These figures are all off the top of my head. Not exact at all, But I hope they give you a sense that remembering all the little stuff is just as much of the final picture as knowing the big numbers.

Last question is pretty easy. Modern road standard is 130 mm inside to inside of dropouts. (8, 9 or 10 speed) Older is 126 (ancient 6 speed, narrow 7 speed.) 1960s and 70s 5 speed and narrow 6 speed was 120. For 120 you must use a freewheel and freewheel threaded hub. 126 is freewheel or I believe you can use a very early cassette hub. There are also 135 spaced hubs for mountain bikes, tandems and I believe 11 speed is using them. (Don't quote me there. I am a decade away from 11 speed, at least.) Track fix gear hubs are 120. Many fix gear hubs now are 130 or come with spacers to 130 and can fit narrower hubs also.

Ben
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Old 09-01-15, 06:21 AM
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If you are planning to build a bike from the frame up, the stack of money you'll spend (even in large bills) will weigh plenty.

That said, I'm currently converting my wife's all-steel Dunelt (1960's 3-speed) to something much lighter. She doesn't want more than three gears, so I bought an alloy wheel set that incorporates a Nexus hub and gear changer. Also installed alloy bars, stem, seat post, and Dia-Compe center-pull brakes. Much of this was borrowed from a 10-speed that she didn't like, keeping the cost down. Most importantly, she's getting to keep the Dunelt frame, which is candy-apple red and has sentimental value - it was her first bike. I've had to reset the fork and rear triangle spacing, and file the drop-out openings, but I think the work will pay off in points with my wife.

Last edited by habilis; 09-01-15 at 06:26 AM.
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Old 09-01-15, 06:50 AM
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You can look up component weights yourself, there are weight weenie tables out there for that.

But what I can tell you is that if you live in a hilly area and she needs a triple, she needs a triple. Lower gears are far more useful than less weight. Put her on a 14lb fixed gear and she will not be able to climb the steepest hill. Put her on a 25lb hybrid with a 22/34 low gear and she might be able to.

Saving a pound, or three, for a newbie's bike is wasted effort. They need to build up strength and they'll be able to do that on any bike that fits them and has reasonably appropriate gearing. Put them on an ultralight bike with inappropriate gearing is setting them up for failure.
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Old 09-01-15, 07:20 AM
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Originally Posted by FastJake View Post
You can look up component weights yourself, there are weight weenie tables out there for that.

But what I can tell you is that if you live in a hilly area and she needs a triple, she needs a triple. Lower gears are far more useful than less weight. Put her on a 14lb fixed gear and she will not be able to climb the steepest hill. Put her on a 25lb hybrid with a 22/34 low gear and she might be able to.

Saving a pound, or three, for a newbie's bike is wasted effort. They need to build up strength and they'll be able to do that on any bike that fits them and has reasonably appropriate gearing. Put them on an ultralight bike with inappropriate gearing is setting them up for failure.
This is very true, and good advice for the OP. However, there are people who may never get the hang of front and rear derailleurs. My wife is one of them. I knew someone else who disabled both derailleurs, putting the bike permanently on one chain ring and one rear sprocket rather than learn how to shift. This problem was a determinant in my selection of parts for my wife's bike. She won't be getting up steep hills, but at least she'll be riding.
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Old 09-01-15, 07:30 AM
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maybe start of by telling us what kind of riding your wife will be doing... what her experience level is...
what she is currently riding and if that is the bike you want to upgrade, or if you are thinking of buying a bike an upgrading...
also what do you mean by lightweight? How much do you want the bike to weigh when you are finished...not sure what it is you are trying to accomplish... have no idea where you are starting or where you really want to end up.
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Old 09-01-15, 07:39 AM
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1. You are probably better off selling a bike that does not meet your wife's needs and buying an appropriate one than you are upgrading. That is true both from a money and time/effort perspective, especially if you are not experienced at sourcing compatible parts.

2. Bike weight has very little impact when you are talking about differences of a pound or two, or even more. Remember that the bike's weight when ridden includes rider weight, which greatly lowers the percent difference in weight. On top of that a 2% weight difference (ex: 4 lbs off of rider + bike weight of 200lbs) is less than 1% impact on speed/effort.
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Old 09-01-15, 07:56 AM
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If it matters you will own a scale to weigh each thing..
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Old 09-01-15, 08:22 AM
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Look up weights here
Weight Weenies - Listings Index
for example:
Weight Weenies - Front Derailleurs

Lower end components aren't necessarily listed there, but I've found those weights in Amazon listings (which take with a grain of salt but are sometimes accurate), and on the manufacturer or distributor site.

For the latter for example, the HG30 9-speed cassette is 270 grams. CS-HG50-9 Many of their components do have weights listed.

Failing that, if you google the product and dig through enough reviews or message boards you can sometimes find someone posting the weight.

Keep a spreadsheet with all of the options that you're considering, and don't leave anything out (like a chain tensioner for example) and you can get pretty close to the final weight of whatever you're planning. When I did this I was taken aback by what it would cost to save four or five pounds, and re-aligned the priorities to more reflect functionality and standard parts, than the overall weight of the bike.
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Old 09-01-15, 08:24 AM
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Bigger questions, drop or flat bars? Need low gears for hills? Widest tire looking to run? Usually it is easier to start out with a compete bike first. Budget? 1,000k? Uses for said bike? Commuting, errands or just riding around?
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Old 09-01-15, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Leebo View Post
Bigger questions, drop or flat bars? Need low gears for hills? Widest tire looking to run? Usually it is easier to start out with a compete bike first. Budget? 1,000k? Uses for said bike? Commuting, errands or just riding around?
Amen to that. Due to all the clutter in my garage, my wife got to try stem shifters, brifters, friction shifting , indexed shifting, and her old Sturmey-Archer 3-click. Sturmey-Archer won. Also, touring bars beat drop bars. Hybrid tires beat skinnies. My arguments and advice were overruled. If your wife hasn't already sorted these things out, let her try a few different bikes before making any decisions.
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Old 09-01-15, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Leebo View Post
Bigger questions, drop or flat bars? Need low gears for hills? Widest tire looking to run? Usually it is easier to start out with a compete bike first. Budget? 1,000k? Uses for said bike? Commuting, errands or just riding around?
+1 Functionality far more important than weight.
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There's no such thing as a routine repair.

Don't tell me what "should" be - either it is, it isn't, or do something about it.

If you think I'm being blunt take it as a compliment - if I thought you were too weak to handle the truth or a strong opinion I would not bother.

Please respect others by taking the time to post clearly so we can answer quickly. All lowercase and multiple typos makes for a hard read. Thanks!
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Old 09-01-15, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by habilis View Post
This is very true, and good advice for the OP. However, there are people who may never get the hang of front and rear derailleurs. My wife is one of them. I knew someone else who disabled both derailleurs, putting the bike permanently on one chain ring and one rear sprocket rather than learn how to shift. This problem was a determinant in my selection of parts for my wife's bike. She won't be getting up steep hills, but at least she'll be riding.
Shifting comes with riding experience. I explained to my wife by shifting, it makes it easier for HER and easier on her knees (her family has a lot of knee problem history so sparing her knees is a good selling point). And relatively flat terrain plus strong wind can = big hill. In my area, you can't go one block without going up a hill. At least the ride home is downhill!

You can also make shifting more newbie friendly by what shifters you choose. My wife has two bikes. I made sure both bikes have the EXACT same shifters. Avoid anything not indexed, avoid downtime, bar end and road STI shifters. At least that is what I have learned with my wife.

As far narrowest rear spacing, I have derailleur bikes with 120mm spacing and others with 135mm spacing. Depends on the number of speeds, type of bike (hybrid, mtb, road, touring), etc.

Last edited by wrk101; 09-01-15 at 10:34 AM.
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Old 09-01-15, 10:54 AM
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I love light bikes - but technically, it's an expensive way to "cheat." Losing 5 pounds off yourself has far better performance than a 1500g wheelset, 500g cranks, 280g cassette and sub-300 gram tires can make, all day long. I have seen too many Clydesdale riders with bikes under 18 pounds still struggle up climbs.
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Old 09-01-15, 12:07 PM
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Generally speaking, bikes that come with multiple gears and front and rear derailleurs (the vast majority of bikes in the industrialized world) are very different animals from single speed and fixed gear bikes. Adding a multi-speed rear wheel and crank and derailleurs to a single speed or fixie can be a complicated project and has no advantage over starting with a multi-speed bike.
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Old 09-01-15, 01:10 PM
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Thank you Everyone!

Thanks everyone for your comments - going far beyond the letter of what I asked, and addressing the spirit of why I asked it. Thank you .

Again, a fantastic forum.

I consider my question answered...

We do live in the mountains with a lot of winding steep grades. So I will be gearing her low. Given that she is very lightweight and small framed without an ounce to loose, and not having much muscle mass, I do think every lbs on a bike does matter.

I do think that having a single rear cluster without the front derrailer will be much easier on my wife and a Rohloff may be ideal but it is way too much $$$$. Having front and rear may be too complex but it was worth an ask.

Thanks,
UL
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Old 09-01-15, 01:37 PM
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Let me say just one thing, to clarify the weight vs climbing thing, since you mention mountains and steep climbs. You can know exactly what difference each pound makes on the steep climbs.

Say wife and bike are 160 pounds together. One less pound off the bike is 1/160th easier up the hill. Two pounds less is 2/160 easier, and so on. It really is that simple.

So even if you knock of three pounds by leaving off some gearing, you are helping your wife out by less than one fiftieth of her total effort up any steep hill. I'm not saying "don't", but ask honestly if 1/50th less total effort is really worth not having a small gear for a really steep climb?
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Old 09-01-15, 02:08 PM
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Note that one will build up less potential energy going up the hill, thus the downhill speed will be somewhat lower.
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There's no such thing as a routine repair.

Don't tell me what "should" be - either it is, it isn't, or do something about it.

If you think I'm being blunt take it as a compliment - if I thought you were too weak to handle the truth or a strong opinion I would not bother.

Please respect others by taking the time to post clearly so we can answer quickly. All lowercase and multiple typos makes for a hard read. Thanks!
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Old 09-01-15, 04:11 PM
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I like that this thread didn't devolve into name-calling and general snarkiness, as would have likely happened in Road. Good choice of forum
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Old 09-01-15, 11:36 PM
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IMHO, being she is very light herself, save weight in the frame, wheelset/tires, post, stem and bars but leave her with a wide gearing selection. A compact double with a wide-range 10-sp cassette and medium cage RD should serve her well. If you are going Shimano, 105 or higher drivetrain will keep the weight in check. On a hard climb, few ounces lighter vs. another few gears lower is no contest.
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Old 09-01-15, 11:55 PM
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um, lemme just say JEEZE with all the bikes you have why don't you just get a scale and start weighing stuff to get a feel for it?

and, adding a front derailler and 2 speed crank can be done without adding much weight at all. under 3 pounds. the rear and the cassette is what will add weight as far as gears go.

if you think 3 pounds is significant, then i think her bike is already light enough, lol. as long as it's not a gaspipe, something thats all steel etc, its not a huge deal. if it is, get some decent alloy rims and bars, maybe a new seat, and it will be way better.

this is coming from someone who is considering spending 15$ on a seatpost because her perfectly good one weighs 90 grams more (to be fair, i'm probably not going to)
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Old 09-02-15, 12:14 AM
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Another consideration to bike weight for small, light people: they may not have the strength to lift a bike us larger folk call "light". If this has to happen in the routine operation of the bike, bike weight could matter far more than the tiny percentages we have been talking here.

Ben
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Old 09-02-15, 12:21 AM
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Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
Another consideration to bike weight for small, light people: they may not have the strength to lift a bike us larger folk call "light". If this has to happen in the routine operation of the bike, bike weight could matter far more than the tiny percentages we have been talking here.

Ben
thats a super valid point. however i would momentarily like to play devils advocate, as the 130lb girl whose been lifting her 30 lb bike (and mashing in 7th gear) all day.
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Old 09-02-15, 06:20 AM
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Originally Posted by gaytrash View Post
thats a super valid point. however i would momentarily like to play devils advocate, as the 130lb girl whose been lifting her 30 lb bike (and mashing in 7th gear) all day.
Do they still sell the "shoulder pad" that fits in the angle between the top tube and seat tube to make carrying easier? If a commercial one doesn't work for your bike, it may still be possible to improvise something. A shoulder strap, maybe? (Keep the drive side away from your clothes!)
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