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Expected Lifespan of a frame made out of Aluminium or Carbon Fibre or Steel

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Expected Lifespan of a frame made out of Aluminium or Carbon Fibre or Steel

Old 02-01-16, 05:40 AM
  #26  
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HillRider, I suspect that Wheever has spent too much time in the road riding and road racing forums. I recognize all the memes from that context. They stem from typos from several years.
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Old 02-01-16, 07:33 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by HillRider View Post
Spell check is your (or rather, your reader's) friend. BTW, when did the spelling "asplodes" for explodes become trendy? I've seen it several places.
Actually, all the misspellings are deliberate and refer to ongoing BF memes. (And I had to fight autocorrect on them. Lol.) Search for user RyanF for context on "drope the hamer."
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Old 02-01-16, 07:34 AM
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Sigh. These are references to ongoing BF memes. Perhaps you are too recent a member to know this?
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Old 02-01-16, 07:35 AM
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Ding ding ding! We have a winner!
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Old 02-01-16, 07:36 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Merco_61 View Post
HillRider, I suspect that Wheever has spent too much time in the road riding and road racing forums. I recognize all the memes from that context. They stem from typos from several years.
What I meant was: Ding ding ding! We have a winner!
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Old 02-01-16, 07:43 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by gsa103 View Post
From a purely theoretical perspective, a monocoque carbon frame should last the longest. A carbon fiber frame has the same infinite fatigue life as steel and is not prone to rust or corrosion. Lastly the monocoque construction eliminates the weld seams removing a common failure point of other materials.
But CF frames that are really just reinforced plastic is subject to deterioration from sun light, and the plastic resin turning brittle because the plastic slowly gasses off.

Given the choice for a long lasting bike between a Ti frame and a CF frame, smart people would chose the Ti frame every time.
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Old 02-01-16, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
But CF frames that are really just reinforced plastic is subject to deterioration from sun light, and the plastic resin turning brittle because the plastic slowly gasses off.

Given the choice for a long lasting bike between a Ti frame and a CF frame, smart people would chose the Ti frame every time.
You're ignoring the fact that a Ti frame (or ANY material) when under-built for the stresses it will see, will fail.

Any material could carry the OP 10 years without issue. But since carbon frames are pretty much all meant for racing, I wouldn't recommend any of them. Titanium would be way over budget. So I'd recommend the sturdiest steel or aluminum frame available. The example of the Surly Long Haul Trucker would be a good choice.
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Old 02-01-16, 08:06 AM
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I was told by a Bianchi rep in the 1980s that the management in Italy found the idea that Bianchi USA offered lifetime warranties for their steel frames to be ludicrous. (Don't know how it works now, but at that time, Bianchi USA, not Bianchi Italy, assumed responsibility for warranty replacement of Bianchi frames sold in the United States).

The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."

I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.

And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
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Old 02-01-16, 08:14 AM
  #34  
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ColnelSanders, I'm no structural engineer, but I think that most frames, regardless of construction material, will out live their owners with normal use. If you want to hedge the bet, go for Ti.

At a weight you mentioned a touring bike is a good selection and just about every touring bike made these days is steel, making the choice of frame material easy.

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Old 02-01-16, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by FastJake View Post
You're ignoring the fact that a Ti frame (or ANY material) when under-built for the stresses it will see, will fail.

Any material could carry the OP 10 years without issue. But since carbon frames are pretty much all meant for racing, I wouldn't recommend any of them. Titanium would be way over budget. So I'd recommend the sturdiest steel or aluminum frame available. The example of the Surly Long Haul Trucker would be a good choice.
I dont think anyone here is talking about a cheap under built frame. We are talking about good quality frames built of the different materials.
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Old 02-01-16, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Trakhak View Post
I was told by a Bianchi rep in the 1980s that the management in Italy found the idea that Bianchi USA offered lifetime warranties for their steel frames to be ludicrous. (Don't know how it works now, but at that time, Bianchi USA, not Bianchi Italy, assumed responsibility for warranty replacement of Bianchi frames sold in the United States).

The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."

I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.

And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
What you say might be true, but I think that most manuf honor their life time frame warranties. My son that had Schwinn with an oval bottom bracket shell got a new frame.
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Old 02-01-16, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Wheever View Post
Actually, all the misspellings are deliberate and refer to ongoing BF memes. (And I had to fight autocorrect on them. Lol.) Search for user RyanF for context on "drope the hamer."
OK, I wasn't sure since we get so many truly unintentional typos here and occasional well meaning but misguided "advice". Your posting was amusing and, since I only frequent the Mechanics forum I wasn't aware of the memes on other ones.

Sigh. These are references to ongoing BF memes. Perhaps you are too recent a member to know this?
Uhh, no. Look at my posting count.
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Old 02-01-16, 08:56 AM
  #38  
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I like to get used frames and build them up as experiments or for self or as give-aways. But I don't do aluminum or CF unless I know their specific history (original owner, usage, etc). Just sayin'.
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Old 02-01-16, 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
I dont think anyone here is talking about a cheap under built frame. We are talking about good quality frames built of the different materials.
You must not be paying attention. Others have discussed racing frames designed to last a single season.
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Old 02-01-16, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
But CF frames that are really just reinforced plastic is subject to deterioration from sun light, and the plastic resin turning brittle because the plastic slowly gasses off.

Given the choice for a long lasting bike between a Ti frame and a CF frame, smart people would chose the Ti frame every time.
Carbon frames are not reinforced "plastic" in the manner you imply. The resin is fully cured (crosslinked) epoxy and contains no plasticizer that can out-gas over time. Also, the clear coats contain UV protectants to prevent deterioration in sunlight. So, built to be durable rather than extremely light, a carbon frame can, and should last for decades. However, durability isn't carbon's marketing approach, light weight is, so the frames do tend to be less than a lifetime purchase.

As to Ti, Litespeed did build a very light (<800 gm) Ti frame years ago that was very competitive with carbon and aluminum in weight but wasn't very durable so durability is as much, or more, a matter of construction as it is of material..
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Old 02-01-16, 10:36 AM
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Seems to me the answer to the OP's question is, it depends. As mentioned a few times already each material comes in different versions and can be built to last a long time with a 270lb rider with the right design or could break in a short time with the wrong choices. I think the best thing is to go for some test rides, contact the mfrs. directly of the bikes you like and ask if they guarantee their frames for a heavy rider and get one with a lifetime guarantee. Make sure the guarantee is in writing when purchasing. Buy it and enjoy your new bike.
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Old 02-01-16, 12:54 PM
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There are steel and aluminum bikes designed for the stated purpose. Just get one of them.

If I weighed 270 lbs, I would buy a steel-frame bike. Come to think of it, all of my too-many bikes have steel frames (except for one titanium), so I'm clearly biased. But there are plenty of good aluminum-frame bikes.
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Old 02-01-16, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by HillRider View Post
OK, I wasn't sure since we get so many truly unintentional typos here and occasional well meaning but misguided "advice". Your posting was amusing and, since I only frequent the Mechanics forum I wasn't aware of the memes on other ones.


Uhh, no. Look at my posting count.
Glad you finally got the joke. The memes over in the Road forum are the best part of BF in the off-season.

And I wasn't referring to you re: the newbie observation. It was the other guy who was a junior member. (Teach me to post before I've finished my morning coffee!)
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Old 02-01-16, 02:38 PM
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I would say that a 270-lb rider who can't say no to a pothole raises the stakes for all of those frame materials.
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Old 02-01-16, 02:44 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by Trakhak View Post
I was told by a Bianchi rep in the 1980s that the management in Italy found the idea that Bianchi USA offered lifetime warranties for their steel frames to be ludicrous. (Don't know how it works now, but at that time, Bianchi USA, not Bianchi Italy, assumed responsibility for warranty replacement of Bianchi frames sold in the United States).

The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."

I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.

And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
as far as I understand, Miyata also offers/offered lifetime guarantees on their steel frames ... the only caveat is that you have to have the bike serviced regularly by a Miyata dealership, and the guarantee falls away when you sell the bike to a new owner (guarantee is only for the original purchaser)
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Old 02-01-16, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
I would say that a 270-lb rider who can't say no to a pothole raises the stakes for all of those frame materials.
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Old 02-01-16, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by dim View Post
as far as I understand, Miyata also offers/offered lifetime guarantees on their steel frames ... the only caveat is that you have to have the bike serviced regularly by a Miyata dealership.....
What "regular service" does a steel frame need? As to "lifetime warrantees" both Trek and Litespeed have them, or did in the past and perhaps still do.
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Old 05-01-21, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by ColonelSanders View Post
Okay, let's say the choice of frame is out of a Specialized Crosstrail Expert with their M4 aluminium or Giant's Toughroad with their SLR aluminium vs something like the Kona Big Rove ST with 4130 steel or Surly's Disck Trucker 4130 steel.

Forget I asked about Carbon.
I recently sold a 7 year old Crosstrail that still looked like it's in new condition. I'm guessing that the frame will have about 3 more years of life, but that's probably about it. Looking at the wear on the rear tire, I'm assuming that I put roughly 2,000 miles on the frame. At one point, there was a paint chip in one of the rear stays that went down to the bare metal, and I'm sure that this was bad enough to where it could form a hairline crack, even if it is totally undetectable. So I just felt that I could no longer trust it for total reliability. And this is why I let it go at a reasonable price. I pointed this out to the buyer, but he still wanted it in spite of the fact that I would never guarantee the bike's longevity. If he gets a year out of it, then I'm sure he'll at least break even on his investment. Still, I would consider this a temporary pandemic purchase if I were him, and would be looking at something new once bikes become readily available again.
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Old 05-02-21, 12:51 PM
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Originally, it was thought that Aluminum frames introduced in the mid-80s onward would have the overall advantage.

So they all had lifetime warranties initially. And of course, the promise that they would come out of the factory already properly aligned - ready to go - no prep work needed unlike steel frames.

By the early 90s, reality set in. Well established brand name aluminum frames were seen breaking as soon as 7 years out - alternatives breaking in as little as 3 years out. So the warranties were walked back to 5 years and 3 years. Pretty much everyone walked back their warranty terms...with Klein being a very stubborn holdout.

The ugly part was discovering that some were not in alignment as was the "industry promise". Brand name or not, we'd run into frames in the shop where overall alignment was off, hangers were off, dropouts were off, etc.

And of course, we didn't like bending aluminum . . . so we registered our complaints...we did not let them slide by.

Meanwhile, the prediction was made in many circles that Titanium frames would have limited life expectancy...on par with or even shorter than aluminum frames.

In 1999, 2000 and 2001, titanium frames could be had for super cheap - you could buy a Douglas at Colorado Cyclist for just 900.00. No joke...that cheap. Slightly cheaper than a Tommasini Sintesi at 960.00.

Decade later, it's discovered..."Hey, these Titanium frames are holding up . . . just as well as steel frames!!!"

So here we are now, you want a frame cheap....

...it's gonna be Aluminum - with a 1-3 year warranty in most cases.

You want lightweight steel? Squeeze your family jewels.

You want a titanium? Sell your first born...

You can see the hierarchy at all the Italian, UK and US based high-end builders.

Anyone who purchased a Titanium frame in 1999, 2000 and 2001 cheap, and kept it and still ride it today - you are lucky bastards!

=8-|
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Old 05-02-21, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by ColonelSanders View Post
Okay, let's say the choice of frame is out of a Specialized Crosstrail Expert with their M4 aluminium or Giant's Toughroad with their SLR aluminium vs something like the Kona Big Rove ST with 4130 steel or Surly's Disck Trucker 4130 steel.

Forget I asked about Carbon.
I have a 230 pound friend who had an Aluminum frame crack at the seat tube-bottom bracket junction. I think he had a little over 3 years and 30k miles on it. It was replaced under the 5 year factory and the replacement eventually cracked in the same place.
I have two steel bikes. The tourer has over 70k miles and the road has 122k miles.
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