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Deraileur hanger bent and preventing axle from sitting in drop out

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Deraileur hanger bent and preventing axle from sitting in drop out

Old 05-17-16, 11:01 PM
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rms13
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Deraileur hanger bent and preventing axle from sitting in drop out

Long story short, I bought this bike on ebay and it was supposedly packed and shipped by an LBS that must be run by monkeys. They took both wheels off for some reason when they didn't have to and didn't put discs into the axles or even put cardboard or padding between the wheels and frame so I ended up with a nice 1 cm dent/scratch on the seat tube.

Now after changing cables and trying to tune it up I notice the rear wheel won't sit in the drop outs. It looks like the deraileur hanger is actually bent toward the fronnt of the bike making the drop out narrower to the point that the axle is too large to fit into the drop out. It is a steel frame with built in hanger. Is this something a competent LBS can straighten out?


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Old 05-17-16, 11:16 PM
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It's relatively easy to fix on a steel frame. You can do it yourself, though you'll want to finish with a hanger alignment tool to make sure the derailleur sits square and works to it's full potential.

Not counting the alignment, you can push the hanger back into line by placing a small crowbar, or something improvised to that purpose, into the axle slot, and levering the hanger back with the front of the slot as the fulcrum. You'll probably be surprised at how easily it moves back to position, and will want to use an axle (or the wheel) or anything else 10mm wide as a gauge and quit at exactly that width, or when the front and back of the U shaped slot are parallel.
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Old 05-17-16, 11:17 PM
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rms13,
Hard to tell from the blurry photo but I would say yes it can be tweaked a bit...you could probably open it up yourself if you felt comfortable enough to attempt it. I have tweaked some on one or two of my bike with no ill effects.....if not LBS can assist. Make sure the rear alignment on the drops is correct after doing it. Helens in Westwood ask for Gilbert he is the maestro.
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Old 05-17-16, 11:21 PM
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As mentioned above, yes, that can be straightened out. But a good frame person should be able to do it without damaging any paint and will do the necessary alignment of the dropout and hanger plus check the rest of the frame alignment. I can't recommend a good shop but living in Glendale I imagine you might have some good frame specialists within driving distance. Must be a nice bike with a Record derailleur and yes, the people that shipped it as you say they did should be beat with a Campy headset press.
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Old 05-17-16, 11:26 PM
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Thanks all. I'll try it myself and take to shop if needed. It was a very nice frame before shipping. Wraith Hustle made out of Columbus Life and weighing about 3 lbs. Components are a mismatch of old 10 speed Campy parts but should be nice once fully up and running
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Old 05-18-16, 01:03 AM
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I'd be making a claim against the seller via eBay. A bent hanger and a dented tube due to improper packing - give me my money back.

When you receive a bike in the mail, you photograph the package and the unpacking. For this reason.
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Old 05-18-16, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by jyl View Post
I'd be making a claim against the seller via eBay. A bent hanger and a dented tube due to improper packing - give me my money back.

When you receive a bike in the mail, you photograph the package and the unpacking. For this reason.
I did. He gave me a couple hundred back. I opened a case to return it if needed but I did change the cables and housing and bar tape before I discovered the drop out problem.
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Old 05-18-16, 08:45 AM
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EBay being a cr*p shoot. buy in person and you can see these things before paying for it./
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Old 05-18-16, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
EBay being a cr*p shoot. buy in person and you can see these things before paying for it./
I agree. But ebay has good buyer protection. From what I understand ebay will step in and force the seller to refund my money and pay return shipping if I open a case even though the seller says no returns. And as someone that sells a few things here and there I can tell you ebay always sides with the buyer.
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Old 05-18-16, 08:59 AM
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This place is full of complaints though..
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Old 05-18-16, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
This place is full of complaints though..
Often that reflects more on the complainer than anything else. (not saying that's the case here)
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Old 05-18-16, 09:14 AM
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Back to the problem at hand. I actually have a small crowbar and was able to get the drop out open enough to get the wheel in. It took very little effort. But I am pretty sure the drop outs are out of alignment. The chain keeps over shifting the smallest cog even with high limit turned completely in. I don't have an aligment tool but should I try bending the hanger toward the frame or take it to LBS now and pay them to align it? It is running 10 speed drivetrain and I read that is more finicky as far as alignment than 9 speed or lower would be.
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Old 05-18-16, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by FBinNY View Post
It's relatively easy to fix on a steel frame. You can do it yourself, though you'll want to finish with a hanger alignment tool to make sure the derailleur sits square and works to it's full potential.

Not counting the alignment, you can push the hanger back into line by placing a small crowbar, or something improvised to that purpose, into the axle slot, and levering the hanger back with the front of the slot as the fulcrum. You'll probably be surprised at how easily it moves back to position, and will want to use an axle (or the wheel) or anything else 10mm wide as a gauge and quit at exactly that width, or when the front and back of the U shaped slot are parallel.
FB, You usually give pretty good advice, but suggesting a crow bar astonishes me.

OP, you need to go to a shop that has some frame tools.

They will need to use a drop out alignment tool and realign and respace the dropouts.



In addition, they'll need to use a hanger alignment tool to realign the hanger. I would expect to do a few rounds of each to get it all set correctly.
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Old 05-18-16, 09:22 AM
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You need to take it to you LBS because it is not a repair you can do without a derailleur hanger alignment gauge and dropout alignment tools.
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Old 05-18-16, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by andr0id View Post
suggesting a crow bar astonishes me.
It (or I often use the open end of dropout alignment tools) is a legitimate repair, as there is no other tool made for opening up a slightly crushed dropout. But I agree that the OP still needs to take the bike in to have the dropouts and hanger aligned with the appropriate tools.
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Old 05-18-16, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by andr0id View Post
FB, You usually give pretty good advice, but suggesting a crow bar astonishes me.

.
You have to read the entire post and take the various elements in context. I was pretty clear about the need to realign the hanger when finished.

Besides, before one can use the dropout alignment tools, you first have to open the dropout enough to get them in (same as the axle) and that requires using a ......... wait for it........ prybar of some sort.

So, I stand by my post as posted, with the understanding that "crowbar" refers to a class ob ending bars, not specifically the same tool one might use to open crates.
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Old 05-18-16, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by FBinNY View Post
You have to read the entire post and take the various elements in context. I was pretty clear about the need to realign the hanger when finished.

Besides, before one can use the dropout alignment tools, you first have to open the dropout enough to get them in (same as the axle) and that requires using a ......... wait for it........ prybar of some sort.

So, I stand by my post as posted, with the understanding that "crowbar" refers to a class ob ending bars, not specifically the same tool one might use to open crates.
OK, I agree if you're using the term "crow bar" very liberally.

We used a good solid shovel handle with some padding duct taped to it, which is effectively a crow bar but more gentle on the paint.
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Old 05-18-16, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by rms13 View Post
Back to the problem at hand. I actually have a small crowbar and was able to get the drop out open enough to get the wheel in. It took very little effort. But I am pretty sure the drop outs are out of alignment. The chain keeps over shifting the smallest cog even with high limit turned completely in. I don't have an aligment tool but should I try bending the hanger toward the frame or take it to LBS now and pay them to align it? It is running 10 speed drivetrain and I read that is more finicky as far as alignment than 9 speed or lower would be.
You can see a shop, or can do a rough alignment using your wheel and a straight edge -- yardstick or broom handle.

Shift to a gear where the idler cage is nearly vertical. Stand the bike up leaning on a wall, and have someone hold the straight edge vertical against the right side of the rear wheel. Now, squat behind the bike and eyeball the RD cage and gauge how close to parallel it is to your gauge. Then you can tweak the dropout by putting a hex key into the RD upper pivot bolt, and nudging it in the right direction.

Of course, purists will object to this method as crude and not accurate enough, but it is "good enough for government work" and will get everything into the ballpark, and if you have good eyes can be extremely accurate.

BTW - to the purists ---- if the advice is always going to be "see a mechanic", we don't need this sub forum. My goal here isn't to tell people they don't need a shop, but to give them information they can use to take care of things themselves. Of course the outcome may not be the same as going to a pro, but it may be, and either way is still an option.
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Old 05-18-16, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by andr0id View Post
OK, I agree if you're using the term "crow bar" very liberally.

We used a good solid shovel handle with some padding duct taped to it, which is effectively a crow bar but more gentle on the paint.
I have a bunch of "crowbars" of various sizes and shapes. After my wife is finished using my favorite screwdrivers as chisels, I'll heat the ends and forge them into various tools for special jobs. Fortunately, Deb provides a generous amount of raw material for tool making of this kind.
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Old 05-18-16, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by rms13 View Post
I did. He gave me a couple hundred back. I opened a case to return it if needed but I did change the cables and housing and bar tape before I discovered the drop out problem.
I'm glad to hear that.

The Park DAG 2.2 costs $70.

My philosophy on tools is that if they cost about what the LBS would charge for the job, I'll buy the tool and DIY. Unless the work appears beyond my ability to learn, or the bike is very precious indeed.

In your shoes, I'd probably DIY this.

When you bend the hanger, don't bend it back and forth. Make very small bends to get to the right alignment. The more bending, the greater the chance of breaking.
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Old 05-18-16, 10:23 AM
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I believe you could measure the frame alignment with some string and a ruler if you think the rear triangle is misaligned. If it's a matter of the RD hanger not being straight, then I would go to the shop and insist on measuring and aligning with the proper tool because you know it's probably already been tweaked so might well just get it exactly straight.
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Old 05-18-16, 10:37 AM
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Thanks. My LBS charges $25 for derailleur alignment so cheaper than buying proper tool that I may not use again
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Old 05-18-16, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by FBinNY View Post
You have to read the entire post and take the various elements in context. I was pretty clear about the need to realign the hanger when finished.

Besides, before one can use the dropout alignment tools, you first have to open the dropout enough to get them in (same as the axle) and that requires using a ......... wait for it........ prybar of some sort.

So, I stand by my post as posted, with the understanding that "crowbar" refers to a class ob ending bars, not specifically the same tool one might use to open crates.
I got it.

Perhaps the word "pry bar" would have been less alarming?

I've done this repair numerous times, just as I'm sure you have; just use a tool that fits and go slowly.

That's why we love steel...
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