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New Wheelset + 25mm vs 23mm = Rubbing Fork

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New Wheelset + 25mm vs 23mm = Rubbing Fork

Old 08-22-17, 01:55 PM
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gmarinonc
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New Wheelset + 25mm vs 23mm = Rubbing Fork

I am trying to figure out my options. I just purchased a new wheelset AND switched from 700x23 to 700x25 and now my tires are rubbing the top of the front fork. I like the 25's and would like to keep them. Is there an option to add a spacer to the front drops to position the wheel 1-3/8ths away from the top of the fork?
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Old 08-22-17, 01:59 PM
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Same size rim as before?
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Old 08-22-17, 02:00 PM
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No option that I know of. You should get a caliper and measure tire. Some 25's will actually measure 28mm on wider rims. I have Continental GP 4000's in 700 25C and they measure 28.5mm on wheels. Trying a different tire may work for you.
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Old 08-22-17, 02:16 PM
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Great insights...

I moved from Bontrager Race Lites to Mavic Open Pro (PerformanceBike) to get more spokes under my Clydesdale body. I also moved from Continental GrandPrix 4000 700x23 to 700x25 - and now the tires rub up under the front fork. Rear wheels still have pleny of clearance. Releasing some pressure up front gets me "just enough" clearance - until I pick up some road debris.

Luckily I still have the Bontragers and the 23's that were on them. Looks like I need to do some measuring:
Top of Hub to top of Rim (Old vs new wheels)
Width of Rims (Old vs new wheels)
Top of hub to top of tires (Old wheelset with 23's vs new wheelset with 25s)

I probably need to try putting the 23 on the new front wheel and see if that improves my clearance. (Yeah, I know I could have just done that to begin with - but then I'd miss out on all your words of wisdom.)
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Old 08-22-17, 02:46 PM
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From what I could learn, the Open Pro rims are a bit narrower than the rims of your Race Lites. A narrower rim would tend to make the tires larger in circumference and of course 700 x 25 tires would already be larger compounding the problem. Your old front wheel with the 700 x 25 tire might be a better fit as would your new wheel with a 700 x 23 tire. The good news is that you have sufficient rear clearance for a 700 x 25 tire, there is much more of your weight over the rear wheel. The solution may be to run a narrower front tire with a wider rear tire
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Old 08-22-17, 02:56 PM
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So you are saying it clears the front brake caliper but doesn't clear the fork crown? I've never seen only a 1mm or so 23 mm tire clearance on any 700c fork.

John
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Old 08-22-17, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by gmarinonc View Post

I probably need to try putting the 23 on the new front wheel and see if that improves my clearance. (Yeah, I know I could have just done that to begin with - but then I'd miss out on all your words of wisdom.)
Unless one rim is wider than the other, the tire will maintain the same shape, width and height.
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Old 08-22-17, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
So you are saying it clears the front brake caliper but doesn't clear the fork crown? I've never seen only a 1mm or so 23 mm tire clearance on any 700c fork.

John
I have. It may be a combination of a different width rim along with a larger tire. Some bikes have very close tolerences. A friend of mine has a Cannondale. When she changed from 23 to 25mm tires, she encountered problems riding on an unpaved bike path when debris that stuck to her tires would rub on the fork crown

Last edited by alcjphil; 08-22-17 at 03:18 PM.
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Old 08-22-17, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by gmarinonc View Post
(Yeah, I know I could have just done that to begin with - but then I'd miss out on all your words of wisdom.)
Our words of wisdom have a caveat. Unless you have paid for them they have no value. I gave my honest take on the situation, so if you want to investigate and repudiate what I said, I will not be insulted if proven wrong
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Old 08-22-17, 04:40 PM
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The OP is a relatively narrow rim, so I think you are stuck with 23s on the front. It may seem counter intuitive but a given tire on a wider rim will be taller as well as wider.
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Old 08-22-17, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by alcjphil View Post
Our words of wisdom have a caveat. Unless you have paid for them they have no value. I gave my honest take on the situation, so if you want to investigate and repudiate what I said, I will not be insulted if proven wrong
Don't sell yourself short! I like to hear the mad ramblings of others - it helps to shape my demented, over-inflated mind!

I should have some time tomorrow to pull the wheel and start measuring rim widths, hub-to-rim distances and tire heights on different rims...
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Old 08-22-17, 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
So you are saying it clears the front brake caliper but doesn't clear the fork crown? I've never seen only a 1mm or so 23 mm tire clearance on any 700c fork.

John

Lots of older bikes designed when 19 mm tires were the norm will have limited clearance.

Even some early 2000's forks and frames will have limited clearance for 21 mm inside width rims and 25 mm tires.


-Tim-
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Old 08-22-17, 06:23 PM
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If your clearance issue is only the fork, a different fork could provide more clearance.
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Old 08-22-17, 06:48 PM
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Change fork.
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Old 08-22-17, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by gmarinonc View Post
I am trying to figure out my options. I just purchased a new wheelset AND switched from 700x23 to 700x25 and now my tires are rubbing the top of the front fork. I like the 25's and would like to keep them. Is there an option to add a spacer to the front drops to position the wheel 1-3/8ths away from the top of the fork?
No. And if it were possible, you'd never experience a downhill slope, only uphill gradients.
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Old 08-22-17, 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by alcjphil View Post
I have. It may be a combination of a different width rim along with a larger tire. Some bikes have very close tolerences. A friend of mine has a Cannondale. When she changed from 23 to 25mm tires, she encountered problems riding on an unpaved bike path when debris that stuck to her tires would rub on the fork crown
Thanks! Never encountered it going to 25mm. Something to keep in mind, might come in handy one day.

Also agree with others to look into swapping out fork. Need to know your axle-to-crown measurement with some degree of precision/accuracy so you can keep the head angle close. Should probably talk to an LBS, actually someone familiar with frame geometry, to get the right atc , trail, rake so you keep bike handling characteristics as close as what you have now.

John
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Old 08-22-17, 09:30 PM
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Is it a nicer lugged steel fork from the early 90s or older? That's where I have seen this before.

Columbus is making a nice all carbon fork in 1". Probably the best 1" option without eBay.

I like my 23s, never felt need for something wider.
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Old 08-24-17, 06:34 AM
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And the answer is...multi-dimensional. Thanks to all the comments so far, I had a good idea of what I needed to look for.

As I originally state, I changed Wheelsets AND tire widths at the same time. Both are to blame for my new-found lack of clearance inside the fork. (Tire would rub the top of the fork intermittently)

First the Wheelsets...

Both are identical in height (w/o tires) and distance between the top of the hub and the outer edge of the rim. So there was NO impact there. HOWEVER - the inner rim width was VASTLY different...the new rims are 3mm narrower(!!!) than the older rims they replaced. Outer rim width is identical (19.6mm)

Old Wheelset - Bontrager Race Lite. Inner Rim Width - 17.75mm
New Wheelset - Mavic Open Pro. Inner Rim Width - 14.75mm

Next the Tires...

Same manufacturer, same model, different tire size (23 vs 25). Lay flat the tire and measuring the inner-distance between the beads, the 25's are 8mm wider than the 23's.

Old Tires - Continental Grand Prix 4000 II 700x23. Inside the beads - 54.75mm
New Tires - Continental Grand Prix 4000 II 700x25. Inside the beads - 62.75mm

Put all this together and it explains the fork-to-tire clearance problems. Thinner inner rim width PLUS larger tires = my problem.

To solve it, I have put the 700x23's back on the front wheel. Clearance is still tight due to the change in rim width - but the intermittent rubbing has stopped - and I have enough clearance for when the tires pick up some road debris.

The bike is a 2005 Lemond Zurich with Carbon fork. It's a "spine" bike - top half of the triangle is carbon, bottom half steel - and I love it, can't give it up!

Last edited by gmarinonc; 08-24-17 at 06:41 AM.
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