Chain Life Question
 

Hi,

I bought my bike (2016 Cervelo R3, Ultegra 6800 groupset) exactly a year ago. I may have left the original chain on a mite too long, but changed it in August with a bit over 2000 miles on it. I also put a new cassette in at the same time.

I've ridden 1126 miles with the new chain, and it shows to be completely worn out, 10/10 on the little drop gauge I have.

I ride about 100 miles per week, half the time 175 watts or above, and half the time 160 watts - 175 watts.

Does this seem a bit early to need to replace the chain?

Thanks.

Mark

What brand/model chain? What conditions? Dirt, rain? Do you clean and lube the chain? How often?

It's an Ultegra chain for the 11-speed cassette. Only once did I ride in rain (59 miles), and only ride on streets and paved paths; very little dirt, I think. I've cleaned and lubed the chain three times.

Why "little drop gauge" could be giving a false alarm, how to measure chain wear and when to replace the chain:

When to replace the chain on a bicycle? - Ciklo Gremlin

That does seem premature. Measure it with a ruler to see if the ruler agrees with the tool. The chain checker tools are notorious for false readings.

since the side plates of 11 speed are thinner, but , same design as 8 speed, derailleur chains,

ie, bushingless,... roller edges are all that engage the partial busing flange made by punching the hole..
so there is less material to wear thru if the material is thinner to start with..

Chain wear can vary a lot depending on riding conditions. I've worn out a chain on my cyclocross race bike in under 1000 miles (lots of mud and harsh washing). On my commuter bikes, which see a lot of rain, a chain typically lasts me around 2000-2500 miles. I don't have much data for chains on bikes that I only ride in nice weather.

I think your first replacement (2000 miles) was probably well within the realm of early enough. I doubt the cassette replacement was even necessary. If you replace the chain in time a cassette will last through several chains. Anyone who says otherwise is probably (a) selling cassettes, and (b) maintaining a reputation based on reliability of bikes they have serviced. I tend to take the charitable view that the second reason is why so many bike shops recommend replacing chain and cassette together. If you're conservative with your maintenance things will definitely be more reliable. Personally, I'm cheap and do my own maintenance, so I'm willing to keep using a cassette until I see it causing problems. One of the problems it can cause is shorter chain life, of course.

Anyway, your chain at 1126 miles is probably fine. Slaninar's link provides an excellent explanation of why your chain checker tool probably isn't reliable. Assuming you have the simple drop-in type tool I think the best use for a tool like that is as a quick way to decide whether or not you need to look closer. Someone will say checking with a ruler is quick and easy, but I find that it takes enough careful attention that I prefer a check that I can do quickly and without thought. That is, the typical chain checker can reliably tell you that your chain is NOT worn, but it shouldn't be completely trusted to tell you that your chain IS worn.

I wonder if the 11-speed chain is narrower enough to make a difference in wear than, say, 9-speed. I have a 3x9 Ultegra on my road bike and typically get about 3-4 thousand miles on a chain. I would think a narrower chain would have less bearing surface area on the rotating parts and so would wear faster at a comparable power level.

I have a Park Tools CC-2 chain wear checker. I noticed that it would not insert into a new chain. When I queried Park Tools about this, they said the tool is calibrated for greatest accuracy at the "1.0%" mark. This seems to be right, though I have not actually measured the chain. The 3x9 referenced above has about 7,000 miles on it and after 2 chain replacements the cogs are virtually un-worn.

The Park Tools checker agrees pretty much with a Spin Doctor "drop-in" tool I have. This latter only has two reference points though: 0.75% and 1.0%.
Steve

I agree about the varying conditions remarks. I've had chains wear out at lower miles than people say you typcially get. And you ride a fair amount, OP. I'd just replace as needed.

After reading several articles and other comments in threads here, I have agree the drop gauge I have, the park tools 3.2 is also measuring wear on the bushings. You just cant be certain if the chain has stretch or not. Don't know about the Park Tool cc2. But the video seems to show it measuring opposite sides of the bushings, so it's also measuring bushing wear too.

Chain stretch is probably the biggest thing to worry about in your chain. Bushing wear, not so much. So drop gauges might be quick, but they only are letting you know to do a better check with something else.

Shimano actually does make a drop gauge that does measure stretch.

Thanks so much for the help!

I decided that, since it's easy to change the chain, I'd go ahead and change it. When I had it off and placed it against the new chain on the floor, it was almost 1/2" too long.

So it was about time to change it.

I'll get the Shimano gauge that measures stretch accurately.

Thanks again!

Mark

That's what I was thinking too. I don't trust those things. Try calibrating your "little drop gauge" against a brand new chain?

I'd just like to point out that what is commonly called "stretch" is actually elongation due to hinge pin and sleeve wear. See Jobst Brandt here (third paragraph): https://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/chain-care.html

Sheldon Brown has some good images on his site here: https://www.sheldonbrown.com/chain-wear.html#stretch
Steve

I've done this. The "quick" gauge I have is made by Spin Doctor. On a new chain, it won't fit into the chain at the measuring end. However, at the 0.75%-1.0% amount of chain wear, it agrees pretty well with the Park Tools CC-2. I like the CC-2 better because it allows me to see the wear progressing towards the end of the chain's life in smaller steps than the Spin Doctor tool.
Steve

I use a steel ruler pin to pin deadly accurate. I get 4-6k on a 10 or 11 speed chain. Nothing special I do except clean with mineral spirits every 300-500 miles and keep it lube with cheap oil I but at menards a bit heavier than 3 in 1 oil. About every 1500 miles I take chain off I have wipperman quick link, drop chain in bottle of mineral spirits and back on.

I live in the flatlands and do not purposely ride in rain that helps. To me me your chain life is terrible. Check the factors does it add up?

My chain is a Shimano 9 speeds. I've put just shy of 5,000 km on it since this Spring and this Summer has been really wet (actually, wettest year since they're keeping records, which is 1873) and you made me remembered that I needed to measure my chain. It's at 12" 1/16 so about time to change it. Don't know about 11 speed chain but your wear seems excessive. My season is almost over so I'll replace it before the next season begins.

OP, skip the drop gauge and measure the chain right, with a steel tape measure. Pull the chain tight and measure 12 pairs of links, front of pin to front of pin. A new chain will be exactly 12". 12 1/16" is stretched and chain replacement time. (Set aside the chain and don't replace it if you want to save money.) Put on a new chain and repeat. Eventually your new chain will not run on the cogs or chainrings. When this happens, ride your old chains to 12 3/32", rotating through the chains you used and set aside.

This process should take you a good long time. When the 12 3/32" chains stop working it is time to spend the bucks for a new cassette, probably chainrings and start all over again with new chains.

As others have said above, the drop gauge measures both bushing and link wear, but the bushing wear doesn't "stretch" the chain and does not cause additional wear to the sprockets. The tape measure test only measures what you want to know.

Ben

Chain care, wear and skipping by Jobst Brandt


I remove and clean my chains in an ultrasonic cleaner very 800 miles or so. The 8sp chain has 10500 miles on it and the 7sp has 4916 miles.

Could you expand on this? What type of ultrasonic cleaner? (Entry level or industrial strength?) What type of solvent (mineral spirits, citrus based?)

I thought this would be the thread that someone would point that out. Deja vu, wow! :)

I think most of us know that. It more precisely tells what outcome of the wear is than simply chain wear. It's easier to say than chain elongation.

But yes, you are correct the side plates do not "stretch".:thumb:

Of course you are correct in all of this, but I am sometimes skeptical that a new chain is always 12". It should be, but in a recent thread here someone wound up with a pieced-together possibly used chain that had problems quickly. Or perhaps it's a knock-off out of spec chain. I've never actually measured a new chain when replacing, except against the old chain before cutting it, although I always intend to "on the next chain."

I have a new chain hanging from a nail on the wall.

1. It measures 12" @ 24 links, "precisely"
2. measuring a chain "precisely" is not trivial. I cannot imagine getting an accurate measurement using a ruler on a chain in place on the bike. This is where a chain gauge shines. Even with a chain off the bike, measurement of a 0.5% elongation is challenging. I've tried with a digital caliper and measurement error is probably in the vicinity of 0.25%. MUCH easier to have used vs new chains hanging on the same nail and actually visualizing elongation (a difference of a full link would be close to 1%).

I don't see this as rocket science. 1/32" is not hard to see when you measure front of pin to front of pin. Doing it on the bike means it is something you can do anytime in 3 minutes (and that probably includes washing your hands after).

This check only has to be accurate enough.

Ben

This cleaner: https://thelashop.com/products/jewel...nt=45219195210 and dilute Simple green.


After the cleaning cycle there are fine metal particles in the bottom of the cleaner.

I just finished cleaning and lubing my 8sp chain. It has 10,584 miles on it and measures 1/8" wear in 48" of chain.