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Front STI shifter, does "speed" matter?

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Front STI shifter, does "speed" matter?

Old 03-08-18, 12:20 AM
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vintagerando 
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Front STI shifter, does "speed" matter?

I have a set of shimano 7800 STI brifters. The front or left STI is broken and not fixable. I have ultegra 6600 cranks set up with double rings. What STI, within the shimano family can I get to replace the left broken STI? In other words will a STI labeled "8 speed " still work? How about 9 speed? Does the "speed" associated with a lever (for the front derailleur) , not including 11 speed, really matter?
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Old 03-08-18, 02:32 AM
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Any non-11 speed left STI shifter will work.
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Old 03-08-18, 07:36 AM
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Short answer is that I suspect that Contact is right.

For a longer answer I have to mix what I know for sure with a little bit of philosophy. Shimano uses same left side part number for 9-speed brifters whether for a double or triple crankset. The extra shifting position serves as a trim position on a double crankset. For some reason, Shimano has different part numbers for 8-speed and 10-speed brifters but I've often wondered what the difference might be and if they could be made to work as 9-speed components do.

Here's where the philosophy comes in: If I already own parts, I'll bolt up almost anything and see if I can get it to work to my satisfaction. If I'm buying parts, however, I'll only spend money for components that have been designed to work together.
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Old 03-08-18, 09:04 AM
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+1 for RG's reply. Not so much for the Shimano data but for the guidance in how to plan and figure out this stuff. Andy
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Old 03-08-18, 09:09 AM
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I'd be annoyed if my right and left shifters didn't look/feel the same. That might just be me though.
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Old 03-08-18, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
Shimano uses same left side part number for 9-speed brifters whether for a double or triple crankset.
Well, except Sora. And Tiagra, maybe?

Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
The extra shifting position serves as a trim position on a double crankset. For some reason, Shimano has different part numbers for 8-speed and 10-speed brifters but I've often wondered what the difference might be and if they could be made to work as 9-speed components do.
Mismatching aesthetics and ergonomics aside, I can’t see why an 8- or 10-speed front shifter wouldn’t work with an otherwise 9-speed drivetrain. Same pull ratios, same spider thickness as far as I’m aware.
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Old 03-08-18, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
For some reason, Shimano has different part numbers for 8-speed and 10-speed brifters but I've often wondered what the difference might be and if they could be made to work as 9-speed components do.
I'm not following you here. All STI shifters don't look the same, so why would they all have the same part numbers?

And how do 9 speed shifter work any different than 8 or 10?
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Old 03-08-18, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
I'm not following you here. All STI shifters don't look the same, so why would they all have the same part numbers?
He meant that some Shimano 9-speed left shifters were meant for use on both double and triple drivetrains. If you had 105 5500-series shifters, for example, you’d use the same shifters — and thus the same part numbers — whether your bike was a double or triple.

Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
And how do 9 speed shifter work any different than 8 or 10?
On those shifters that were intended for either double or triple drivetrains, I suspect that maybe the detent/trim positions were different. Someone who’s ridden them can hopefully confirm.
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Old 03-08-18, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by SkyDog75 View Post
He meant that some Shimano 9-speed left shifters were meant for use on both double and triple drivetrains. If you had 105 5500-series shifters, for example, you’d use the same shifters — and thus the same part numbers — whether your bike was a double or triple.



On those shifters that were intended for either double or triple drivetrains, I suspect that maybe the detent/trim positions were different. Someone who’s ridden them can hopefully confirm.
5500 triple shifters are part number ST-5503, doubles are ST-5500. But I'm not sure that's what RG was talking about.
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Old 03-08-18, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
5500 triple shifters are part number ST-5503, doubles are ST-5500. But I'm not sure that's what RG was talking about.
My bad. ST-5510 was apparently the double/triple model. Thanks for the catch.
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Old 03-08-18, 06:25 PM
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I used to own an Ultra equipped 9-speed road bike and an Ultra equipped 9-speed tandem. The shifters on both bikes were identical. Actually, I had Flight Deck computers, which included a gear indicator on both bikes. The front shifters had 4 positions. As a triple I had one position for the granny, two positions for the middle ring and one for the big ring. As a double I had 2 positions for each ring. The Flight Deck computers always indicated the appropriate chainring so I know that I had them set up as Shimano intended. I understand that the 105 shifters of that time, which were also 9-speed, were similarly double or triple compatible.

That experience has caused me to wonder how much difference there actually is between double and triple shifters and I wonder if I could get one to work to my satisfaction on the other.
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Old 03-08-18, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
I used to own an Ultra equipped 9-speed road bike and an Ultra equipped 9-speed tandem. The shifters on both bikes were identical. Actually, I had Flight Deck computers, which included a gear indicator on both bikes. The front shifters had 4 positions. As a triple I had one position for the granny, two positions for the middle ring and one for the big ring. As a double I had 2 positions for each ring. The Flight Deck computers always indicated the appropriate chainring so I know that I had them set up as Shimano intended. I understand that the 105 shifters of that time, which were also 9-speed, were similarly double or triple compatible.

That experience has caused me to wonder how much difference there actually is between double and triple shifters and I wonder if I could get one to work to my satisfaction on the other.
I do not see how you could possibly use the trim positions on a double to get the shifting range of a triple. The triple uses much more cable.
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Old 03-08-18, 08:31 PM
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Correct. When you set up a 5510/6510/RS500 front STI for a double, you use the inner and middle settings. The outer ring settings are locked out by the limiter screw on the FD.

In theory you could use the two outer ring settings for a double, but then it would be too easy to overshift down into the phantom third ring, requiring multiple shifts to take up the slack to upshift.
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Old 03-08-18, 09:00 PM
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Now I just have to find a used 8,9 or 10 speed to finish my build.
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Old 03-09-18, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
I do not see how you could possibly use the trim positions on a double to get the shifting range of a triple. The triple uses much more cable.
And yet, that's my actual, first hand experience. A data point that can't be denied.

As a double I got 2 shift positions for each chainring with no slack in the shift cable when in the small ring and the big rear cog. AND, the Flight Deck computer always indicated the correct chainring that I was in.

FWIW, when I converted my road bike to a 50/34 compact double I did get some chain noise in certain gears but it came, not from the derailleur cage but from the chain rubbing the inside of the big chain ring. I minimized it by putting a 2mm spacer under the drive side of the BB.
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Old 03-09-18, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
And yet, that's my actual, first hand experience. A data point that can't be denied.

As a double I got 2 shift positions for each chainring with no slack in the shift cable when in the small ring and the big rear cog. AND, the Flight Deck computer always indicated the correct chainring that I was in.

FWIW, when I converted my road bike to a 50/34 compact double I did get some chain noise in certain gears but it came, not from the derailleur cage but from the chain rubbing the inside of the big chain ring. I minimized it by putting a 2mm spacer under the drive side of the BB.
Where in there did you have a triple crank mated to a double only shifter?

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Old 03-09-18, 11:04 AM
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While the left from many other STI's will work for the front DR, didn't Shimano change the pull ratio of the brake levers on them recently??

Though for some people the difference in feel might not matter. And if your bike mfr has mix and matched the groupset with other brands, the resulting change might again not matter much.
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Old 03-09-18, 11:24 AM
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3 'speeds' on a triple crank , 2 on a double chain ring one..
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