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Suggest 1x10 inexpensive setup

Old 03-26-18, 12:53 PM
  #1  
motorapido
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Suggest 1x10 inexpensive setup

I'm switching a friend's hybrid from a triple to a 1x10. I already have a nice wheel with an 11-42 cassette that I will donate to the project. I'm seeking a value-priced rear derailleur and shifter combo for this flat-bar bike, which will be ridden on the road mostly, and also on paved an unpaved but smooth gravel bike trails, probably only about 500 miles/year. The friend does not need a tip-top shifter or derailleur, since weight and durability are not high on the importance list I'll run a narrow-wide chain ring on the existing crankset and will probably sandwich the ring with an outer and inner bashguard for extra chain drop protection. I don't think I will need a clutch derailleur. So can somebody suggest a modestly priced 10-speed derailleur and shifter combination for 1x10 that can handle a 42-tooth low cassette gear? There seem to be plenty that work fine up to 36 teeth. I'd rather not mess around with a Wolf Tooth accessory to adapt a derailleur to work with a 42 tooth cassette cog, but I am open to that if it makes sense. I would simplify things by switching to a 36 tooth low gear cassette, but the friend will be towing a dog in a trailer sometimes, on some hills that will make a 42-tooth a welcome luxury. Please share any advice on derailleur/shifter options. I'm currently touring on an IGH and commuting on a singlespeed, so I'm not all that well educated on current derailleurs and shifters in this 1x category.
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Old 03-26-18, 01:50 PM
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with an 11-42, I don't know how many "inexpensive" RD's you will find that can handle that large 42 cog. But even mid-range and even upper range RD's are not what I'd call expensive. I think as far as Shimano models, you'll have to look at RD's for mountain bikes, but I don't know what they have to handle that big a cog for the low gear without digging in the specs myself. I know SRAM has something that will handle something around a 51 tooth rear cog.

You are familiar with what specs for "Total capacity", "Low Sprocket min and max" mean when selecting one to purchase?

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Old 03-26-18, 02:22 PM
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Inexpensive? Don't touch the left shift lever.
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Old 03-27-18, 12:02 AM
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The RD-M6000gs derailleur in the new Deore group is designed for a 10sp 11-42, with any Shimano 10sp mountain shifter.

Or Sram Apex 1 with any 10sp Sram shifter.
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Old 03-27-18, 02:16 AM
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your problem will be clearance to the big sprocket, which varies according to the frame. Any RD will take up that gear range with a single chainring. I did this on a 2002 Orbea with RS700 shifter, Sora RD and a Goat link.
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Old 03-27-18, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by motorapido View Post
I'm switching a friend's hybrid from a triple to a 1x10...
Why?

I'm not trying to talk you out of it; just wondering what the perceived benefits will be and whether they're worth the expense. With the triple, he's already got low gearing for hills and trailer-pulling.
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Old 03-27-18, 08:55 AM
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Bike already 10 speed cassette?, use just the middle chainring take off the other 2..




Otherwise..
Its going to be not cheap (unless it's all stolen/stripped parts) No prestige in cheap..





...

Last edited by fietsbob; 03-27-18 at 09:02 AM.
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Old 03-27-18, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by SkyDog75 View Post
Why?

I'm not trying to talk you out of it; just wondering what the perceived benefits will be and whether they're worth the expense. With the triple, he's already got low gearing for hills and trailer-pulling.
Don't know what the OP's motives are, but for me, it might be a way to get my wife riding. She has tried different bikes and still doesn't want to understand gearing. She'll only be comfortable on a cruiser type bike with no gearing. However in our immediate area, you are not going to go far on a cruiser. Too hilly, even in our neighborhood.

A 1x with extreme gearing on the back will reduce the complication of shifting to the most appropriate gear that she has issues with on 2x and 3x fronts. Despite being educated and smart, she does not embrace the concept. She wants to know before she gets to a hill or such what gear she should plan to go to. It's not acceptable to her to shift to the gear that works for the current conditions.

It's not enough just to keep the front in one gear on the typical bike. While a small front would be appropriate for climbing here, it will not be adequate on descents and flats. I can see where a 1x with something like a 12-42 and 10 or eleven speeds might be something that will work for her.

Last edited by Iride01; 03-27-18 at 09:29 AM.
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Old 03-27-18, 09:40 AM
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Do 1x10s indicate the end of the march to ever more gears??? Having a bike with 36 speeds would seem to be an overkill.
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Old 03-27-18, 09:51 AM
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Pinion mid drive gear box is 18 speed.. internally geared .. Engineered that way.. so no redundant ratios ..
Rohloff also eliminates the redundant ratios, or it would have more.
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Old 03-28-18, 09:20 AM
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Good evaluation of motives for this 1x conversion

Originally Posted by Iride01 View Post
Don't know what the OP's motives are, but for me, it might be a way to get my wife riding. She has tried different bikes and still doesn't want to understand gearing. She'll only be comfortable on a cruiser type bike with no gearing. However in our immediate area, you are not going to go far on a cruiser. Too hilly, even in our neighborhood.

A 1x with extreme gearing on the back will reduce the complication of shifting to the most appropriate gear that she has issues with on 2x and 3x fronts. Despite being educated and smart, she does not embrace the concept. She wants to know before she gets to a hill or such what gear she should plan to go to. It's not acceptable to her to shift to the gear that works for the current conditions.

It's not enough just to keep the front in one gear on the typical bike. While a small front would be appropriate for climbing here, it will not be adequate on descents and flats. I can see where a 1x with something like a 12-42 and 10 or eleven speeds might be something that will work for her.
The owner of this bike is one of those people who, despite multiple advanced degrees, refuses to listen to, learn and apply simple theories and practices for riding a bicycle with a triple chainring. The owner sometimes shifts the front, thinking she is shifting the back and then declares the whole design stupid, or selects big ring/big cog on this triple and gets angry about the bicycle grinding away during its extreme cross chaining torture. 1x10 will, probably, result in better gear selection choices and a better riding experience. Personally, I always took pleasure in understanding and using bicycle transmissions properly, and felt sad and guilty when I gave up down tube friction shifters. But that's me.
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Old 03-28-18, 09:34 AM
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Print out a gear ratio chart, draw a line thru the display of relative gear sizes ..

and that will give them a clue of the sequence of what's next 12345678, etc..

tape it where they can see it riding the bike... information rather than parts..


Maybe an IGH is better , simpler more reliable, needing less IQ strain in gear selection.. grip shifter window number..







...

Last edited by fietsbob; 03-28-18 at 10:25 AM.
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Old 03-28-18, 10:09 AM
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What's on there now? Eight speed? Nine? Six?
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Old 03-28-18, 10:29 AM
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Since nobody really listens to triple-ring blowhards anymore, they have to hijack threads to re-hash it.

Have anyone EVER been talked out of a single ring by a triple-ring evangelist dropping in to a thread and giving un-asked for opinions about it?
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Old 03-28-18, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by cpach View Post
The RD-M6000gs derailleur in the new Deore group is designed for a 10sp 11-42, with any Shimano 10sp mountain shifter.

Or Sram Apex 1 with any 10sp Sram shifter.
Unless I am missing something, it sounds to me like this is what the OP is looking for.
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Old 03-28-18, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by motorapido View Post
The owner of this bike is one of those people who, despite multiple advanced degrees, refuses to listen to, learn and apply simple theories and practices for riding a bicycle with a triple chainring. The owner sometimes shifts the front, thinking she is shifting the back and then declares the whole design stupid, or selects big ring/big cog on this triple and gets angry about the bicycle grinding away during its extreme cross chaining torture. 1x10 will, probably, result in better gear selection choices and a better riding experience. Personally, I always took pleasure in understanding and using bicycle transmissions properly, and felt sad and guilty when I gave up down tube friction shifters. But that's me.
I can relate. My wife never got the hang of using a triple. Honestly, I don't understand it either. Not knowing how to shift on a bike is like driving a stick shift car, yet not knowing how to use 3rd and 4th gear. You could get by always skipping over 3rd and 4th gear, but the performance of the car will suffer.

On her Trek hybrid, she pretty much ignored the left shifter so in effect, she rode a 1 x 7. On her vintage Peugeot, we removed the big chainring, and turned it into a 1 X 9, and that is her favorite drivetrain. On her road bike, we mulled over a complete changeover to a SRAM 1 x 10, but in the end, we just removed the big ring, and changed out the 12- 25 cassette to an 11 - 32. So while it is technically a 2 X 8, she hardly touches the left shifter so it is, practically speaking, a 1 x 8.
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Old 03-28-18, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
Since nobody really listens to triple-ring blowhards anymore, they have to hijack threads to re-hash it.

Have anyone EVER been talked out of a single ring by a triple-ring evangelist dropping in to a thread and giving un-asked for opinions about it?

Lol I know, seriously it's crazy on here sometimes
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Old 03-28-18, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
Since nobody really listens to triple-ring blowhards anymore, they have to hijack threads to re-hash it.

Have anyone EVER been talked out of a single ring by a triple-ring evangelist dropping in to a thread and giving un-asked for opinions about it?
Was there a deleted post or something? Scrolling through the postings above, I can't seem to find the 'triple-ring evangelist' or blowhards you're talking about. Surely, it can't be me. I asked about the reasoning for the 1x conversion out of curiosity, not to evangelize, since the bike in question already seemed to have gearing suited for the type of riding described. But @Iride01, @motorapido, and @MRT2 gave some good reasons, sharing their insight and experience with me and others on the forum -- and that's kind of the whole point of forums, right? Regardless of anyone's opinion, if it's your bike, make its drivetrain suit your preferences.
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Old 03-28-18, 01:07 PM
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I'm happy to know that others endure the frustration of dealing friend or spouse that wants to ride a bike, but won't grasp the concept of gearing.

Those of you whose friend or significant other understood this from the get-go even though they never biked before, I'm very envious. Until you have some experience dealing with someone like this you'll just never understand.

This is where you probably need a system that you can set to maintain a specific torque load on the pedals and will change the gearing to make that happen. An infinite gearing system will be great for this.


I've thought about IGH hubs before. Now looking at them again I see there are some they call variable speed and have a range of ratios from .5 to 1.9. But that I guess is the ratio for how many times the rear shaft and external sprocket turn. I'll have put pen to paper and figure out what the ratio will be between the crankset and the wheel to see how that compares to the high and low gearing I feel is needed.
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Old 03-28-18, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by SkyDog75 View Post
Was there a deleted post or something? Scrolling through the postings above, I can't seem to find the 'triple-ring evangelist' or blowhards you're talking about. Surely, it can't be me. I asked about the reasoning for the 1x conversion out of curiosity, not to evangelize, since the bike in question already seemed to have gearing suited for the type of riding described. But @Iride01, @motorapido, and @MRT2 gave some good reasons, sharing their insight and experience with me and others on the forum -- and that's kind of the whole point of forums, right? Regardless of anyone's opinion, if it's your bike, make its drivetrain suit your preferences.
FWIW, I thought you made a legitimate point. Given my wife's difficulty correctly using a triple, I priced out what it might take to upgrade to a 1 x 10, and decided it was a little too expensive. If I got a good deal on SRAM shifters and back derailleur, I might do that for her one of these days. That said, I keep hoping against hope my wife will get the hang of using a front derailleur.

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Old 03-29-18, 06:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Yung Piss View Post
What's on there now? Eight speed? Nine? Six?
It's an 8-speed cassette now. Fortunately, the dropouts are currently spaced to accept the hub/wheel I have with a 10-speed cassette in the swap out.

From some quick calculations, it appears that with a single narrow/wide 30-tooth ring up front and the 36-tooth big cog on the spare wheel I'm going to install, she'll be at about the same low gear ratio that she has now with the granny on the triple and the current cassette big cog. She'll spin out at about 20 mph in the small cog on the new wheel I'll install, which is something I don't ever anticipate that she'll do for the type of urban bike path riding she's planning, with the dog trailer in tow.

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Old 03-29-18, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
Since nobody really listens to triple-ring blowhards anymore, they have to hijack threads to re-hash it.

Have anyone EVER been talked out of a single ring by a triple-ring evangelist dropping in to a thread and giving un-asked for opinions about it?
Ah-------------yeah that granny gear sprocket is SO heavy.

What I find funny is how 10 speed were just fine for decades, then we started adding gears. But now we are back to a 10 speeds again.
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Old 03-29-18, 03:17 PM
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Given the OP motivations

I would suggest using a 1x8 drive instead of a 1x10 if you want to keep it cheap.

There are plenty of casual-use comfort bikes that have been using that formula long before 1x10 was invented.

Most importantly this allows you to retain use of inexpensive 8spd components.

If you're concerned about losing gear range (personally I'd just use a normal cassette and pick sprockets to sacrifice high range, given the intended use) Sunrace does make a cheap 11-40t 8spd cassette, and a wolf-link knock-off.
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Old 03-29-18, 05:00 PM
  #24  
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7,8,9 Shimano rear shifter/derailleur used the same cable pull, road or mtb.

Going 10 speed rear means a new shifter and derailleur. On the cheap you could go used older slx 10 speed, replacing shifter and derailleur.

8,9,10 cassettes should all fit the same freehub, no new wheel required. I even put an 11 speed 11-40 on my 9 speed freehub.

Cheapest method would be, remove the outer chain ring and replace with a bashguard, remove inner smallest ring and replace with chain catch (or just leave in place).

For around maybe $50 used you could grab the 10 speed slx derailleur and shifter.

---
Fwiw I miss having my triple 10% of the time now that I have 1x. I'll probably find a 34/24 double crankset next year.
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Old 04-02-18, 07:20 AM
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M6000 is the most economical choice from the big two. There are 10S off-brand derailleur-shifter combinations on Aliexpress for a third the price, though without a clutch.
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