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Ongoing fork plug loosening saga...

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Old 08-02-18, 11:36 AM
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Ongoing fork plug loosening saga...

My Reynolds Ouzo Pro 1-1/8” fork has been a work in progress for the past several years on my aluminum Flyte SRS3 road bike. I got rid of the factory low end headset that came with the frame thinking an inferior headset was responsible for the “crap” ride that I was getting. While it wasn’t loose loose, I have come to find out that the fork plug really has to be reliably tight before snugging the top cap to pretension the bearing preload.

i got rid of the factory Reynolds plug due to it’s “V” shape that made it pull out slightly under hard braking. My Thomson stem bolts even though torqued to spec would often give ever so slightly and about every 1,500-2,000 miles the tight fuselage feeling (fork and frame conducting road shock across the whole frame) had degenerated to that “crap” feeling that makes taking expansion cracks, bridge joints, and heavy braking downhills a truly nail biting experience.

I now have an Acros integrated headset which appears very well made. I installed it myself with my Cyclus headset press and it was a cool project. But turns out it was not the cause of the crap steering symptom. After I rejected the Reynolds fork plug I switched it out for the well regarded Deda plug. It is longer, the knurling on it is sharper and it expands better across its whole width. I had assembled it “dry” for some dumb reason and had been riding it like that for going on 2 biking seasons. When I diagnosed a creak that only occurred when riding out of the saddle, a closer look revealed the need for the ramped/wedge surfaces and the bolt threads be greased. So now the creak is gone and I’m using a long standard Allen wrench to tighten everything as tight as I dared considering the carbon steerer.

Several times now I have departed on rides thinking to myself that this issue has been finally resolved. But as I said, I ride a lot of bad roads and brake a lot on steep downhills. Apparently I needed to tighten things down even more!

Thanks to greasing the bolts I’ve got good tactile feedback about how I wasn’t going far enough to snug things down. Also, I’m upsizing my levers is to speak - using a 3/8” drive T-bar connected to 3/8” drive Allen sockets. Boy does the tactile feedback from this set up make you aware of when you’re getting close (to spec) compared with a wimpy one sided Allen wrench. The T- bar allows equal force to be applied as you are tightening your fastener. Much more confidence inspiring. Now I did notice that really snugging the plug well will lead to what were loose stem bolts now being - snug. Very interesting. I suppose if a person were truly ham-fisted they could ignore the signs and split right through the carbon steerer, ruining the fork.

So tonight I will depart at 5:30 as I head over to my friendly B/B+/A group ride. I will know if all is well after I subject (what should be an install it and forget it system) my bike to the normal rigors. I don’t consider my self abnormally obsessive/compulsive but damn, certain things that aren’t right when you know how right should feel can drive a person bonkers.
I feel like with full carbon forks, this issue has got to be more prevalent than we know.

I will post an addendum after returning home tonight. I’m hoping for reassuring feedback (from the bike but also this forum).

Last edited by masi61; 08-02-18 at 11:41 AM.
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Old 08-02-18, 01:05 PM
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Obtaining and correctly using a torque wrench will eliminate most of your fastener loosening/component damage woes; I would consider it a must for carbon components. I do not have the calibrated hands claimed by many.
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Old 08-02-18, 02:31 PM
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Originally Posted by dsbrantjr
Obtaining and correctly using a torque wrench will eliminate most of your fastener loosening/component damage woes; I would consider it a must for carbon components. I do not have the calibrated hands claimed by many.
+1 on torque wrench use. Using the sliding T bar for balanced tightening and developing the “calibrated hands” as you say is as important as the torque wrench use I would think.


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Old 08-03-18, 05:15 AM
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The issue is very common with full carbon steerers. Those who are unfamiliar will continue to say that the top cap can be removed after tightening the stem, but this is not true with most carbon forks. Impacts will cause even a properly torqued stem to slip on a carbon steerer and the top cap and plug must be capable of preventing that movement. Carbon assembly paste between the stem and steerer will go a long way toward alleviating this issue.
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Old 08-03-18, 07:27 AM
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The solution is to permanently glue a plug into place, with JD Weld epoxy. It will never loosen again. Pick one that's all metal and clean it well, with naptha, lacquer thinner or acetone. Roughen up the outer surface with 60-80 grit sandpaper. Clean and lightly scuff the inside of the steering tube before applying glue and tightening the plug at the desired height.

Another approach that I detailed again recently involves permanently gluing in a start nut, made for a smaller 1" steel steering tube. That's a bit more involved, but it will never move once it's glued in.

Threadless steerer tubes, expansion plugs/star nuts, spacers and stem stack height
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Old 08-04-18, 08:53 AM
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I have had good luck using the specialized steerer plug. It's longer than most other plugs, and tightening the plug into the steerer is separate from adding preload for the headset bearings. It's only $10, and can be removed if needed. I've never needed to tighten mine after the initial installation.
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Old 08-04-18, 09:52 AM
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~o) ...(1st cuppa in hand)

A very simple lathe project.. when done, epoxied into the carbon fork steerer..
Make a plug of aluminum, with a hole down the center, threaded with a 6x1mm tap..

outer surface left rough.. for better epoxy bonding.


...
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Old 08-04-18, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by DaveSSS
The solution is to permanently glue a plug into place, with JD Weld epoxy. It will never loosen again. Pick one that's all metal and clean it well, with naptha, lacquer thinner or acetone. Roughen up the outer surface with 60-80 grit sandpaper. Clean and lightly scuff the inside of the steering tube before applying glue and tightening the plug at the desired height.

Another approach that I detailed again recently involves permanently gluing in a start nut, made for a smaller 1" steel steering tube. That's a bit more involved, but it will never move once it's glued in.

Threadless steerer tubes, expansion plugs/star nuts, spacers and stem stack height
I'm not sure I am at that point yet. I did rides both Tuesday evening and Thursday evening with good results. Using the T-bar and really tightening things well makes the front end of the bike much more taut. If I pick up the front wheel and drop it a few inches you get a poised bounce when it hits the ground not an electric thud. If I get slippage again I plan to put carbon paste on the interior of the Thomson stem and see if that helps. Right now my stem bolts are greased, but I might try locktite if they loosen. I noticed that the Tom Ritchey stem I purchased for another bike uses factory locktite on the stem bolts.
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