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Brakepads, cool-fin or not

Old 08-18-18, 12:38 PM
  #1  
smurof
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Brakepads, cool-fin or not

It's time to change brakepads on my CX.

I have Shimano SM-RT56-S rotors.

Rear-brake... I had my bike in for "annual tune up" som time ago.. and they changed it.. to J02A-resin,.. with cool-fin

Front... i changed my self the last time... (first time on that bike).. and it was original J02A.... the shop was sold out, but the guy said it's not a big deal... so i got the G01S in stead.... and it has been ok.

I have heard that with my rotors.. (and since i don't rolling down the Alps and things like that"... it's no really need for cool fin
(so i guess the guy that took the last service.. put on a pad with cool fin... just to get mor money.... (not too big difference but..)

So one simle queistion.
Cool fin or not.
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Old 08-18-18, 12:49 PM
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Tell everyone about your high speed descents? do you have a lot of them?

Already have aluminum hub discs , with a steel outer ring..? they dissipate heat, also..
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Old 08-18-18, 01:15 PM
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The rotors says resin-pads only.

There is some decsents both gravel and asphalt.. and somtimes a little bit rougher (like (not to steep) slalom-slope).....

I did'nt get what you ment with --Already have aluminum hub discs , with a steel outer ring.--... so I hope the pictures wil help.


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Old 08-18-18, 01:29 PM
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This graph shows how much ups and downs i go...
Descents on asphalt i brake-loose-brake-loose-brake... as i feel like, same on gravel...
When its more rough i tend to hold the brakes more to ride as slow i can to feel safe
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Old 08-18-18, 01:31 PM
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yours are not ones where the disc is riveted on closer to its edges..






stainless steel does not dissipate heat any where like aluminum will.

so until you replace the disc, the fins added to the pad backing is all you can do.

hydraulic discs heat the brake fluid, unless the heat can be shed some other way..

..
I just ride around town, disc brakes in winter rainy season ... there, I don't need anything special..

you mostly complaining they used what they had in stock when you came in,
and wished you could have saved a couple bucks on the work done?





....

Last edited by fietsbob; 08-18-18 at 01:42 PM.
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Old 08-18-18, 02:05 PM
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I don't complain...
I just want to know if there is any point for me, with my kind of riding (no winter, no rain)... to buy pads with fins...
There is not that big a different in price, but a buck here and and buck there.....

btw...

it was to different places with the service (this summer)... and the place i bought the pads back in the fall of 2016..

And my english is noth that good, and google translate was not much help...
What did you mean with heat-things you said.

... and is it any point to change the rotors?.. is the rotors i got a cheap version?

Last edited by smurof; 08-18-18 at 02:11 PM. Reason: Ad more info
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Old 08-18-18, 02:11 PM
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So what's the cost difference? (look it up)

my BB7 pads aftermarket from Kool stop are quieter than the factory stock.
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Old 08-18-18, 02:21 PM
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You're current setup is fine. If you never notice brake fade, just run what you think is cheap. My mtb has your same setup and I've never had a problem where I live. I don't have cooling fins, I have cheaper discs. All deore.
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Old 08-18-18, 02:42 PM
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J02A about 20 usd
G01S abou 9 usd
have not checked non-shimano pads.
.... on my preferd online shop.
For me personally... non of the prices is "frightning"... my bikes are my kids.... (and you can't put price on them...un til a sertain point off course)
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Old 08-18-18, 02:47 PM
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And if I upgrade my rotors.... how will I feel the difference?
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Old 08-18-18, 03:05 PM
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Well, assuming that you have right now 160mm, going to 180mm would make sense if you would go downhill a lot. However, you have currently as far as I understand no fading issues, so it is not needed.
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Old 08-18-18, 10:25 PM
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thanks
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Old 08-18-18, 11:05 PM
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If you're not noticing fade you don't need any additional heat management so the fins will do nothing for you. The big obvious sign to recommend fins/icetech rotors is when the rotor is discolored.
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Old 08-19-18, 11:47 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by smurof View Post
And if I upgrade my rotors.... how will I feel the difference?
There is always the Placebo effect,

IE, once you have spent the money, you rationalize it is now much better.

< psychology>




....
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Old 08-19-18, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
There is always the Placebo effect,

IE, once you have spent the money, you rationalize it is now much better.

< psychology>




....
never underestimate placebo :+)
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Old 08-19-18, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by smurof View Post
I don't complain...
I just want to know if there is any point for me, with my kind of riding (no winter, no rain)... to buy pads with fins...
There is not that big a different in price, but a buck here and and buck there.....

btw...

it was to different places with the service (this summer)... and the place i bought the pads back in the fall of 2016..

And my english is noth that good, and google translate was not much help...
What did you mean with heat-things you said.

... and is it any point to change the rotors?.. is the rotors i got a cheap version?
If money is an issue, do your own maintenance. Here in the US a full tune-up (without any pad replacement) is $100 or so. For that money you could buy larger rotors and finned pads and still have many $ left.

As others have said, if you don't experience fading, no need to upgrade. If you need more braking power in general, get larger rotors and get some that are allowed for metallic pads. Metallic pads conduct heat better in addition. Larger rotors give you more braking power and heat dissipation surface.
Some over-engineering never hurts.
I prefer larger rotor in front to have a front bias when braking, like 180f/160r. or 204f/180r. YMMV.
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Old 08-19-18, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by smurof View Post
It's time to change brakepads on my CX.

I have Shimano SM-RT56-S rotors.

Rear-brake... I had my bike in for "annual tune up" som time ago.. and they changed it.. to J02A-resin,.. with cool-fin

Front... i changed my self the last time... (first time on that bike).. and it was original J02A.... the shop was sold out, but the guy said it's not a big deal... so i got the G01S in stead.... and it has been ok.

I have heard that with my rotors.. (and since i don't rolling down the Alps and things like that"... it's no really need for cool fin
(so i guess the guy that took the last service.. put on a pad with cool fin... just to get mor money.... (not too big difference but..)

So one simle queistion.
Cool fin or not.
It isn't just about fin or not. The Shimano codes precisely tell you everything you need to know about the pad. Not only the media itself, but the backing plate material and fins.

See:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

For everything you could want to know about Shimano disc rotors/pads. Pad differences are defined in rows 73-81
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Old 08-19-18, 02:37 PM
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Brake fade is one of the scariest moments in cycling.

Not finding out the limits of my brakes is worth the extra money to me and "No need" isn't a good enough reason not to get finned pads.

Everyone needs to make their own choice. That's mine.


-Tim-
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Old 08-20-18, 07:43 AM
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A stupid question. by fading.... you mean that is worning out-process.
I understand the word fade gramaticly in a way... but not 100% sure in this case.

I usually do simple things like pad-change self... but the the ine time it was an overall checku-up of everything..... I feel its ok to do that annualy....
day-to-day maintence.... i usually manage to do.
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Old 08-20-18, 09:22 AM
  #20  
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"Fade" is a name for an increase in the lack of braking function..
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Old 08-20-18, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
"Fade" is a name for an increase in the lack of braking function..
I thoutgh it was something like that...

BTW the pads are chaged.. i went for the G01S...
They are fitted and the wheel rolls smooth... so i will after dinner bed in the pads.
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Old 08-20-18, 10:29 AM
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Following this!
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Old 08-20-18, 01:44 PM
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Fade is typically caused by heat after repeated, hard stops or prolonged braking.

The brakes work fine but then you squeeze the lever (or step on the pedal in a car) and it doesn't stop as well. You squeeze harder and nothing more happens. Worse case is you squeeze the lever as hard as you can and there is nothing.

All friction surfaces have a temperature range in which they operate. Race car brakes operate at a very high temperature but don't function well when cold. Street car brakes function well at lower temperatures but will fade if heated beyond their temperature range due to repeated hard stops like a race car.

Other things can cause fade - off gassing is when the friction material gives off gasses which form a layer between the rotor and pad. This is a problem in automotive brakes. I've not heard of this in cycling. Usually it is heat.


-Tim-
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Old 08-20-18, 05:43 PM
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Originally Posted by TimothyH View Post
Fade is typically caused by heat after repeated, hard stops or prolonged braking.

The brakes work fine but then you squeeze the lever (or step on the pedal in a car) and it doesn't stop as well. You squeeze harder and nothing more happens. Worse case is you squeeze the lever as hard as you can and there is nothing.

All friction surfaces have a temperature range in which they operate. Race car brakes operate at a very high temperature but don't function well when cold. Street car brakes function well at lower temperatures but will fade if heated beyond their temperature range due to repeated hard stops like a race car.

Other things can cause fade - off gassing is when the friction material gives off gasses which form a layer between the rotor and pad. This is a problem in automotive brakes. I've not heard of this in cycling. Usually it is heat.


-Tim-
Well explained. Some people (wrongfully) call brake fluid bubbling fading. That has similar effects for losing brake power, but is not fading. Fading, as you explain, also can happen in cable-operated brakes.
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Old 08-21-18, 07:34 AM
  #25  
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One of the "innovations" we got with flat mount, at least on Shimano calipers, is that the surface area of the brake pad is now substantially smaller compared to post-mount pads like the J02A. So having good heat dissipation on those is more important than ever. This is not a concern for the OP, but I just thought I'd mention it since this is one of the things driving the designs of Shimano's latest rotors with all the fancy vents and vanes to help cool them.
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