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Chain slipping/grinding over teeth; new chain & cassette

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Chain slipping/grinding over teeth; new chain & cassette

Old 03-13-19, 09:48 PM
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Chain slipping/grinding over teeth; new chain & cassette

I have a 10 speed setup on a touring bike,. Sugino x600 (triple) cranks, Ultegra FD and RD. I replaced the chain and experienced that grinding, chain slipping over the cassette. So, took a look at the cassette and it showed signs of wear. I replaced the cassette. So, I have a new (10 sp) chain and a brand new (10 sp) Ultegra cassette.
But when in the middle ring, and middle of the cogs on the rear cassette, and I shift to and easier cog, I get that grinding and slipping. Don't know how to explain it other than or about a half a rotation of the cranks I feel like i am getting "air" (no resistance) than the grinding sound.
I matched the number of links when I replaced the chain. Is the chain too long or too short? Does the derailleur need adjustment?
Any advise would be appreciated.
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Old 03-13-19, 10:07 PM
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Any chance you bought a 9-speed or fewer chain? If so, it might be a touch too wide to fit down on the cog. Also, how far did you ride your new chain on the old cassette? Running a new (un-stretched) chain on an old cassette will quite quickly stretch it out to fit the worn cogs on the cassette. A few hundred miles could make that chain quite "old".

Have you tried this while the bike is on a stand and you can see what's happening?

Ben
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Old 03-13-19, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
Any chance you bought a 9-speed or fewer chain? If so, it might be a touch too wide to fit down on the cog. Also, how far did you ride your new chain on the old cassette? Running a new (un-stretched) chain on an old cassette will quite quickly stretch it out to fit the worn cogs on the cassette. A few hundred miles could make that chain quite "old".

Have you tried this while the bike is on a stand and you can see what's happening?

Ben
The chain is a SRAM 10xx.(1051 or 1071, not sure.) I opened it fresh. I rode the new chain on the old cassette maybe 2-3 rides, less than 50-75 miles.
I will try it in the stand, but typically when this happens the chain is under a little pressure. Usually it happens under the following conditions; in the middle ring up front, middle cog in rear, I shift to a larger (ie easier) gear. So, it happens as i start a hill and am moving to an easier gear.
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Old 03-13-19, 11:17 PM
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How old is the chainring? Are you sure the chain is slipping in back and not on the chainring?

After I posted my first questions I had the thought that I should ask if this cassette is permanently mounted on a carrier or is loose cogs separated by spacers. If the latter, is there any chance you have the spacers wrong so it and its neighbor are too close. (Most of my Campy 9-speed cassettes are loose cogs.)

I wish I had an answer for you, not just questions. Good luck/

Ben
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Old 03-14-19, 12:05 AM
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Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
How old is the chainring? Are you sure the chain is slipping in back and not on the chainring?

After I posted my first questions I had the thought that I should ask if this cassette is permanently mounted on a carrier or is loose cogs separated by spacers. If the latter, is there any chance you have the spacers wrong so it and its neighbor are too close. (Most of my Campy 9-speed cassettes are loose cogs.)

I wish I had an answer for you, not just questions. Good luck/

Ben
The chainrings are original to the 2013 build. The cogs are loose. Maybe the spacers were put in wrong. I may need to bring this one in for a look at the LBS.
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Old 03-14-19, 06:19 AM
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First check the cable tension adjustment for the rear deraileur.

Next check the deraileur hangar alignment. Donít just eyeball it, use a tool, or bring it somehere that does.

Check out the Park Tools website for good insteuctions on how to do these things as well as how to determine chain length (though that is not your problem, here)

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Old 03-15-19, 09:41 PM
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So, strange turn of events. I went down to the garage to prep my touring bike for Sundays Metric Century with my LBS.
All the sudden, out of nowhere, I hear a hissing. My rear tire is deflating right in front of me for no reason. So, I take off the rear wheel and try to figure out whats going on. It turns out the valve is just letting out air. So, I decide to just put a fresh new tube on. After i put the tire and tube on, I am putting the skewer through the axle and ....wiggle wiggle the cassette is loose. So, the screw cap had come loose, probably the issue i had. Also i discovered the chain is not a 10 speed as I had thought. (yes I am getting old) The new chain I put on is 11 speed. So, can you run a 11 speed chain on a 10 speed cassette? I will google it, but as i remember, it should be ok.
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Old 03-15-19, 09:43 PM
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It was a loose cassette....I think that was the problem; cogs moving horizontally
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Old 03-17-19, 06:47 AM
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An 11 sp chain should work on a 10sp cassette.

I had a couple of cogs on my Campy setup that would just be noisy, couldn't stand the sound and didn't use them. I took the cassette off at one point, cleaned it up and put it back and the noise was gone. The spacers were correct as it is hard to mess that up on Campy, but the lockring wasn't tight when I took it off. All fixed and dead quiet now. Moral of the story is to check the lockring as you are doing.
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Old 03-17-19, 06:55 AM
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Yep, sounds like a derailleur adjustment problem. Changing those items out should be an automatic adjustment/check, new vs old may not be the same alignments. The Park Tool video on rear derailleur is what taught me how to do it and all mine shift like butter after following that video.

Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
First check the cable tension adjustment for the rear deraileur.

Next check the deraileur hangar alignment. Donít just eyeball it, use a tool, or bring it somehere that does.

Check out the Park Tools website for good insteuctions on how to do these things as well as how to determine chain length (though that is not your problem, here)

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Old 03-19-19, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by mynewnchome View Post
Yep, sounds like a derailleur adjustment problem. Changing those items out should be an automatic adjustment/check, new vs old may not be the same alignments. The Park Tool video on rear derailleur is what taught me how to do it and all mine shift like butter after following that video.
That video is the best bike repair video out there. It should be included with every indexed bike sold. it would certainly save a lot of grief for the shops selling them.
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Old 03-19-19, 02:19 PM
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Follow up story:
So, I brought it down to the LBS. My favorite mechanic was not in, so another fella took a look at it. I usually like to have this one dude work on my bikes, but he wasn't available. So, I gave the mechanic the back story and also mentioned the FD was kicking the chain off. Asked if he could take a look. I had a Metric Century (group ride) the next day; something I had planned for months and received permission to go on from the wife. So, the shop was busy, I said I would come back in a couple hours. I came back to a surprise. The mechanic tells me:"Not sure what happened, but the freehub is (now) seized." What? Huh? They handed the bike back to me and charged me $20 labor. Thanks man. Ride cancelled, and out $20.
Guess I should have just come back when my favorite mechanic was available.
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Old 03-19-19, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by vintagerando View Post
... I came back to a surprise. The mechanic tells me:"Not sure what happened, but the freehub is (now) seized." What? Huh? They handed the bike back to me and charged me $20 labor. Thanks man. Ride cancelled, and out $20.
Guess I should have just come back when my favorite mechanic was available.
How the what?

Can you use one of your other bikes?
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Old 03-19-19, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by robertorolfo View Post
How the what?

Can you use one of your other bikes?
The mechanic said "yeah this just happenes sometimes..."
Whatever. It's what you call a First World Poblem. I have other bikes....it's just, you know when you have a bike just perfectly prepared; right seat height, lights are charged and ready to go, everything is adjusted just right. Whatever....shop manager said bring it back and we will fix it. No thanks; I can do it myself. Like they say, want something done right, do it yourself. I shouldn't have brought it in the first place.
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Old 03-19-19, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by vintagerando View Post

The mechanic said "yeah this just happenes sometimes..."
Whatever. It's what you call a First World Poblem. I have other bikes....it's just, you know when you have a bike just perfectly prepared; right seat height, lights are charged and ready to go, everything is adjusted just right. Whatever....shop manager said bring it back and we will fix it. No thanks; I can do it myself. Like they say, want something done right, do it yourself. I shouldn't have brought it in the first place.
Very little Integtrity in this World today. Did not fix the Bike and charged you $20 Labor. Not very smart either. Could have made a Customer for life by putting something aside to get you ready for your Ride. Now, you may never visit him again. Brilliant.

Got Wife's Permission? Rarity. Hope you took advantage and adjusted another Bike and went.
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Old 03-19-19, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by vintagerando View Post

The mechanic said "yeah this just happenes sometimes..."
Whatever. It's what you call a First World Poblem. I have other bikes....it's just, you know when you have a bike just perfectly prepared; right seat height, lights are charged and ready to go, everything is adjusted just right. Whatever....shop manager said bring it back and we will fix it. No thanks; I can do it myself. Like they say, want something done right, do it yourself. I shouldn't have brought it in the first place.
Very little integrity in this world today. Did not fix bike and charged you $20 labor. Not too smart either. Could have made a customer for life by putting something aside and getting you ready for your ride. Now, you may never go back there again.

Learn how how to do the stuff yourself. Sure your gonna make some mistakes, but you are going to learn a ton along the way and you will be able to help your friends. Very Satisfying. Jim "The Animal" Feurer said he learned more blowing an engine up then putting one together that didn't. He learned the stress points. That's Hotrodding.

Got wife's Permissions? Rarity.Hope you adjusted another bike and went. Just a thought, couldn't you have taken a rear rim off another bike and used it temporarily?
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Old 03-19-19, 07:22 PM
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Thought first post did not post.
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Old 03-20-19, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by vintagerando View Post
The mechanic said "yeah this just happenes sometimes..."
Whatever. It's what you call a First World Poblem. I have other bikes....it's just, you know when you have a bike just perfectly prepared; right seat height, lights are charged and ready to go, everything is adjusted just right...


Right, it's not the end of the world, but it's lousy if you were looking forward to the ride. And I'd be curious to know what "just happens sometimes," so post and update when the problem is finally solved. They must have tried to fiddle with it because you mentioned a previous problem, but how the heck did they "seize" it?

Originally Posted by "mjac"​​​​
Got wife's Permissions? Rarity.
Aren't they all supposed to succumb to the "would you rather be married to an out of shape couch potato?!" line of reasoning?
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Old 03-20-19, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by robertorolfo View Post
Right, it's not the end of the world, but it's lousy if you were looking forward to the ride. And I'd be curious to know what "just happens sometimes," so post and update when the problem is finally solved. They must have tried to fiddle with it because you mentioned a previous problem, but how the heck did they "seize" it?



Aren't they all supposed to succumb to the "would you rather be married to an out of shape couch potato?!" line of reasoning?
I guess the "just happens sometimes" meant that things just break due to wear. I ordered a 14mm allen wrench (I have a million tools but no 14mm allen wrench) and a new freewheel body. Waiting for them to be delievered. I am fixing it myself. It is a good learning experience;i never tried to fix a modern hub like this one,
As far as the wife, I always tell her, I could start collecting and working on old cars. Would you prefer that?
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