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Space for front brake??

Old 10-11-19, 05:17 AM
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Space for front brake??

Hi what do you think about ? I need more space for this bracket ?

https://alexscycle.com/products/801-...for-700c-fd700


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Old 10-11-19, 05:30 AM
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So,, what's the problem? You might want to clarify you are using a 700 wheel, not a 27 inch wheel. Headset doesn't look right either.
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Old 10-11-19, 05:45 AM
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Originally Posted by trailangel View Post
So,, what's the problem? You might want to clarify you are using a 700 wheel, not a 27 inch wheel. Headset doesn't look right either.
HI wheel 700 , yes I just see the headset ,is not correct.
so they are the sufficient space for installation?
question : this headset was mounted this week by pro mechanic at LBS , what do you think? thank,s

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Old 10-11-19, 11:03 AM
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See this recent thread for more back story. FG brake

No surprise when one doesn't get the answer they wish to seek others' opinions.

In that other thread my first reply suggested that this was the wrong bike to use with a brake (as most every states have a law covering). Admittedly I never answered the OP's real question so here's my answer- There have been a few side pull calipers with exceptionally short reaches. The CLB design from the late 1970s/early 1980s is one. Whether it is short enough is unknown till tried. Good luck finding one to try. Andy
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Old 10-11-19, 11:10 AM
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Is that brake mounting hole plugged? Perhaps designed for Track?

I've seen a few short reach brakes, and think some of the newer ones are short reach. Of course, they can't hang down much on your bike either.

What size of tire are you using?
Distance from center of hole to top of brake track? Bottom of brake track? Center of hole to top of tire?
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Old 10-11-19, 11:13 AM
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As to the headset question- I suspect one (or more?) of a few possibilities. First is using too large ball diameters in the lower stack. Next is not using the lower cup's specific crown race, it might be that the function of this mix is actually fine but the crown race is much taller then what is the usual. Third is that both cup and crown race are of the same spec but a sealing ring is missing, which would have smoothened out the "flow" from the cup to the race. (I doubt this though). Fourth is that there are two retaining rings of balls in the lower stack. (A real stupid boo boo IMO). Fifth is that there are way too many balls (meaning no retaining ring but all loose balls) so that the balls have bunched up and are "climbing" up adjacent balls, therefore lifting/separating the cup and race by more then a properly fitted ball count would. last might be a cartridge bearing in the lower stack instead of loose (or retainered) balls.

However the discovery is simple. First is the function good, no rock but no friction? If so then why fix a working system. By dropping the fork a few CM one can look at the bearing/ball situation to see what's going on WRT the bearings. Usually, but not always, the upper stack and lower stacks use the same bearing design and spec. It would be interesting to see how the two stacks compare. Andy
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Old 10-11-19, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
Is that brake mounting hole plugged? Perhaps designed for Track?

I've seen a few short reach brakes, and think some of the newer ones are short reach. Of course, they can't hang down much on your bike either.

What size of tire are you using?
Distance from center of hole to top of brake track? Bottom of brake track? Center of hole to top of tire?
Hi tomorrow I give you the asked mesurements asked.
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Old 10-11-19, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart View Post
As to the headset question- I suspect one (or more?) of a few possibilities. First is using too large ball diameters in the lower stack. Next is not using the lower cup's specific crown race, it might be that the function of this mix is actually fine but the crown race is much taller then what is the usual. Third is that both cup and crown race are of the same spec but a sealing ring is missing, which would have smoothened out the "flow" from the cup to the race. (I doubt this though). Fourth is that there are two retaining rings of balls in the lower stack. (A real stupid boo boo IMO). Fifth is that there are way too many balls (meaning no retaining ring but all loose balls) so that the balls have bunched up and are "climbing" up adjacent balls, therefore lifting/separating the cup and race by more then a properly fitted ball count would. last might be a cartridge bearing in the lower stack instead of loose (or retainered) balls.

However the discovery is simple. First is the function good, no rock but no friction? If so then why fix a working system. By dropping the fork a few CM one can look at the bearing/ball situation to see what's going on WRT the bearings. Usually, but not always, the upper stack and lower stacks use the same bearing design and spec. It would be interesting to see how the two stacks compare. Andy
Hi Andy the crown is too small , tomorrow I tell you when I drop the fork, but the parts are from diferents hs. the mesurement are fork 26,4mm and the dead tube 30,2 , I will find other hs , maybee Campy threaded .
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Old 10-11-19, 12:04 PM
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Maybe try some 650b/27.5 inch wheels
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Old 10-12-19, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
Is that brake mounting hole plugged? Perhaps designed for Track?

I've seen a few short reach brakes, and think some of the newer ones are short reach. Of course, they can't hang down much on your bike either.

What size of tire are you using?
Distance from center of hole to top of brake track? Bottom of brake track? Center of hole to top of tire?
Hi here the mesurements:
center of hole to top of brake track :32mm
""""""""""""""""bottom of brake track :43mm
"""""""""""""""center of hole to top of tire: 13mm
the bubular will be 22mm
also Alex cycle saiy I can use this:
https://alexscycle.com/products/801-...77f2619d&_ss=r
so ????
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Old 10-12-19, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart View Post
As to the headset question- I suspect one (or more?) of a few possibilities. First is using too large ball diameters in the lower stack. Next is not using the lower cup's specific crown race, it might be that the function of this mix is actually fine but the crown race is much taller then what is the usual. Third is that both cup and crown race are of the same spec but a sealing ring is missing, which would have smoothened out the "flow" from the cup to the race. (I doubt this though). Fourth is that there are two retaining rings of balls in the lower stack. (A real stupid boo boo IMO). Fifth is that there are way too many balls (meaning no retaining ring but all loose balls) so that the balls have bunched up and are "climbing" up adjacent balls, therefore lifting/separating the cup and race by more then a properly fitted ball count would. last might be a cartridge bearing in the lower stack instead of loose (or retainered) balls.

However the discovery is simple. First is the function good, no rock but no friction? If so then why fix a working system. By dropping the fork a few CM one can look at the bearing/ball situation to see what's going on WRT the bearings. Usually, but not always, the upper stack and lower stacks use the same bearing design and spec. It would be interesting to see how the two stacks compare. Andy
Hi Andy today I dropm the fork ,the bearings are the both same.the retainer keep the balls correctly, the bearings retainers are not too large,, I think the do not match the crown race ,( the crown race is too small )and I don,t see sealing ring, What do tou mean about? , respect to the front brake I send the front mesurement with the other post.
Many tank,s
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Old 10-12-19, 10:59 AM
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Not sure of all you wrote...

If your "too small" reference is about the crown's seat for the race then do know that has nothing to do with the outer shape of the crown race. It's ID is independent of the ball track shape, in face many headsets have come in both seat diameters with the ability to interchange races (due to fork changes or milling the old fork's race to the 26.4 size) but keep the reminder of the headset.

If that reference is about the ball track portion of the race then one would think the race would fit into the cup more then intended, not stick out as the photo shows. However if the race is TALLER then, yes, the ball track could be smaller then wanted and still not fit somewhat flush with the cup.

Some headsets have a plastic/"rubber" seal that rides between the race and cup edges. If it were missing you wouldn't see it.

Did the shop install the headset? (I now read that they did so...) Did they have the fork on hand too? Did they say anything about all this mates together? If you bought the headset from them did they return the unused parts (and if you provided the headset they certainly owe you your "spare" parts).?

By your measurements the caliper(brake) reach you need is about 37mm, as most short reach calipers are limited to about 39mm AND that the measurement location that the pads are actually at is about 15mm ahead of the face of the crown and since the rim continues it upward curve (due to the fork being raked) the real life reach is about 1 or 2mm less then what's measured right next to the crown's face. So a real life reach is more likely to be about 36mms. Good luck finding such a caliper. My Sutherlands Manual suggests that a few Dia Comp calipers (from the early 1980s IIRC) have a minimum reach of about 37mm. One can always file the top edge of the pad to avoid tire side wall contact. Andy
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Old 10-12-19, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart View Post
Not sure of all you wrote...

If your "too small" reference is about the crown's seat for the race then do know that has nothing to do with the outer shape of the crown race. It's ID is independent of the ball track shape, in face many headsets have come in both seat diameters with the ability to interchange races (due to fork changes or milling the old fork's race to the 26.4 size) but keep the reminder of the headset.

If that reference is about the ball track portion of the race then one would think the race would fit into the cup more then intended, not stick out as the photo shows. However if the race is TALLER then, yes, the ball track could be smaller then wanted and still not fit somewhat flush with the cup.

Some headsets have a plastic/"rubber" seal that rides between the race and cup edges. If it were missing you wouldn't see it.

Did the shop install the headset? (I now read that they did so...) Did they have the fork on hand too? Did they say anything about all this mates together? If you bought the headset from them did they return the unused parts (and if you provided the headset they certainly owe you your "spare" parts).?

By your measurements the caliper(brake) reach you need is about 37mm, as most short reach calipers are limited to about 39mm AND that the measurement location that the pads are actually at is about 15mm ahead of the face of the crown and since the rim continues it upward curve (due to the fork being raked) the real life reach is about 1 or 2mm less then what's measured right next to the crown's face. So a real life reach is more likely to be about 36mms. Good luck finding such a caliper. My Sutherlands Manual suggests that a few Dia Comp calipers (from the early 1980s IIRC) have a minimum reach of about 37mm. One can always file the top edge of the pad to avoid tire side wall contact. Andy
I would like to say : the crown race seem to have too small outside diameter vs the cup. Yes the shop was the fork/ frame on and when them install the hs. the race is from 1 headset and the 2 cups from other ,so here the incompatibility. teh headtube internal diameter is 30,2mm and the steer tube base 26,4mm so I will drop all the hs and I can mount Campy theaded hs , they are a lot on the bay .recpect to the front brake Alexcycle show this :
https://alexscycle.com/products/801-seisakusho-geta-spacers?_pos=1&_sid=077f2619d&_ss=r
expensive but :::
When I say the crown race OD IS too small I say the base plate is smaller than the cup.

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Old 10-12-19, 08:52 PM
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Interesting possible solution, the off set axle washers. Do try it and let us know how they work for you. Andy
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