NMRoller

Removing the crank from one old Gitane to put on another. I have already removed the cotter crank arms (yeah, victory!) Now I need to remove the mechanism from the bottom bracket. Do I need a special crank pulling tool for this job? It appears the outer ring has a tab holding it in place so I can just back out the center ring.

Thanks in advance!

Bill Kapaun

Loosen the lock nut and it will come apart on the NDS.
Fixed cup takes more effort.

desconhecido 

The proper tool for removing the adjustable cup (lh side) is a hook spanner such as the Sugino BB tool. There is a Park tool that might be the same functional thing and they're cheaper. I've never used a Park.

So, you use the hook spanner to remove the ring and then the adjustable cup should be easy to unscrew, maybe by hand. If you don't care about the old BB, you could use a hammer and punch to remove the ring. On the left, both the ring and cup are normal rh thread.

Then, you've got the fixed cup on the RHS which, being a French bike, is probably rh thread also.Depending on design, you may need an odd tool to remove it. Or, you might be able to unscrew it by clamping the fixed cup in a bench vise with good jaws. Rotate the bike to unscrew. Or, you could try the famous Sheldon Brown removal method. Many people have luck with that.

Curious, what BB and crank are you going to install?

NMRoller

Thanks Bill! Exactly as you say. Lock nut came free easily enough. Now to the fixed cup...saw a Sheldon Brown trick.

NMRoller

Thanks! My apologies for not being clear. I am removing parts from one Gitane and putting them on another to make a complete and rideable bike. So, just re-using it.

Don't have a hook spanner handy. So, I gently used a chain wrench that I did have on the adjustable side. Need the hook spanner to put it back on and have inquired with Park as to which one I need.

Having trouble with the fixed cup. Going to try the Sheldon Brown trick.

Bill Kapaun

Will Sheldon's method destroy the cup/
Here's what I do-

desconhecido 

The key to the Sheldon method is that the torque which tightens the bolt and nut inserted into the cup is in the same direction as the torque needed to unscrew the cup. So, with LHT you tighten from the right side but if the cup is RHT, like a French BB should be, you tighten from the inside with a socket, short extension, and a ratchet or flex handle. Of course, I'm assuming that the right cup is French threaded and not Swiss. I've no personal experience with French bikes and bottom brackets for cottered cranks. Perhaps if you can id the maker of the BB, someone will be able to tell from experience whether Swiss threading is even a possibility. The spindle may be branded.

If you post a picture of the fixed cup, someone may be able to tell if there is a tool available for removal -- perhaps the tool pictured in the suggestion above if the cup is the flattened ellipse shape. Here's an Ebay ad for the Sugino tool that I've used for a long time. It may be the shape you need for your fixed cup as well as the hook spanner. Good suggestion above for a way to make sure the tool gets a good grip on the fixed cup.

NMRoller

Thanks Bill!

NMRoller

Thanks! First step is to pull out the Simple Green and clean it up. Then I am going to soak it in Liquid Wrench. That'll give me enough time to put together a bolt. Based on the year (early `70s Gitane) and that the adjustable side was RHT, I'm presuming that the drive side is also RHT. I plan to go slow. I'll post a pic once she's cleaned up.

Thanks also for the eBay link. Always need more useful tools.

Bill Kapaun

You can probably look through the NDS side and see enough threads.
I lean the bike on its side, fixed cup down
Squirt PO into the shell a few threads above the cup and let it run down into the threads. The upper shell/cup thread will act like a little reservoir. Just a few drops and let it run into the "reservoir".
Repeat multiple times as it works down the threads. Between TV commercials seems to work. Several hours.
If you get it dripping out the bottom, that's good, since there is only 1 thread. I actually use a small hypo just to keep the quantity applied small and not running all over.

3alarmer 

....I have never gotten that Sheldon homemade tool to work on a French or Italian (RH threaded cup). They are installed originally with high torque because otherwise they will back out in use. If you are just robbing parts from a frame you don't plan on reusing, the best way by far to extract an old RH threaded fixed cup that has been in place many years is with a lot of heat, using a propane or MAPP gas torch. (Or any welding torch, if you happen to have one set up).

Good luck, but as stated above somewhere, that bolt/nut/washers kludge can in many instances damage the fixed cup you are trying to re-use.

You can use it to hold the cup wrench in place, as pictured also above. That gives you a better shot at success. This topic comes up a lot on BF, so there are a lot of other threads on it. But if there's no concerns about the paint on the old frame you're stripping, a lot of heat is the way to go.

Lock ring pliers are way better than a hook spanner, but they cost more. If you're only doing one of these, it's probably not worth the investment.

3alarmer 

NMRoller

Thanks! Always in the market for useful tools. There are some jobs that a chain wrench is just too heavy handed for.

JohnDThompson 

Functionally equivalent, at a fraction of the cost:


https://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-Lockring-Pliers/

NMRoller

Ladies and Gentlemen, thank you, thank you, thank you for all the encouragement and great advice. With a lot of soaking (Thanks Bill) while rotating the frame on the bike stand, application of heat from the wife's embossing gun (Thanks Michael), it easily rotated off with a large wrench and a little bow grease.

Now, the trick will be to install it with enough torque so it doesn't come off while isolated on some lonely, gravel road. Gonna need a torque wrench bigger than I have. Perhaps snugging it up and let the drive side crank do the rest?

Bill Kapaun

Nope. Basically the balls are turning backwards which tends to loosen the cup. Precession?
You can use my removal tool set up to install. You just don't need the 4 lb. hammer.

3alarmer 

...I have one of those Hozan fixed cup tools, and I still don't trust that it's torqued tightly enough with that (although it probably is).
So at this point I never install a RH threaded fixed cup (French or Italian) without using blue Loctite on the threads. The ones I install are gonna be someone else's removal problem anyway.

Dan Burkhart 

In that case you may as well use red loctite and then you really wont have to worry about it coming loose. Plus you can have a giggle just thinking about the poor schmuck that will be dealing with it in 30 or 40 years.

3alarmer 

...I find myself chuckling to myself a lot these days. All my old bikes will probably get hauled off to the dump anyway. My wife promises me that at least once monthly.