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Derailleur or shifter?

Old 07-24-20, 04:08 AM
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trek330
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Derailleur or shifter?

I have a situation shifting my 2005 Lemond Tourmalet triple.When I shift into the middle gear from low or high it shifts with no problem but there is some noise and when I shift to the last 2 big rings in the back there is chain rub on the front derailleur.I then have to give it another little shift and it will fall into place(the derailleur) and work well and silent.There is no need to double shift when shifting to either the big or little ring up front.The front derailleur is the original Shimano 105 and the brifter is also Shimano 105.I don't know if this is a problem with the shifter or if the derailleur is malfunctioning.Any advice would be appreciated.
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Old 07-24-20, 07:07 AM
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The issue with old shifters is usually that they are quiet, as in the ratchet pawls not moving freely as the lube has become gummy. Noise when shifting is generally a chain/cod/der thing. Your description is lacking specific details such as "when I shift to the last 2 big rings in the back there is chain rub on the front derailleur.I then have to give it another little shift and it will fall into place(the derailleur) and work well and silent" which der is "it"?

have you checked the rear shift cable condition inside the lever for fraying? Besides that when was the last time you lubed the shifter internals and with what lube? (Not that this shifter lube likely has anything to do with your issues but is still good maintenance). Andy
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Old 07-24-20, 07:28 AM
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"It" meaning front derailleur.I have no issues in the rear.
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Old 07-24-20, 07:43 AM
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I would guess the shifter. It sounds like you are shifting and then needing to trim, single click, as the chain gets to the lower end of the cassette. What I don’t know is it you can adjust it out, or replace the cable; or if the shifter is gummed or too worn.

John
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Old 07-24-20, 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
I would guess the shifter. It sounds like you are shifting and then needing to trim, single click, as the chain gets to the lower end of the cassette. What I donít know is it you can adjust it out, or replace the cable; or if the shifter is gummed or too worn.

John
Yes trim is the right description.I'm going to try to replace the cable and oil and see what happens.Thanks.
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Old 07-24-20, 09:06 AM
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I am going to guess you have 3 x 9 speed 105 components (FD-5703 and ST-57-04). The Shimano setup and operation manual is at https://si.shimano.com/pdfs/si/SI-5LX0B-001-ENG.pdf. This combination of shifter and front derailleur have a trim step when set up properly. Can be exasperating to set up but once dialed in they work well.
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Old 07-24-20, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Eggman84 View Post
I am going to guess you have 3 x 9 speed 105 components (FD-5703 and ST-57-04). The Shimano setup and operation manual is at https://si.shimano.com/pdfs/si/SI-5LX0B-001-ENG.pdf. This combination of shifter and front derailleur have a trim step when set up properly. Can be exasperating to set up but once dialed in they work well.
front is 105 FD-5504 rear is Ultegra .6500 triple.
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Old 07-24-20, 12:18 PM
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Never was a fan of STI Front shifters, myself ,,

You can un hook the cable and test the FD mechs separately..






..

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Old 07-24-20, 01:01 PM
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Sounds to me like your trim is working as it should?
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Old 07-24-20, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Eggman84 View Post
I am going to guess you have 3 x 9 speed 105 components (FD-5703 and ST-57-04). The Shimano setup and operation manual is at https://si.shimano.com/pdfs/si/SI-5LX0B-001-ENG.pdf. This combination of shifter and front derailleur have a trim step when set up properly. Can be exasperating to set up but once dialed in they work well.
I checked out the Shimano link you gave me and it seems this trimming function is normal not a malfunction.Or am I misunderstanding and the trimming is for adjustment purposes?
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Old 07-24-20, 04:05 PM
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I don't remember about 105 9-speed shifters but I can tell you for sure that Ultegra 9-speed shifters had four distinct shift positions for the front. They actually used the exact same shifter for both double and triple cranksets. As a double you got two shift positions for each chainring. As a triple you got one shift position for the granny, two for the middle ring and one for the big ring.
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Old 07-24-20, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by trek330 View Post
I checked out the Shimano link you gave me and it seems this trimming function is normal not a malfunction.Or am I misunderstanding and the trimming is for adjustment purposes?

This is how a 3 x 9 Ultegra FD and shifter (of the same vintage as your 105) that I have functions:Upshifts - 4 clicks (steps)


3 clicks (first one barely moves the FD and is almost unnoticeable) to shift from the SCR to the MCR. On some bikes it only takes 2 clicks to move from the SCR to the MCR (depending on the initial cable tension).

1 click to shift from the MCR to the LCR.


Downshifts - 3 clicks (steps)


1 click to shift from the LCR to the MCR

1 click as trim (only comes into play once the chain is on the MCR)

1 click to shift from the MCR to the SCR (I assume this click incorporates the very 1st small 1st click I described in the upshift - don't know why its not really noticeable on the downshift)


I suggest you put your bike in a stand and then slowly go thru various combinations (particularly in the large and small cogs) to see how you can trim your front derailleur to avoid chain rub. Some combinations, like big/big and small/small you probably will not be able to eliminate chain rub but most people try to avoid this "cross chaining".


You can also watch the Park Tool video on adjusting front derailleurs
. They discuss Shimano shifters that have the trim feature starting at minute 12;00.


Stick with it and you will see how it works. Good luck. Karl
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