Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Bicycle Mechanics
Reload this Page >

Grease outside of chainring bolts?

Notices
Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

Grease outside of chainring bolts?

Old 02-18-21, 09:16 PM
  #1  
fholt
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
fholt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC
Posts: 253

Bikes: 2006 Novara Randonee, 2009 Fuji Cross Pro, 2013 Specialized Roubaix Pro, 2013 Allez Smartweld A5 Frankenbike, 2021 Diverge Comp Carbon

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 1 Post
Grease outside of chainring bolts?

So I recently hit the wall regarding wear on the drivetrain. Replacing the chain caused noise (chainring) and skipping (cassette). Most of the wear on the crankset is on the small ring, so I replaced only that one, along with the chain and cassette. So I don't have any spec regarding how hard to torque the chainring bolts, nor whether to grease them. I greased the male threads as usual, and torqued them to somewhere near 80 in/lb (off the scale on my low range Park torque wrench). Riding it finds the crankset really creaky.

Is increasing torque or greasing the outside of the sleeve where it meets the chain rings and spider the next step?
__________________
-------------------------------
'06 Novara Randonee
'09 Fuji Cross Pro
'13 Specialized Roubaix Pro
'13 Specialized Allez Smartweld Frankenbike
'21 Diverge Comp Carbon

Last edited by fholt; 02-19-21 at 06:15 AM.
fholt is offline  
Old 02-18-21, 09:21 PM
  #2  
fholt
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
fholt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC
Posts: 253

Bikes: 2006 Novara Randonee, 2009 Fuji Cross Pro, 2013 Specialized Roubaix Pro, 2013 Allez Smartweld A5 Frankenbike, 2021 Diverge Comp Carbon

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 1 Post
FSA Crankset on the Fuji 209 Cross bike if it matters
__________________
-------------------------------
'06 Novara Randonee
'09 Fuji Cross Pro
'13 Specialized Roubaix Pro
'13 Specialized Allez Smartweld Frankenbike
'21 Diverge Comp Carbon
fholt is offline  
Old 02-18-21, 10:16 PM
  #3  
cxwrench
Senior Member
 
cxwrench's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Nor-Cal
Posts: 1,811

Bikes: lots

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 822 Post(s)
Liked 1,046 Times in 585 Posts
Yes, grease. Uhhmmmm...95% wear? 95% of what?
cxwrench is offline  
Likes For cxwrench:
Old 02-18-21, 11:01 PM
  #4  
veganbikes
Clark W. Griswold
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: ,location, location
Posts: 8,629

Bikes: Foundry Chilkoot Ti W/Ultegra Di2, Salsa Timberjack Ti, Cinelli Mash Work RandoCross Fun Time Machine, 1x9 XT Parts Hybrid, Co-Motion Cascadia, Specialized Langster, Phil Wood Apple VeloXS Frame (w/DA 7400), Cilo Road Frame, Proteus frame, Ti 26 MTB

Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2379 Post(s)
Liked 1,380 Times in 925 Posts
Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
Yes, grease. Uhhmmmm...95% wear? 95% of what?
Of the 43% of people who enjoy the taste of red wine but don't like UB40 but do enjoy Neil Diamond if they are in the right mood. Know your math.
veganbikes is offline  
Likes For veganbikes:
Old 02-18-21, 11:18 PM
  #5  
base2 
Random Internet Person.
 
base2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 1,619

Bikes: 5 good ones, and the occasional project.

Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 824 Post(s)
Liked 396 Times in 246 Posts
Chain ring bolts get torqued to about 5 to 7 newton meters. Off the top of my head thats about 45 inch pounds. Any more & there's a good chance of breaking the chain ring bolt; Especially if it is an aluminum bolt.

I do chainring bolt threads at 5nm with blue Loctite 242. Grease is ok too, but may need a retorque at some point, in my experience.

Creakiness & whatnot indicates other issues.


FWIW: It doesn't hurt to label your units. You torqued to 80 what? Foot pounds? Inch pounds? Newton meters? Help us help you by properly & concisely conveying information in conventiontional terms. If you want to be taken seriously, proper prepositions, grammer, & sentance structure are a must. Hence the light & totally justified mockery above.

Last edited by base2; 02-18-21 at 11:28 PM.
base2 is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 05:44 AM
  #6  
dsbrantjr
Senior Member
 
dsbrantjr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Roswell, GA
Posts: 8,101

Bikes: '93 Trek 750, '92 Schwinn Crisscross, '93 Mongoose Alta

Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1346 Post(s)
Liked 851 Times in 595 Posts
I grease only the male threads and keep the contact surfaces clean. And as base2 mentions, units are crucial. Confusion regarding units has resulted in the loss of an interplanetary spacecraft: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_C...cecraft_design
dsbrantjr is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 06:17 AM
  #7  
fholt
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
fholt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC
Posts: 253

Bikes: 2006 Novara Randonee, 2009 Fuji Cross Pro, 2013 Specialized Roubaix Pro, 2013 Allez Smartweld A5 Frankenbike, 2021 Diverge Comp Carbon

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 1 Post
Apologies for the messy post - I have cleaned it up. Thankfully I'm not allowed to have anything to do with interplanetary craft - just my creaky bike.
__________________
-------------------------------
'06 Novara Randonee
'09 Fuji Cross Pro
'13 Specialized Roubaix Pro
'13 Specialized Allez Smartweld Frankenbike
'21 Diverge Comp Carbon
fholt is offline  
Likes For fholt:
Old 02-19-21, 07:51 AM
  #8  
ClydeClydeson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 725
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 243 Post(s)
Liked 337 Times in 218 Posts
As dsbrantjr says, grease the threads but keep all other surfaces clean. If you grease the outside of the chainring bolt/nut combo, it will turn in its hole on the chainring and this will keep it from tightening.

If you have the chainring bolts even moderately tight and you're still getting creaking, it's not the chainring bolts that are causing it.

Other possible causes:
Bottom bracket spindle interface with crank arms
Bottom bracket bearing/cup interface with frame
Saddle rails
Cable housings in housing stops
ClydeClydeson is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 08:12 AM
  #9  
fholt
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
fholt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC
Posts: 253

Bikes: 2006 Novara Randonee, 2009 Fuji Cross Pro, 2013 Specialized Roubaix Pro, 2013 Allez Smartweld A5 Frankenbike, 2021 Diverge Comp Carbon

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 1 Post
Thanks, I've recently had the BB serviced - I'll pull the rings back off and make sure all contact surfaces are clean and see if that helps.
__________________
-------------------------------
'06 Novara Randonee
'09 Fuji Cross Pro
'13 Specialized Roubaix Pro
'13 Specialized Allez Smartweld Frankenbike
'21 Diverge Comp Carbon
fholt is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 09:59 AM
  #10  
cxwrench
Senior Member
 
cxwrench's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Nor-Cal
Posts: 1,811

Bikes: lots

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 822 Post(s)
Liked 1,046 Times in 585 Posts
Originally Posted by ClydeClydeson View Post
As dsbrantjr says, grease the threads but keep all other surfaces clean. If you grease the outside of the chainring bolt/nut combo, it will turn in its hole on the chainring and this will keep it from tightening.

If you have the chainring bolts even moderately tight and you're still getting creaking, it's not the chainring bolts that are causing it.

Other possible causes:
Bottom bracket spindle interface with crank arms
Bottom bracket bearing/cup interface with frame
Saddle rails
Cable housings in housing stops
Guess I better go clean the grease off the outside of a few thousand chainring bolts/nuts. I'm sure I've skipped a few but I have greased 99.999% of the bolts/nuts I've ever installed. Nuts spinning is not a problem...there's a tool for that.
cxwrench is offline  
Likes For cxwrench:
Old 02-19-21, 10:06 AM
  #11  
Andrew R Stewart 
Senior Member
 
Andrew R Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 15,049

Bikes: Stewart S&S coupled sport tourer, Stewart Sunday light, Stewart Commuting, Stewart Touring, Co Motion Tandem, Stewart 3-Spd, Stewart Track, Fuji Finest, Raleigh Pro, Trek Cycle Cross, Mongoose tomac ATB, GT Bravado ATB, JCP Folder

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2973 Post(s)
Liked 1,259 Times in 882 Posts
Having just Wednesday drilled out a ring bolt that was frozen in place I fully recommend greasing the bolts, and nuts, and insides as well as outsides. Been doing this for decades and haven't suffered a frozen bolt or a self loosening one on both my personal bikes as well as the customers' ones.

But lubrication is much like bathing. That you do it periodically is more the deal then which soap you use. Andy
__________________
AndrewRStewart
Andrew R Stewart is offline  
Likes For Andrew R Stewart:
Old 02-19-21, 10:16 AM
  #12  
Crankycrank
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 2,298
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 432 Post(s)
Liked 301 Times in 234 Posts
I'm with posts 10 & 11. Grease the inner and outer of the chainring bolts/nuts. It isn't always necessary for all riders in the conditions they ride but it sure can't hurt to keep things from getting corroded and stuck. Buy or make a chainring nut tool to hold the slotted nut in place. You'll need one at some point.

Last edited by Crankycrank; 02-19-21 at 10:19 AM.
Crankycrank is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 12:00 PM
  #13  
August West
Senior Member
 
August West's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Land of Enchantment
Posts: 468

Bikes: Domane SLR7 Project One

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 152 Post(s)
Liked 168 Times in 103 Posts
Originally Posted by base2 View Post
Chain ring bolts get torqued to about 5 to 7 newton meters.
Current Shimano specs are 12-16 Nm.
August West is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 12:27 PM
  #14  
ClydeClydeson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 725
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 243 Post(s)
Liked 337 Times in 218 Posts
Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
Guess I better go clean the grease off the outside of a few thousand chainring bolts/nuts. I'm sure I've skipped a few but I have greased 99.999% of the bolts/nuts I've ever installed. Nuts spinning is not a problem...there's a tool for that.
Yes, please, get them back and fix the problem.. Nothing short of a full recall will do, and please post ads in local papers to inform your victims of your mistake

I have the tool, but since I learned to selectively grease certain parts of the bolts and leave other parts dry, I have not needed to use the tool on my own bikes. On others bikes I can never guess how things are assembled.

There was a thread about this exact thing a few weeks ago, including people wo dislike the chainring bolt spanner tool:

Blue locktite under chainring nuts?
ClydeClydeson is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 01:01 PM
  #15  
base2 
Random Internet Person.
 
base2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 1,619

Bikes: 5 good ones, and the occasional project.

Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 824 Post(s)
Liked 396 Times in 246 Posts
Originally Posted by August West View Post
Current Shimano specs are 12-16 Nm.
Thanks for that. It would make sense that steel bolts would be higher.

It's so rare I come across steel chainring bolts for my own uses, I forgot the torque range for steel bolts. Though I do have some extra, extra, extra long (15mm) steel Raceface bolts I installed recently that specify 5nm on the bolt head. Interesting... That probably explains my faulty memory.
__________________
My lights are obscenly bright because drivers are dim.

I shouldn't have to "make myself more visible;" Drivers should just stop running people over.
base2 is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 02:56 PM
  #16  
Litespud
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Chapel Hill NC
Posts: 1,353

Bikes: 2000 Litespeed Vortex Chorus 10, 1995 DeBernardi Cromor S/S, Nashbar 3sp commuter

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 510 Post(s)
Liked 537 Times in 301 Posts
Originally Posted by fholt View Post
So I recently hit the wall regarding wear on the drivetrain. Replacing the chain caused noise (chainring) and skipping (cassette). Most of the wear on the crankset is on the small ring, so I replaced only that one, along with the chain and cassette. So I don't have any spec regarding how hard to torque the chainring bolts, nor whether to grease them. I greased the male threads as usual, and torqued them to somewhere near 80 in/lb (off the scale on my low range Park torque wrench). Riding it finds the crankset really creaky.

Is increasing torque or greasing the outside of the sleeve where it meets the chain rings and spider the next step?
I lightly grease the male threads only, then tighten up as much as the dumb little tool that engages the slots on the back of the Al nuts will allow. I use a 5mm "L" Allen key, so I'm not torquing excessively - I go with what feels appropriate, rather then a set torque setting, but I might try a torque wrench next time. I pull the rings maybe twice a year to give them a proper clean, and I redo everything again - only once did I have a chainring bolt loosen sufficiently between services to cause creaking - retightened all bolts and fixed the issue.

Last edited by Litespud; 02-20-21 at 03:47 PM.
Litespud is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 03:18 PM
  #17  
Kapusta
Cyclochondriac
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,505
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1936 Post(s)
Liked 1,298 Times in 747 Posts
Huh. Never even though about greasing the outsides.
Kapusta is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 03:53 PM
  #18  
cxwrench
Senior Member
 
cxwrench's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Nor-Cal
Posts: 1,811

Bikes: lots

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 822 Post(s)
Liked 1,046 Times in 585 Posts
Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
Huh. Never even though about greasing the outsides.
It makes sense to grease pretty much every place that parts touch on a bike with a very few exceptions.
cxwrench is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 03:58 PM
  #19  
Kapusta
Cyclochondriac
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,505
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1936 Post(s)
Liked 1,298 Times in 747 Posts
Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
It makes sense to grease pretty much every place that parts touch on a bike with a very few exceptions.
I always grease my tubes and grips.
Kapusta is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 10:08 PM
  #20  
Andrew R Stewart 
Senior Member
 
Andrew R Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 15,049

Bikes: Stewart S&S coupled sport tourer, Stewart Sunday light, Stewart Commuting, Stewart Touring, Co Motion Tandem, Stewart 3-Spd, Stewart Track, Fuji Finest, Raleigh Pro, Trek Cycle Cross, Mongoose tomac ATB, GT Bravado ATB, JCP Folder

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2973 Post(s)
Liked 1,259 Times in 882 Posts
Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
I always grease my tubes and grips.
Inner tube grease is called Talc. Andy
__________________
AndrewRStewart
Andrew R Stewart is offline  
Likes For Andrew R Stewart:
Old 02-20-21, 08:16 AM
  #21  
DaveSSS 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 6,440

Bikes: TWO Cinelli superstar disc with SRAM Force AXS

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 683 Post(s)
Liked 315 Times in 253 Posts
Some modern cranks don't have nuts on the chain ring bolts, since they screw into the spider. Shimano bolts from the factory have a thread locking compound on them. I use anti-seize on those.
DaveSSS is offline  
Old 02-20-21, 09:32 AM
  #22  
Kapusta
Cyclochondriac
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,505
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1936 Post(s)
Liked 1,298 Times in 747 Posts
Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart View Post
Inner tube grease is called Talc. Andy
I only use that stuff for wheel bearings.
Kapusta is offline  
Old 02-20-21, 11:52 AM
  #23  
icemilkcoffee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 672
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 398 Post(s)
Liked 283 Times in 177 Posts
Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
Nuts spinning is not a problem...there's a tool for that.
That slot tool is the most useless bicycle tool of all. It never works when you need it to work. Leave the inner nut dry and grease only the outer bolt, and you barely even need the tool.
icemilkcoffee is offline  
Old 02-20-21, 04:14 PM
  #24  
cxwrench
Senior Member
 
cxwrench's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Nor-Cal
Posts: 1,811

Bikes: lots

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 822 Post(s)
Liked 1,046 Times in 585 Posts
Originally Posted by icemilkcoffee View Post
That slot tool is the most useless bicycle tool of all. It never works when you need it to work. Leave the inner nut dry and grease only the outer bolt, and you barely even need the tool.
Funny, I don't seem to have problems w/ them.
cxwrench is offline  
Likes For cxwrench:
Old 02-20-21, 04:48 PM
  #25  
veganbikes
Clark W. Griswold
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: ,location, location
Posts: 8,629

Bikes: Foundry Chilkoot Ti W/Ultegra Di2, Salsa Timberjack Ti, Cinelli Mash Work RandoCross Fun Time Machine, 1x9 XT Parts Hybrid, Co-Motion Cascadia, Specialized Langster, Phil Wood Apple VeloXS Frame (w/DA 7400), Cilo Road Frame, Proteus frame, Ti 26 MTB

Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2379 Post(s)
Liked 1,380 Times in 925 Posts
Originally Posted by icemilkcoffee View Post
That slot tool is the most useless bicycle tool of all. It never works when you need it to work. Leave the inner nut dry and grease only the outer bolt, and you barely even need the tool.
Mine also works just fine and have yet to have issues with it. Shimano TL-FC21 is my go to and it always has done the job. It also works great on my T.A.Extractor Bolts for my square taper cranks.
veganbikes is offline  
Likes For veganbikes:

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.