Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Bicycle Mechanics
Reload this Page >

Internal routing

Notices
Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

Internal routing

Old 05-31-21, 06:21 PM
  #1  
delbiker1 
Mother Nature's Son
Thread Starter
 
delbiker1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Sussex County, Delaware
Posts: 2,444

Bikes: Early 90's Ochsner road, 2006 Schwinn SS DBX, 2014 Orbea Avant MD30, 2004 Airborne Zeppelin TI, 2003 Lemond Poprad, 1989? Fuji Ace, 2001 Lemond Tourmalet, 2014? Soma Smoothie

Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 646 Post(s)
Liked 896 Times in 518 Posts
Internal routing

Today I had my first experience re-cabling my Orbea Avant with internal cable routing. What a pain. Trying to run then new gear cables into the plastic sleeve/hose, or whatever it's called, was not easy. It had kinks in it that made running the cable through very difficult. I wound pulling it all out of the frame to straighten it to enable the cables to pass. Then had to run it back through the holes and frame with the cable inside. The brake cabling was quite easy.

I had partially torn down the Avant a couple of months ago, and am in the process of putting it back together. I am really anxious to find out how it is all operating. I never could get the shifting right on the bike since I bought it in 2016. I pulled the derailleurs and shifters, all 5700 105, off of it to use on a different bike. Once I got them mounted and set up on the other bike, not internal cabling, they have been operating great. Recently I purchase used, but in great shape, 105 shifters and derailleurs and am putting them on the Avant. I am hoping that I got everything situated properly and the shifters and derailleurs will work as they should. I always suspected there was an issue somewhere in the internal cabling when the original 105 components would not shift correctly.

I will finish getting it re-built tomorrow and get it out for a shakedown run. Highly likely I will put it up for sale. It is not one of the bikes that I ride a lot. I definitely prefer steel and titanium.
delbiker1 is offline  
Old 05-31-21, 06:38 PM
  #2  
Crankycrank
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 2,968
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 621 Post(s)
Liked 569 Times in 435 Posts
I'm with you there. Personally I would try to avoid bikes with internal cabling if I were on the market for a new bike. I know many people love it for the clean and clutter free looks but functionally it's usually not as good and a PITA to maintain. Just my humble opinion and vote to the mfrs.

Last edited by Crankycrank; 05-31-21 at 11:27 PM.
Crankycrank is offline  
Likes For Crankycrank:
Old 06-05-21, 05:04 PM
  #3  
oldbobcat
Senior Member
 
oldbobcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Boulder County, CO
Posts: 3,456

Bikes: '79 Gios, '80 Masi, '06 Felt, early '60s Frejus

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 163 Post(s)
Liked 123 Times in 92 Posts
Two invaluable tools for routing internal cables are a plastic "cable liner" tubing for feeding the cable from one end to the other, and an old spoke for hooking the cable end and pulling it through the hole in the frame.
oldbobcat is offline  
Old 06-05-21, 05:32 PM
  #4  
vane171
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 490
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 252 Post(s)
Liked 66 Times in 48 Posts
That 'incorrect shifting' would be the RD only of both? In my non-expert guess, could the problem be in BB area? That strikes me as the one most critical spot. Perhaps it wasn't routed right in there when the bike was assembled, as unlikely as it may sound? Maybe you need to remove BB and see how it is routed in there?

I have secondhand bike CF 2007 Trek with internal cables. Suppose one day I may need to replace the cables, can that be done by somehow connecting the new cable to the old one and pull it through like with a 'fishing wire' that electricians use? That would need to be started at the bars end, sniping off the crimped on whatever that is and somehow making a smooth connection, one that would fit through the outer cabling...

Or perhaps one is supposed to replace the cable along with the outer cover that it is sliding in? Or does that 'bowden' cover continue through the frame, so one can push the cable in till it comes on the other side?

Last edited by vane171; 06-05-21 at 05:40 PM.
vane171 is offline  
Old 06-05-21, 06:04 PM
  #5  
Bigbus
Very Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Always on the Run
Posts: 1,211

Bikes: Giant Quasar & Fuji Roubaix

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 413 Post(s)
Liked 341 Times in 242 Posts
Originally Posted by vane171 View Post
That 'incorrect shifting' would be the RD only of both? In my non-expert guess, could the problem be in BB area? That strikes me as the one most critical spot. Perhaps it wasn't routed right in there when the bike was assembled, as unlikely as it may sound? Maybe you need to remove BB and see how it is routed in there?

I have secondhand bike CF 2007 Trek with internal cables. Suppose one day I may need to replace the cables, can that be done by somehow connecting the new cable to the old one and pull it through like with a 'fishing wire' that electricians use? That would need to be started at the bars end, sniping off the crimped on whatever that is and somehow making a smooth connection, one that would fit through the outer cabling...

Or perhaps one is supposed to replace the cable along with the outer cover that it is sliding in? Or does that 'bowden' cover continue through the frame, so one can push the cable in till it comes on the other side?
I replaced the cables on my Fuji shortly after I got it and I found by connecting the new cable to the old cable with some tape actually worked to pull the new through. I now keep a length of micro sleeve handy that I can slide over the old cable before pulling it out and then slide the new cable into the micro sleeve. Theoretically. If all else fails, a magnet will find the cable too and guide it out the exit hole. Hopefully I never have a problem with it kinking in the BB housing. I don't want to have to pull the BB just to replace cables. Good luck,
Bigbus is offline  
Old 06-05-21, 06:24 PM
  #6  
CliffordK
Senior Member
 
CliffordK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Posts: 26,887
Mentioned: 213 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15736 Post(s)
Liked 3,160 Times in 2,353 Posts
Originally Posted by Bigbus View Post
Theoretically. If all else fails, a magnet will find the cable too and guide it out the exit hole.
Probably works best if he frame is not steel.

I'm seeing some 2mm x 5mm or 2mm x 10mm Neodymium cylinders on E-Bay.

Glue to a string, and fish for your guide cable. Cable first, then housing.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/333227698640
https://www.ebay.com/itm/254939933200

I haven't needed to run internal cables, but in many cases I see frames supplied with a chunk of old housing.
Feed cable through new housing + old housing. Maybe a small amount of tape, and pull the new housing through with the old. If the cable is long enough to go through both housings, there won't be any chance of loosing the housing, and you might not even need the tape.

Many bikes have an access panel for tight places such as around the bottom bracket.
CliffordK is offline  
Old 06-05-21, 06:30 PM
  #7  
Bigbus
Very Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Always on the Run
Posts: 1,211

Bikes: Giant Quasar & Fuji Roubaix

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 413 Post(s)
Liked 341 Times in 242 Posts
Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
Probably works best if he frame is not steel.

I'm seeing some 2mm x 5mm or 2mm x 10mm Neodymium cylinders on E-Bay.

Glue to a string, and fish for your guide cable. Cable first, then housing.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/333227698640
https://www.ebay.com/itm/254939933200

I haven't needed to run internal cables, but in many cases I see frames supplied with a chunk of old housing.
Feed cable through new housing + old housing. Maybe a small amount of tape, and pull the new housing through with the old. If the cable is long enough to go through both housings, there won't be any chance of loosing the housing, and you might not even need the tape.

Many bikes have an access panel for tight places such as around the bottom bracket.
My Fuji doesn't have housing inside the frame and normal cable housing won't fit through the port holes, but the micro sleeve does. I plan to push the micro sleeve over the old cable and then insert the new, so yes, no more taping and fretting.

Last edited by Bigbus; 06-05-21 at 06:35 PM.
Bigbus is offline  
Old 06-06-21, 03:30 AM
  #8  
TiHabanero
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,812
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1424 Post(s)
Liked 854 Times in 455 Posts
"Many bikes have an access panel for tight places such as around the bottom bracket."

Have a Focus in the shop that does not have this feature. I have to replace brake hose to the rear and it is going to suck getting the new hose around the BB. Real nice forethought, Focus.
TiHabanero is offline  
Old 06-06-21, 04:34 AM
  #9  
ARider2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 507
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 68 Post(s)
Liked 86 Times in 64 Posts
Originally Posted by TiHabanero View Post
"Many bikes have an access panel for tight places such as around the bottom bracket."

Have a Focus in the shop that does not have this feature. I have to replace brake hose to the rear and it is going to suck getting the new hose around the BB. Real nice forethought, Focus.
I imagine it might be easier to remove the BB so you will have access to fish the hose. I always use a strong duct tape and attach the hose to the old hose and then pull the old hose out while pushing the new hose through. By pulling with the old hose while pushing with the new hose I am able to fish the new hose through.
ARider2 is offline  
Old 06-06-21, 04:36 AM
  #10  
delbiker1 
Mother Nature's Son
Thread Starter
 
delbiker1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Sussex County, Delaware
Posts: 2,444

Bikes: Early 90's Ochsner road, 2006 Schwinn SS DBX, 2014 Orbea Avant MD30, 2004 Airborne Zeppelin TI, 2003 Lemond Poprad, 1989? Fuji Ace, 2001 Lemond Tourmalet, 2014? Soma Smoothie

Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 646 Post(s)
Liked 896 Times in 518 Posts
It looks like I am going to have to replace the micro sleeves for the gear cables to get precise shifting. Highly likely I will have to pull the press fit BB to get it routed properly. I am going to have to research that as I have not done that before, nor do I have the proper tools. I am going back to the "sell it as it is" way of thinking.
delbiker1 is offline  
Old 06-06-21, 01:12 PM
  #11  
icemilkcoffee 
Senior Member
 
icemilkcoffee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,184
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 699 Post(s)
Liked 542 Times in 329 Posts
The 5700 was one of Shimano's earlier attempts at an under-the-bar-tape shift cable routing, and it was always slightly vague in shift feel.
You should have tried the 4700 Tiagra, which has different pull ratios supposedly to improve shifting for these under-bar-tape shifters.
icemilkcoffee is offline  
Old 06-06-21, 09:40 PM
  #12  
vane171
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 490
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 252 Post(s)
Liked 66 Times in 48 Posts
Originally Posted by Bigbus View Post
I replaced the cables on my Fuji shortly after I got it and I found by connecting the new cable to the old cable with some tape actually worked to pull the new through. I now keep a length of micro sleeve handy that I can slide over the old cable before pulling it out and then slide the new cable into the micro sleeve. Theoretically. If all else fails, a magnet will find the cable too and guide it out the exit hole. Hopefully I never have a problem with it kinking in the BB housing. I don't want to have to pull the BB just to replace cables. Good luck,
I am lucky in that my BB is threaded and I have already replaced it because the one that came with the bike had some friction in DS bearing (meaning I have the wrench and know how).

Don't know what micro sleeve is but probably a connection with a shrink tubing should do the trick, maybe with some glue inside it, especially with simultaneous pushing while pulling. Thx, good idea.

Aah, after reading it again, you mean some 'bike length' of small tube...
vane171 is offline  
Likes For vane171:
Old 06-06-21, 09:48 PM
  #13  
Bigbus
Very Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Always on the Run
Posts: 1,211

Bikes: Giant Quasar & Fuji Roubaix

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 413 Post(s)
Liked 341 Times in 242 Posts
Originally Posted by vane171 View Post
I am lucky in that my BB is threaded and I have already replaced it because the one that came with the bike had some friction in DS bearing (meaning I have the wrench and know how).

Don't know what micro sleeve is but probably a connection with a shrink tubing should do the trick, maybe with some glue inside it, especially with simultaneous pushing while pulling. Thx, good idea.

Aah, after reading it again, you mean some 'bike length' of small tube...
Yeah, the micro sleeve even comes with some kind of lube in it so the cables slide inside it easier and it's so small in diameter that it will fit inside regular cable housing also. I got 10 meters of the stuff from ebay for less than 3 bucks and have found all kinds of uses for it.
Bigbus is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.